I was finally able to ride the Durango and Silverton Narrow Gauge RR. Although I have ridden on steam powered trains at Disneyland and Disney World, I had never ridden one from Point A to Point B. My ride on this famus railroad was the down train from Silverton to Durango, my tour bus dropped us off in Silverton and picked us up 3 1/2 hours later in Durango. We rode one of the covered Gondolas and although it was cool (there had been snow on the trip over the Million Dollar highway from Ouray to Silverton, in the high country) all of the people on my bus tour stayed in this car for the majority of the trip. Two cars towards the front was the commissary car, so hot chocolate was available to warm us up. Having ridden this train now, I would recommend the up train from Durango to Silverton as the engine has to work harder in this direction. The only time I heard the locomotive work was climbing up to the Highline, before Rockwood. My loco was a K-36, number 486. I belive all of the locomotives in use on the D&S line are Mikado 2-8-2s. We were able to visit the museum in 1/2 of the roundhouse at Durango. There was a large HO and HOn3 layout in the museum along with a Mike from the D&RGW and a consolidation from the RGS. The day before we had driven by Idaho Springs, Georgetown and Silver Plume and the Georgetown Loop Railway and I saw a narrow gauge Shay ldling waiting to go over the loop. We also passed the Argo Mill, which seems to still be in use, or at least it has been restored to look like it is in use.
I enjoyed this part of my Bus Tour very much. If you haven't done this before, I highly recommend a trip to this part of Colorado to do so. You will find the San Jaun Mountains to be some of the most beautiful mountains in the USA.
NP 2626 "Northern Pacific, really terrific"
Northern Pacific Railway Historical Association: http://www.nprha.org/
Nice! Sounds like a fun trip. I haven't had a chance to take a ride on the D&S and I live in Colorado. I really need to get down there.
Michael
CEO- Mile-HI-RailroadPrototype: D&RGW Moffat Line 1989
It sounds like an enjoyable trip was had. Yeah, weird as it seems, the eastbound (southbound by compass direction) ruling grade on the Silverton is something like 1.7% up through the High Line.
I really enjoy taking the train from Silverton to Durango, stay overnight there, then return on the next morning's train to Silverton. My wife and I have done this before. It works great if you've been camping around Silverton, as you have time to break camp and get to Silverton to take any of the afternoon returns. We just left the truck parked at the station in Silverton after alerting the stationmaster it was ours. This way, you get a nice hot shower to cleanup and a night on the town, then can get back to the wilderness the next day. Try not to stay in the woods too long before you do this, for the benefit of your fellow travelers....
Another recommendation for both the D&S and C&TS is to spring the extra $$ for a parlor car upgrade. You get a nice platform to take pics from, great personal service, drinks and snacks, and often both the hardcore fans and world travelers who don't know much about RRs but could afford the upgrade. I've had wonderful experiences each time I've done this.
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
By coincidence, I travelled the D&S from Silverton to Durango two weeks ago. Here are two pictures of old 482 that was on our run'
Marty C
My tour guide has an interest in the Narrow Gauge trains in Colorado and New Mexico. I told him about the Narrow Gage Circle and that the small town of Ouray was served by narrow gauge railroad. At the time I started telling him this, I thought the train ran between Silverton and Ouray. Further investigation and a trip up to Ouray revealed this to be incorrect. The connection between Silverton and Ouray was the Million Dollar Highway and Otto Mears project that ran through what I thought looked like some of the most mined country I have ever seen and a very unfriendly railroad route. The Rio Grande Southern linked up with the D&RGW Branch to Silverton, coming from Delores Colorado running through Rico, the Ophur Loop, Sawpit, Placerville and connected up with the D&RGW at Ridgeway.
The day we left Durango, the bus made a stop in Chama New Mexico, to eat lunch at the High Country Saloon, much to my chagrin, wed did not go into town to see the Cumbres & Toltec Scenic RR, another section of the Narrow Gauge Circle. I guess you just need leave things to see and do, the next trip!
I just noticed that the title I came up with for this thread was "Durango & Silverton"! Is there a way to EDIT the title? It's amazing at how easily I can screw things up!
Mark,
You should be able to Edit You're title....I have done it before. Do it on Your original post.
You created it.
Take Care!
Frank
Thanks Frank, that is how to fix it!
NP2626At the time I started telling him this, I thought the train ran between Silverton and Ouray. Further investigation and a trip up to Ouray revealed this to be incorrect. The connection between Silverton and Ouray was the Million Dollar Highway and Otto Mears project that ran through what I thought looked like some of the most mined country I have ever seen and a very unfriendly railroad route.
Yes, a very unfriendly RR route. But imagine how spectacular it could have been!
Otto Mears, who built many of the early toll roads (Highway 550 was one of his routes originally) and followed that by building RRs on their ROWs including the RGS, actually contemplated building an electrified, cog railway to go from the north end of his Silverton RR in Ironton to Ouray, where it would've connected with the Rio Grande.
If Otto had only been 20 years younger and the US gov't had kept buying silver, it very well could've happened. As it is, it could make a spectacular cog railway layout that is almost pure fantasy, except for the fact it does have a small bit of historical basis. Think Bemo (HOm) equipment repainted and floor to ceiling scenery
Glad you enjoyed the trip. The museum in Durango is really great I think.
Nice pics by the way.
The Argo Mill in Idaho Springs is not in operation. However, its is a museum and open for tours.
If you get a chance on your next visit to Silverton, the Mayflour Mill east of Silverton is a great tour. Its pretty much left as it was when it shut down in the 1990s. Then there is the Hundred Dollar mine further up the Animas Valley. You go way back underground in that one. I think these might only be open during the tourist season.
A visit to Chama New Mexico might next be in order?
Hi,
I've ridden the D&S (round trip) twice, and the Cumbres & Toltec twice as well. Both are "must dos" for the RR enthusiast. The D&S has the "prettier" trains and out of this world scenery. The C&T, is more of the feeling of a working RR, and the frills are fewer. You can't go wrong with either.
BTW, if you want a real thrill, drive the highway thru Ouray. The "million dollar highway" will definitely push the adrenaline to new heights, and will test your nerve and skills (I drove it in a misting rain). Sadly, I didn't get any pics cause I was too busy, and my co-pilot was too scared.............
ENJOY !
Mobilman44
Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central
mobilman44The D&S has the "prettier" trains and out of this world scenery. The C&T, is more of the feeling of a working RR, and the frills are fewer. You can't go wrong with either.
There's also another big difference. The D&S station and shops in Durango are located smack-dab in the middle of a busy urban area -- as urban as the Four Corners gets anyway. Thus, the facilities are fenced and secured and those on the grounds beyond the station are normally under escort (can't remember if the museum is free-range or not).
Chama's facilities are located in a very rural community. Unlike the realtively compact Durango terminal, they sprawl for more than a mile through town. While some security improvements have been made in recent years, they are low key and much of the area remains unfenced. I beleive you're still permitted to wander the grounds on your own, simply staying out of buildings and not climbing on equipment.
While it's hard to beat the ride on the Silverton or the great facilities in towns at both ends, Chama is hard to beat for the "kid loose in the RR candy store" feeling with your cameras as you walk and discover all sorts of stuff. The ride is right up there with the D&S, but the after hours fun of wandering around the yards is wondorous at Chama.
I have ridden the D & S twice, both round trips, and the CT & S once.
Enjoyed them both. As stated, the CT &S is less "touristy" and Chama seems much as it was in early days.
I've been over Red Mountain by car and by motorcycle. Now that was a ride! The Georgetown Loop is a short but fun ride, worth any RR's time.
Gale
I have taken the ride from Durango to Silverton and back 40 years ago, when the line was still owned and operated by the D&RGW. This ride was the absolute highlight of my farewell sightseeing trip through most of the western states at the end of my year as an exchange student on Bainbridge Island, WA.
This trip took me down the coast of Washington State and Oregon, following US Highway 101 all the way into Northern California, down to Nevada, through New Mexico, Colorado, Utah, Wyoming, Montana, Idaho and back to my "home for a year". Even after 40 years, I still remember each day of it. What an adventure for a barely 18 year old with a driver´s license still wet from the printing! Grand Canyon, Yellowstone, the lights of Reno and Las Vegas and then - Durango to Silverton - breathtaking!
Do you folks know in how beautiful a country you live?
Sir MadogDo you folks know in how beautiful a country you live?
Ulrich,
I think most of us have an idea about its breadth and beauty...all those cowboy movies, you know. But I think there are far too many who haven't really experienced it. I was fortunate, my dad was in the Air Force back then, we were station several places out West, and Mom and Dad both liked to see places and make sure we knew about them. I saw much of what you did but based out of Arizona and Texas. I'd sure like to get to see more of the Northwest, though my cloesest so far is Boise, Idaho. Gotta get to Portland to see my father-in-law's old command, the USS Blueback.
Part of the reason why more Americans aren't as familiar as they could be is that we just don't take vacations like the Europeans. A lot of time it's the finanicial pressures. I always took all of mine. There's even a parody commercial that's been running on Saturday Night Live about a childrens movement to get their parents to take vacation and take them somewhere, they're bored. At least I think it's a parody. It very well could be real.
Mike - I don´t want to hi-jack this thread, but now, being unable to travel for health and financial reasons, I live from the memories I have from those travels and tours which I was able to do in my younger years. For many years in the past century, Germans were known to be the #1 travellers, only recently overtaken by the Japanese and now the Chinese. Wherever you´d go, you´d bump into Germans. In the 1940´s all those travels were organized by "Adolf-Tours" and rather involuntary relocations, but the habit remained in more peaceful terms.
Although, back in 1974, travelling to the US was still an expensive venue, I met Germans also on that trail from Durango to Silverton. 4 years later, I went to Oahu, only to find out, that Waikiki Beach was populated by my countrymen and -women. How awful!
Sir Madog I have taken the ride from Durango to Silverton and back 40 years ago, when the line was still owned and operated by the D&RGW. This ride was the absolute highlight of my farewell sightseeing trip through most of the western states at the end of my year as an exchange student on Bainbridge Island, WA. This trip took me down the coast of Washington State and Oregon, following US Highway 101 all the way into Northern California, down to Nevada, through New Mexico, Colorado, Utah, Wyoming, Montana, Idaho and back to my "home for a year". Even after 40 years, I still remember each day of it. What an adventure for a barely 18 year old with a driver´s license still wet from the printing! Grand Canyon, Yellowstone, the lights of Reno and Las Vegas and then - Durango to Silverton - breathtaking! Do you folks know in how beautiful a country you live?
The United States is a beautiful country, and we have a lot of different sights. Hawaii (the Big Island) has nine out of the eleven climate zones. The mountains of West Virgina are wonderful. There is the Grand Canyon (I have seen it from a plane, but not from the ground yet). California has excellent scenery. And probably the most pristine state, the last frontier, Alaska (have not been there yet).
I have been to Germany, and it is also a beautiful country. The natural beauty, and the ancient architecture is amazing.
Hi again,
When I rode the C&Trr, we stayed in Chama a couple miles from the loco facilities. As Mike said, they were pretty open and you could wander thru them and actually walk on tracks and touch the ancient cars.
The ride was a real "go back in time" event, and when going up grades you felt the loco(s) with their "I think I can" chuffing.
Riding the D&S was more a touristry thing, with the scenery second to none.
As the original poster of this thread, I have no problem with whatever meandering direction it may take. I spent 2 years in Germany (Deutschland) on the Government plan and look back with the fondest of memories of your wonderful country Sir Madog! How wonderful it was to return there, even if it was only for a few days last summer and am considering a tour next fall to southern Germany (where I was stationed).
I may have visited the Grand Canyon when very young and so, do not remember doing so. However, the wife and I spent two wonderful days there last fall and have to say seeing this wonderful place rates as one of the highest on my bucket list and to anyone who hasn’t seen it, I have to say you must, as for certain, I will be returning! There are things to do and places to see in our own states here in the U.S. that never seem to get done.
NP2626 - that trip from Durango to Silverton kindled my interest in narrow gauge model railroading. I remember how impressed I was by those K-36´s being bigger than the standard gauge locos I was used to from my country!
Yes, I've bumped into German's several times in Colorado on my travels. Talked with a very interesting German fellow and his son the last D&S parlor car I rode, an example of the fascinating folks you get to know if you upgrade your ticket for that. Another time, I was four-wheeling over one of the more scenic passes with my brother and some friends and had a long chat with a German on his bike up there (11,000+ feet high).
Of course, this was all in English. I had a working command of German when I was young, as I also had the opportunity at Uncle Sam's expense to live there during my high school years when dad was stationed there.
NP2626 We visited Mesa Verde and saw a few of the Ancestral Puebloan dwellings there, visited Los Alamos National laboratory, Santa Fe N.M., Ancestral Puebloan ruins at Aztec New Mexico and the Balloon Fiesta in Albuquerque, among many other things we did.
We visited Mesa Verde and saw a few of the Ancestral Puebloan dwellings there, visited Los Alamos National laboratory, Santa Fe N.M., Ancestral Puebloan ruins at Aztec New Mexico and the Balloon Fiesta in Albuquerque, among many other things we did.
Hey you were in Aztec! And didnt come by to say Hi!
One time we went to the Aztec Ruins in December when there was a luminaria display set up. It was real beutiful with a little light snow and all the flickering candle light along the walls and windows.
mobilman44Sadly, I didn't get any pics cause I was too busy, and my co-pilot was too scared.............
It's okay MM44. I was right behind you and got some pic's of you and the wife.
In all seriousness, I can't wait to start exploring more of North America and traveling in general. I have been in more States than I haven't and I really like hearing about trips like these. It helps with the planning.
Brent
"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."
Brent's post reminded me about this excellent website by Mark Evans. If you can't be there in person, it's the next best thing:
http://www.narrowgauge.org/
Its nice to hear all the positives about our little part of planet earth. enjoy!
Related to the old D&RGW locos and now what remains on the CT&S and the D&S. They never really ran any steam other than mikes as the older consols couldn't pull the bigger traffic without multi-heading. Some snow plow relief trans in the early 1900's were quintenary headed consols! All the C-class consols were cool. Only about 2 remain working though, I think. My favorite is the C-25 which was their only C-25 and was, I think, their only outside frame consol obtained from another abandoned N.G.road. Naturally, any brass C-25 in any modeling scale is now a great rarity, yet the old $39.95 die-cast MDC HOn3 consol kit sold in quantity for some time was a C-25.
The only NG specific, factory ordered and delivered mikes were the K-27 and K-28 which were the most beautiful of all the mikes on the D&RGW. They were the only ones that got and retained loving nicknames. K-27 "mudhen" and the K-28 "sports model". You would be hard pressed to find a more lovable and lovely NG loco than the K-28 with its distinctive, off- center, smokebox mounted air-pump.
The other two mike class locos, the K-36 and K-37, are larger and a bit more powerful. The K-36 is a NG loco but just looks too standard gauge, yet has some personality to it. The k-37 is just a full size standard gauge loco that was converted to NG. It was a work horse, of course, but ugh....... All the K- class mikes used on the D&RGW are outside frame and that is their true charm. Soon all the K-series and, that lone C-19 consol will be made in profusion by Blackstone. For those looking to enter the NG MR circle, this will be your chance to get fine locos without undue searching out of old brass in less than runable condition at high prices.
I am planning a trip back to Colorado and exploring the route along the San Miquel river from Placerville to Paradox where my free lance road would have been. I'll stop and chat with the locals in Nautrita and Nucla. Next, I'll tool up to the remediated Uravan, as well.
While in Colorado, I hope to ride both N.G. roads. and hopefully pet the two k-28's, which may not be in full service. I haven't heard much about them lately. Restoration? Static Museum pieces? I hope not.
Richard
If I can't fix it, I can fix it so it can't be fixed
-E-C-Mills NP2626 We visited Mesa Verde and saw a few of the Ancestral Puebloan dwellings there, visited Los Alamos National laboratory, Santa Fe N.M., Ancestral Puebloan ruins at Aztec New Mexico and the Balloon Fiesta in Albuquerque, among many other things we did. Hey you were in Aztec! And didnt come by to say Hi! One time we went to the Aztec Ruins in December when there was a luminaria display set up. It was real beutiful with a little light snow and all the flickering candle light along the walls and windows.
Darn, and that would have been fun for me! I don't know what the other 27 people on the bus would have done while we talked trains; but, it would have been fun! Maybe next time, when I drive to South Westerm Colorado we can meet-up.
This is fun.
Guess I will through in my two cents.
My wife and I have driven out west quite a few times. This time we went through Colorado springs and down to Dorango. We took the trip to Silverton and back. we drove north thorough Ouray and up to George Town loop. absolutely one of the best trips we have ever taken. Enjoy
Lee
#481 on the way to Silverton. Watch that second step, it's a long one.
#481 at silverton.
Silver car on the way up.
They had a mud slide short time earlyer.
Yankee Flyer, your top photo is as dramatic a picture as you can get on the D&S! It looks like it is almost 400 feet straight down to the Animas River from that car step! I asked the conductor about a grade up to the Highline while heading south from Silverton to Durango. He confirmed that the train does climb from the last bridge crossing the Animas River before the Highline, going southbound. This was the only time I heard #486 working on the trip.
I have spent quite a bit of time in Northwestern Wyoming near Cody & Yellowstone and love that area. We drove through the Wind River Canyon last fall and over Raton Pass from Colorado into New Mexico. I spent a week in Snow Mass Skiing; but, this trip was the most exploring of Colorado and New Mexico I have ever done and I have to say I love these states, too, now! I have also spent some time in the Alps in Germany, Austria and Switzerland and I think the San Juans are the USA's Alps and I want to spend more time there, God willing!
BATMAN mobilman44 Sadly, I didn't get any pics cause I was too busy, and my co-pilot was too scared............. It's okay MM44. I was right behind you and got some pic's of you and the wife. In all seriousness, I can't wait to start exploring more of North America and traveling in general. I have been in more States than I haven't and I really like hearing about trips like these. It helps with the planning.
mobilman44 Sadly, I didn't get any pics cause I was too busy, and my co-pilot was too scared.............
What if the horse were to get spooked?
Suppose there is a rock slide up ahead?
How do you turn that buggy around?
Yikes.
This photo gives me nightmares.
Rich
Alton Junction