Painting PRR Diesels

[Folcroft Don]

I want to begin air brushing a collection of diesel shells with PRR paont schemes.  My local hobby shop doesn't know very much about the new paint productrs they sell.  They got rid of the Floquil line and are now stocking Testors.  Can anyone advise me on what brand/colors of paint to shop for to do GG1s and GPs in the PRR schemes?   Also, any tips about buyin the right kind of air brush.  Folcroft Don

[nedthomas]

You say they got rid of the Floquil line and stock Testors. What Testors line are the stocking ? Floquil is owned by Testors. Polly Scale, Pactra and Model Master are other lines owned by Testors. Floquil is mostly RR colors.

[gandydancer19]

 

Welcome to the Forums. 

I will address your airbrush question first.

I like an internal gravity feed airbrush best. The internal mix seems to give me a finer spray pattern and better paint atomization. The gravity feed allows the paint to flow into the paint chamber on its own rather than being pulled in. And I also think that a gravity feed airbrush is easier to clean.

You should decide on what type of paints that you will use and stick to them. Either by brand or by type. I favor Acrylic paints and use both Polly Scale and Badger Model Flex.

As to PRR colors. The PRR used a color known as Brunswick green on most of its diesel and electric locomotives. (You should do some research to make sure.) It is basically black with some green added to it. If I remember correctly, it was one gallon of green to five gallons of black. Now having said that, what the paint, or color of the locomotive is after it is painted is more important that using the correct mixing ratio. It just so happens that I just got through painting a T1. What I used was Polly Scale Brunswick green with some Reading Green added to it. The Brunswick green right out of the bottle looked black to me after I painted the loco. When seen in normal light, Brunswick green should look black with a green tint to it. So I added some green to it. Brunswick green is one of those colors that you are going to have to experiment with and is always subjective to the viewer.

[tstage]

Don,

You may want to visit the PRR Technical & Historical Society web site.  They have a whole slew of information on there and accurate paint matching is also part of it.  Here's a link that should help.

Even though I'm a NYC fan and modeler, the PRRT&HS has done a terrific job making prototype information available to PRR modelers and fans.

Tom

[BroadwayLion]

LIONS are seldom that fussy about exact colors. Out in the wild they tend to vary a little depending on what shop and what year the equipment was painted. True, PRR was probably a bit more fussy about such things than other railroads, but what the heck: Paint Fades.

LION would recommend buying water soluble paints over oil based. That said, him doesn't use an air brush anyway.

 

ROAR

[BRAKIE]

The best results for PRR freight engines is weathered black  with 2-3 drops of PRR green.

[JimValle]

My choice for airbrushing PRR diesels would be Scalecoat Brunswick Green and Tuscan Red.  Scalecoat paints dry with a hard gloss that can accept decals and with PRR diesels you are going to apply lots of decals.  After you have done your decals you can tone down the gloss with dullcoat and then do some weathering if you like that look.  After Brunswick Green  got old and weathered on the prototype most of the green disappeared and the engine just looked dull black under dirt and grime.  The PRR adopted Tuscan Red for passenger diesels sometime after 1950  so you might consider using that color on some of your equipment.  There's a lot of speculation concerning how the PRR created Brunswick Green.  One old shopman claimed that they took a 55 gallon drum of locomotive black and mixed in several scoops of yellow pigment.  Since this method was rather imprecise, no two batches of paint were ever quite the same. 

[dti406]

Even though the paint companies call it Brunswick Green, most Pennsy modelers refer to the color as DGLE (Dark Green Locomotive Enamel).

For diesels the carbody is painted DGLE while the pilot, frame, sill, fuel tank and trucks are painted black.

Rick J

[jwhitten]

gandydancer19

When seen in normal light, Brunswick green should look black with a green tint to it. So I added some green to it. Brunswick green is one of those colors that you are going to have to experiment with and is always subjective to the viewer.

 

Yup, that's good advice 'cause you know, one man's green...

... is another gal's pink!

 

John

[CavalryTrooper143]

Tru Color paints, makes a very close DGLE (Dark Green Locomotive Enamel), also known as Brunswick Green. On the PRR, the color a locomotive was painted was determined by two primary factors. When (IE era) is it being painted, and what will it's primary service be, IE freight, passenger, dual service, etc. Passenger locomotives were commonly painted in the same color (Tuscan Red) as passenger equipment, if that was their primary service. Dual service, and Freight locomotives were painted in DGLE. Some GG1s, that were set up for dual service were DGLE. Those primarily intended to haul passenger trains would have been Tuscan red. When the first streamlined cars arrived, one GG1 (perhaps others) were painted silver to match their trains. So, you need to decide what era you are painting for, what service you are painting for, and on both electrics, and diesels, you may need to apply pin stripping, and other garnishes to the scheme. Hope this helps.

[AntonioFP45]

Good post Jim! 

My preference for dark railroad colors, such as PRR Brunswick Green, has been Scale Coat's paint products. Excellent quality that, when thinned properly, lays on the surface with a very smooth, wet appearance that cures to a hard finish. MIcroscale decals lay on it without a hitch. I then seal them with a quality semi-gloss or flat clear from either Alclad or Testors (never dull cote). 

With that said, prototype color appearances change considerably with age and natural weathering. With Scale Coat's darker finishes, including the BG, I've found that tinting them with colors such as blacks, dark browns, and dark grays helps achieve aged appearances.  To do this (using small measuring cups) I create 2 to 3 mixes, using the colors I mentioned for tinting (I write down how much tint I add to each cup). Then air brush them on to small plastic swatches. I view them in natural outdoor lighting and pick the one that, to me, looks the best. I have fun with this and don't get too picky about it.  

  

JimValle

My choice for airbrushing PRR diesels would be Scalecoat Brunswick Green and Tuscan Red.  Scalecoat paints dry with a hard gloss that can accept decals and with PRR diesels you are going to apply lots of decals.  After you have done your decals you can tone down the gloss with dullcoat and then do some weathering if you like that look.  After Brunswick Green  got old and weathered on the prototype most of the green disappeared and the engine just looked dull black under dirt and grime.  The PRR adopted Tuscan Red for passenger diesels sometime after 1950  so you might consider using that color on some of your equipment.  There's a lot of speculation concerning how the PRR created Brunswick Green.  One old shopman claimed that they took a 55 gallon drum of locomotive black and mixed in several scoops of yellow pigment.  Since this method was rather imprecise, no two batches of paint were ever quite the same. 

 

[CavalryTrooper143]

 

Just remember that the PRR adopted DGLE as the standard color for locomotives in the late 1860s (Post ACW), and it remained the primary loco paint until 1968.  As such, it was never an exact color.  As paint technology improved, so to did consistancy of batches of paint.  Therefore, the later in the life of the PRR, the more uniform the DGLE, and thusly, the more uniform the color of the fleet.

As an example, back during steam days, some smaller shops, in an effort to save on the expensive (realatively speaking) DGLE, would not paint the cab roof, and tender deck, leaving them primer red.  

I have seen two pictures of FF2s from overhead in the first two years of PRR service, and their rooves were not DGLE either.  Later, they were painted.  While I have never heard an "official" explanation, the rumor has been that those two locos, were in poorer shape than the rest, so not expected to survive.  After two years of service, and proper periodic maintenence, they were expected to suvive, so got a full paint job.

My point is, you can not make any hard, and fast rules when it comes to painting locomotives for the "Standard Railroad of the World", other than they mostly were DGLE, or a variation thereof, AND, the later in the PRR you go, the more consistent the shade of DGLE got.  Later batches of DGLE, mid 50s on, were formulated to be less likely to fade, but at the same time, locomotives were less likely to be cleaned, and the ones that were, were rarely cleaned fully, so what might appears as faded DGLE, is more likely poorly cleaned DGLE, than it is faded.

 

Horse

 

 

[BRAKIE]

Here is your DGLE after a few months in service.

 

[CavalryTrooper143]

BRAKIE

Here is your DGLE after a few months in service.

 

 

 

Quite so!  Covered in dirt, and road grime, not faded.

 

 

[BRAKIE]

CavalryTrooper143

Quite so! Covered in dirt, and road grime, not faded.

The photo doesn't show it the paint was fading.

The sad part those GP35S and GP30 was shiny new less then two years ago when thay photo was taken.

Notice the hump rider? His job would end in  about a year after this photo was taken.

[mlehman]

I came across a new Rust-Oleum sray paint color and picked up a can. It's called 214086  "Charleston Green" (UPC 20066 13184). Probably not quite as dark as DGLE, it might be suitable for many indoor lighting situations.  I haven't shot any yet, but am looking forward to seeing how close it is to DGLE.              

[SouthPenn]

A while back I read how the PRR made their Brunswick Green.

Start with a 55 gallon drum of black. Add one gallon of dark green. Mix well.   

[dti406]

SouthPenn

A while back I read how the PRR made their Brunswick Green.

Start with a 55 gallon drum of black. Add one gallon of dark green. Mix well.   

According to some sources it was a handfull of yellow chromate poweder added to 5 gallons of black paint to produce the verry dark green color.

Rick Jesionowski

[CavalryTrooper143]

I think we can all agree that DGLE is a very dark green. How green, vs how black are great debates, but the end result is, you, the modeler has to be happy, and satisfied with the end result on your models. If you are, all other considerations are irrelevent. As DTI406 points out: Rule 1: This is my railroad. Rule 2: I make the rules. Rule 3: Illuminating discussion of prototype history, equipment and operating practices is always welcome, but in the event of visitor-perceived anacronisms, detail descrepancies or operating errors, consult RULE 1!

[PRRT1MAN]

I would agree with others. I use only Scale Coat and I do like it. If you want to vari the color some you can add some weathering and then you have have a fresh out of the shop engine vs a used engine.

[rrinker]

 Someone said the Geep on display at Horseshoe Curve is pretty accurately painted. Or at least was. A bunch of years ago when I as last there (at least outside, to see the loco - I've since been there on the other side, riding Amtrak through there), it looks very much black, perhaps slightly metallic. Until you moved around so that the sun reflected off it, then you could see the green. That was some 14-15 years ago, sitting exposed to all weather it's probably a lot more faded now.

                                          --Randy