I have a P2K Walther's Lifelike HO GP-30 DCC Sound, 10 or more years old, that has a screeching problem in it's drive train. After the loco has run at higher speeds for a few minutes the screeching sound stops but begins again after the engine has been still for a little while. I've applied Labelle 102 to the spots I can reach without removing the metal 'body', the ends of the flywheel and motor...
and through holes in the bottom..
but it hasn't helped. The orange wire seen in the first photo running from beneath the decoder and is soldered to the bottom of the frame is preventing me from removing the metal gray body. At least I don't see a way to do it with cutting or desoldering the wire which I was hoping to avoid. Anyone have suggestions or recommendation or even good educated guesses as to what part of the drive train is causing the screech and how to get to it is appreciated.
I forgot to mention I did remove the covers to the axles at applied a spot of grease to all gears there.
Thanks,
Jarrell
My opinion is that you should cut the orange wire in midspan, and if you're up to it put a permanent plug-and-socket microconnector in there to allow unplugging and replugging any future time you work on the thing.
We had a recent report of a similar screech that as I recall was related to brushes in the motor. You are unlikely to fix that with that weight in place.
I've had old LL Proto diesels where the high-pitched 'screech' turned out to be from the well-known Life-Like cracked wheelset / gear problem. The metal axle spins inside the plastic gear, causing the whine. You can get replacement gears cheaply from Athearn, or spend a little more and get new wheelsets with gears from Walthers.
wjstix I've had old LL Proto diesels where the high-pitched 'screech' turned out to be from the well-known Life-Like cracked wheelset / gear problem. The metal axle spins inside the plastic gear, causing the whine. You can get replacement gears cheaply from Athearn, or spend a little more and get new wheelsets with gears from Walthers.
Rich
Alton Junction
Thanks for the reply. I had thought about cutting the orange wire but not about a microconnector. I don't know how big those are but there's not a lot of room to spare between the wire and did of the shell but I'll check it out.
Overmod My opinion is that you should cut the orange wire in midspan, and if you're up to it put a permanent plug-and-socket microconnector in there to allow unplugging and replugging any future time you work on the thing. We had a recent report of a similar screech that as I recall was related to brushes in the motor. You are unlikely to fix that with that weight in place.
Thank you Stix and Rich! I had not thought of the cracked gear problem even though I've replaced them on a P2K E6. I'll check them out. :)
Someone like Mel can coach you on the best alternative for this. I think there is enough room in the space between the motor and the weight to get something like a 1-pin small JEDEC to be taped.
If there isn't easy room, splice in about an inch with heat-shrink insulation to the 'bottom' end of the wire so the connector can sit on top.
I strongly suspect that the screeching is coming from the motor shaft bearings. They would only require a very small amount of plastic compatable oil.
I have had many of those old P2Ks GPs over the years. Those short wires and big weights do make it difficult to access the needed places. The noise is likely from the motor bearings having bits of ten year micro-stuff tucked away in odd places.
You asked for suggestions and I cannot give you this as a recommendation:
But I have fixed such unlocatable squeels by holding the holding the loco under the uncomfortbley hot water faucet...melting and flushing away all of the unseen bits in all of the moving parts as I rotated the loco in all directions. Keeping my hand cupped over the PC board (decoder) and to not get it dowsed.
It dried out just fine in a day....or quicker with blowing and a hair drier if for some reason its an emergency that you have to run the loco sooner.
I know what the experts will say about water and electronics, but the loco is just metal and plastic. It dries out just fine, and only the decoder needs to be bone dry, BTW.
I would run them and the noise disappeared. Then applied fresh, clean Labelle to a steamed cleaned and flushed 10 year old loco.
- Douglas
It could well be the motor. But, cracked gears remain a distinct possibility. I believe that the GP30 has been the greatest culprit of all of the P2K locos suffering from cracked gears over the years.
I've fixed several of these, and the noise disappears after the worm shaft bearings are replaced with Athearn bronze bearings. I seem to recall reading about a chemical analysis someone had done on the Life Like originals, which discovered they had a composition that repelled lubrication.
Rob Spangler
OvermodWe had a recent report of a similar screech —
For reference:
http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/88/t/289258.aspx
Cheers, Ed
Life-Like's old worm bearings will stick to a magnet; Athearn replacements do not. The motor bearings are also a prime screeching suspect.
Lastspikemike Cracked gears don't screech, they thunk or click.
Cracked gears don't screech, they thunk or click.
Here is a thread in which modelers can hear them squeal and squall.
http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/88/t/214230.aspx
The sound is in the ear of the beholder.
Look, we all agree that the bearings may be a prime suspect. But why rule out cracked gears?
I certainly thank everyone for your input and recommendations. I'll start with the cracked axle gear problem just to rule it out. I've had to replace those on other P2K products. If that's not it then I'll unsolder the wire, take the weight off and go from there.
Again, thanks for the help!
If it's not a gear, or motor bearings, it's the motor brushes.
I had a Bachmann Spectrum diesel that squealed like a pig in a bacon factory, and it was the motor brushes.
Ricky W.
HO scale Proto-freelancer.
My Railroad rules:
1: It's my railroad, my rules.
2: It's for having fun and enjoyment.
3: Any objections, consult above rules.
ricktrains4824 If it's not a gear, or motor bearings, it's the motor brushes. I had a Bachmann Spectrum diesel that squealed like a pig in a bacon factory, and it was the motor brushes.
ricktrains4824If it's not a gear, or motor bearings, it's the motor brushes.
Yes, I had that happen, too. Mentioned in the previous thread I linked to above.
My first take is "bad wheelset/gear". That's a quick check of course. Just pop the bottom covers and pull a wheel set and see if either wheel EASILY turns by itself. If so, its likely the source of the noise. I've had P2K GPs with all the wheelsets in need of replacement, some with only one or two, and a couple with all OK.
ENJOY !
Mobilman44
Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central
Not gears, the motor.
Years of crud. A good steam cleaning and flushing fixes them up.
I didn't even worry if it was dry or not. Blow off the big drops, then run em wet to speed up the drying process, LOL. Those P2Ks are nothing but plastic and metal.
Lastspikemike I had not thought of that. Thanks! Jarrell mobilman44 My first take is "bad wheelset/gear". That's a quick check of course. Just pop the bottom covers and pull a wheel set and see if either wheel EASILY turns by itself. If so, its likely the source of the noise. I've had P2K GPs with all the wheelsets in need of replacement, some with only one or two, and a couple with all OK. You can check for the axle twist without removing the gear covers (which can be a pita until you do a few and uncover the secret technique). Simply invert the locomotive and try to turn each drivewheel by hand. If any of them move without also moving the opposite wheel then the axle gear is cracked at the bush. The axles are not solid through the gear. They are half shafts.
I had not thought of that. Thanks!
mobilman44 My first take is "bad wheelset/gear". That's a quick check of course. Just pop the bottom covers and pull a wheel set and see if either wheel EASILY turns by itself. If so, its likely the source of the noise. I've had P2K GPs with all the wheelsets in need of replacement, some with only one or two, and a couple with all OK.
You can check for the axle twist without removing the gear covers (which can be a pita until you do a few and uncover the secret technique).
Simply invert the locomotive and try to turn each drivewheel by hand. If any of them move without also moving the opposite wheel then the axle gear is cracked at the bush. The axles are not solid through the gear. They are half shafts.
Lastspikemike mobilman44 My first take is "bad wheelset/gear". That's a quick check of course. Just pop the bottom covers and pull a wheel set and see if either wheel EASILY turns by itself. If so, its likely the source of the noise. I've had P2K GPs with all the wheelsets in need of replacement, some with only one or two, and a couple with all OK. You can check for the axle twist without removing the gear covers (which can be a pita until you do a few and uncover the secret technique). Simply invert the locomotive and try to turn each drivewheel by hand. If any of them move without also moving the opposite wheel then the axle gear is cracked at the bush. The axles are not solid through the gear. They are half shafts.