Painting locomotive shells: When to add detail parts?

[tstage]

I'm in the process of painting a Kato NW2 shell as a practice piece for another NYC locomotive project.  I'm using Tamiya TS-29 Semi-gloss black in a rattle can.  I used Tamiya paint on a diner project some years back and REALLY it because it sprays on thinly and evenly and dries to a uniform thickness.

My question has to do with when to add detailing - e.g. grab irons.  I cut out the molded front grille on the front of the hood and replaced it with a etched-metal NW2 grille, grille frame, and dual-fan unit from KV Models.  Here's what it looks like with the replacement parts glued in place and painted:

The parts for this particular hood are already off the sprue so I will have to paint them once they are glued in place.  My questions are:

When the parts come pre-attached to the sprue, is it better to spray paint them in that orientation then remove & glue them onto the shell after painting?  Or, is it always best to paint detail parts once they are already glued in place?

It seems to me that painting detail parts on the sprue would allow for more even coverage of the paint onto the parts.  I guess another option would be to hand paint the detail parts with a brush after they are glued in place.

Also, will decals adhere well to semi-gloss paint?  Or, do I need to spray a gloss finish over the semi-gloss before applying any decals?

Thanks for the help and insight...

Tom

[7j43k]

Tom,

You've summed up the "debate" about painting small parts pretty well.  I prefer to have the parts on the model before painting because handling small parts after they're painted can damage the paint.   BUT not if there's a good reason not to.  Such as the difficulty painting the "underneath", or whatever.  I make my decisions "piece by piece".

I've had pretty decent results applying decals onto semi-gloss.  I recommend just putting one or two of the easy pieces on, and seeing what happens.  If they can't be smoothed down, remove them and do the gloss coat.

Less paint is better than more paint!

 

Ed

[BigDaddy]

I started my F3 Stewart project 30 years ago and only recently finished, adding hand rails.  I don't seem to have a pic in my Imgur albums.  I used a combination of preformed grab irons and custom made grab irons for the longer ones.

I wasn't about to repaint the loco (custom fictious RR), so I prepainted the grab irons.  I lost paint as I inserted them with tweezers, even though I tried to be gentle.  I was able to touch them up with a brush, but if I was starting anew, I would install the details first.

No experience with Tamiya spray.

[tstage]

Ed & Henry,

Thanks for your input.  I discovered that I have an extra set of the grab irons (on the sprue) from a Kato NW2 shell I purchased on eBay to practice with.  I'm going to spray paint those with the Tamiya rattle can and see how they go on pre-painted. 

The holes in the Kato shell for the grab irons are somewhat oversized.  So I'm thinking I may be able to applying them without disturbing the paint.  It's a lacquer paint and dries quickly but I'll let it dry sufficiently (several days?) before applying the details.

Actually, I have some Champ decals coming in the mail, which I also purchased last night on eBay.  I think I'll practice applying those on the shell first before adding the grab irons.  That should give the paint plenty of time to harden.

Tom

[doctorwayne]

I usually add all of the detail parts before painting, unless they'll interfere with decal work.  Once any such details are added, I brush-paint them.

For things that aren't supposed to be the same colour as the body shell, such as the handrails on the locomotive shown below, I add them after the paint and lettering is done, and then use a brush to paint them.

All of the details on these were added after the body shell was lettered and airbrushed (same operation). 
The details were then brush-painted...

The only decals used were for the safety warnings and the numberboard numerals.

Wayne

[tstage]

Thanks for the pointers and the photos, Wayne.   And an additional question for you or anyone else:

Do you wear gloves when you paint to keep oils from your hands off the parts/shell?  If so, what kind?

After washing in warm, soapy water then rinsing and drying them throughly, I try to handle the shell or parts as little as possible with my washed bare hands; preferring to use tweezers, a paintbrush handle, or an unpainted interior surface to help manuever parts into the optimum painting orientation.

I also try to think through the painting "process" or "road map" so that I'm not laying a recently painted surface onto the platform I painting on to paint another surface - e.g. painting the top of your shell or cab first then painting the sides while the top dries.  This takes some forethought so that you make the most efficient use of your painting time, or inadvertently mar the finish of the paint.

Tom

[emdmike]

Some parts I want on the model, others I do not and it varries model to model.  If the grab irons are seperate, and will be in the way to put stripeing or masking on the model, then they stay off.  Major details like snow plows, air horns and such I do install first.  Most of my engines are brass and the only "proper" way to install major parts are to solder them on.  That is much harder once the model is painted.  So I solder on all the parts prior to paint, then a trip thru the dishwasher to remove oils and solder flux, then into the vinager bath to etch the models surface.  Only then am I ready to paint.   Many of Kato's detail parts are cast in a flexable engineering plastic that is horrible to get paint to stick to as the parts are flexable.    Love the rad grill with the fans behind it!      Mike the Aspie

[doctorwayne]

tstage

...Do you wear gloves when you paint to keep oils from your hands off the parts/shell? If so, what kind?...

Not while washing the parts, as my hands are clean when doing so.  I always let the washed items air-dry.
When airbrushing, I wear nitrile gloves, or at least such a glove on the hand holding the item.  Many open-bodied items, such as diesel shells, boxcars, etc. can be held with your hand inside them (hence the glove), but I also have a selection of various sizes of wood scraps next to the paint booth, and at least one of them will fit pretty-well any model being painted.  When airbrushing, the paint usually dries quickly (not all types, though), and for those that do, the model can be handled almost immediately. 
I sometimes paint only one or two items - last night I put a gloss clearcoat on a MoW car and a small vehicle, in preparation for decal work, and also gave an Intermountain flatcar, which I'm building for a friend, a coat of Floquil grey primer, mostly to provide a base for painting and weathering the deck.

Usually, though, I prefer to paint when I have lots to do, especially in the winter, when I have to heat the paintshop (in my 135 year old detached garage) in order to get the compressor oil warm enough to run.  Gotta make it worthwhile!

The first time I successfully used PollyScale in my airbrush, not in the winter, though,  I painted four dozen Accurail boxcars, non-stop, changing colours periodically (either a new bottle or altering the one in-use) to keep them from looking all the same, as they were to be lettered for different railroads.  Never once did the airbrush clog. After a very few minutes to clean the airbrush, the cars were dry enough to place upright in their boxes, and dry enough to stack the open boxes atop one another in a larger box so that they could be carried back to the house.
(I had previously had absolutely no success following the various methods outlined on several forums, and finally found useable instructions and specifications in a most unexpected place:  the manufacturer's website. )

I don't think this photo is of those cars, but a sample of stuff either under construction or getting ready for painting...

I also do a fair bit of painting for friends, especially brass steam locomotives.  After any needed repairs are done and extra details added, (and old paint stripped, if necessary) they get washed the same as plastic freight cars or diesels, and once dry, are usually painted in several colours (variations of "black") in one session, with no masking other than a piece of cardstock to shield adjacent areas.  Clearcoating, also of various types (gloss,semi-gloss, and matte) are applied to their respective areas in the same manner, and weathering is also a separate step, after the paint has cured.
This one was painted with Pollyscale...

 

Since the demise of Floquil, and then, even worse, Pollyscale, I've been using Scalecoat I for brass, as it requires no primer.  It is, however, a fairly slow drying paint, and I generally leave it at least a week for the paint to fully cure.

Wayne

[SeeYou190]

tstage

Do you wear gloves when you paint to keep oils from your hands off the parts/shell? If so, what kind?

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The only time I wear gloves is after the model is washed and before/while airbrushing.

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At other times I still wash my hands frequently.

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I wear "Mid-Knight" brand latex (rubber) gloves. these have just a bit of grippy texture on the fingertips and lessens dropped models. Plus, they are black which just looks cool.

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-Kevin

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