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Has anyone done a powered Speeder ?

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Has anyone done a powered Speeder ?
Posted by C&O Fan on Thursday, May 17, 2018 9:02 AM

Would  love to see how it was done

TerryinTexas

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Posted by rrinker on Thursday, May 17, 2018 9:29 AM

 In what scale? G scale it would be pretty easy. O scale wouldn't be too hard. HO could get interesting. N? Good luck. Z? If someone has done it in Z scale and it actually runs - I would pay to see that.

 I could see a possibility in HO using the Kato powered trucks that use the coreless motors. The only saving grace is that your typial speeder has the raised housing down the center where the drive train and controls are on the real thing, which means there is space for a motor and gears.

 Actually, Bachmann did an HO one, though it may be a tad large - but then speeders came in all sorts of sizes. They aren't all the smaller models you often see people restoring and running.

                                  --Randy


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by riogrande5761 on Thursday, May 17, 2018 9:36 AM

C&O Fan
Would  love to see how it was done

Me too.  It would be difficult in HO without some kind of very specialized electronics and motor.

I imagine if one could be done in HO, it would need keep alive or it would stall frequently.  Of course where are you going to hide a motor, decoder and keep alive circuit?

Rio Grande.  The Action Road

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Posted by G Paine on Thursday, May 17, 2018 9:56 AM

George In Midcoast Maine, 'bout halfway up the Rockland branch 

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Posted by RR_Mel on Thursday, May 17, 2018 10:16 AM

I’m waiting for Dave (hon30critter) to chime in, he is the King of itty bitty stuff.
 
 
 
Mel
 
Modeling the early to mid 1950s SP in HO scale since 1951
  
 
My Model Railroad   
 
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I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.
 
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Posted by dragonriversteel on Thursday, May 17, 2018 10:54 AM

RR_Mel

I’m waiting for Dave (hon30critter) to chime in, he is the King of itty bitty stuff.
 
 
 
Mel
 
Modeling the early to mid 1950s SP in HO scale since 1951
  
 
My Model Railroad   
 
Bakersfield, California
 
I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.
 
 

 

 Second that. Mechanical wizard Dave.

 

Patrick

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Modeling an ficticious HO scale intergrated Scrap Yard & Steel Mill Melt Shop.

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Posted by Colorado Ray on Thursday, May 17, 2018 11:29 AM

My 1:1 Fairmont MT-14 is powered by a 23 HP Ingersoll-Rand Generator Gas Engine. 

http://www.friscotwentygrand.com/

Ray

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Posted by jasperofzeal on Thursday, May 17, 2018 11:39 AM

I'm not exactly sure what it is you're looking for but years ago someone added DCC to a speeder.

http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/744/t/194557.aspx

TONY

"If we never take the time, how can we ever have the time." - Merovingian (Matrix Reloaded)

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Posted by HO-Velo on Thursday, May 17, 2018 11:57 AM

This thread reminded me of an HO DC powered handcar I acquired long ago, pretty much a novelty on a modern era layout, unless one were modeling handcar races.  It was out of scale, prone to stalling and had to be run at high speeds, but was fun and can't recall a layout visitor who wasn't tickled to see those little guys pumping away like mad at the handles.  Now with a DCC layout the handcar has long been relegated to a crowded display case, and those little guys whom were once so energetic now stand frozen in time.

Sorry for the off-topic, regards, Peter

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Posted by wvg_ca on Thursday, May 17, 2018 12:42 PM

did one in HO a while back, used a Stanton drive for power ..

working arms that moved up and down ...

no DCC, not much room for extra weight, had to run pretty fast to stay powered up, too light, went in the display case, then to another home

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Posted by hon30critter on Thursday, May 17, 2018 8:14 PM

Hi guys:

Thanks Mel and Patrick for the compliments. You made me blush! However, I have to give part credit where credit is due. Many of my critter projects were inspired by Darth Santa Fe. I think he is the real master because he can do the design work using available gears and other components, usually from NWSL. I can copy his designs but I would have a hard time figuring out exactly what components would be needed.

The late Wolfgang Dudler was the one who got me on to the BullAnt drives from Hollywood Foundry which I used in my Grandt Line 23 tonner and box cab. Unfortunately the BullAnt drives are temporarily unavailable. Geoff Baxter, the maker, has had some health problems, but I believe he promises to be back.

 

I have had some success using Bachmann 4-4-0 N scale drive systems and building the bodies like the one in my avatar. The Bachmann N 4-4-0 mechanism could be used to build a speeder but the wheels would be oversized. Here is the Bachmann locomotive:

https://www.ebay.ca/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2334524.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H1.XBachmann+4-4-0+N+scale.TRS0&_nkw=Bachmann+4-4-0+N+scale&_sacat=180250

Bachmann did a 'speeder' in HO a few years ago. It is not exactly prototypical but it does bare a reasonable resemblance. There are a few on eBay right now:

https://www.ebay.ca/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2499334.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.XBachmann+speeder.TRS0&_nkw=Bachmann+speeder&_sacat=19128

Here is an active link to the DCC conversion that Tony mentioned:

http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/744/t/194557.aspx

I have the decoder and the speeder but I have never gotten around to installing the decoder. I need to make up a model of Busrter Keaton to go with it.

Dave

 

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Posted by hon30critter on Thursday, May 17, 2018 8:31 PM

wvg_ca
not much room for extra weight, had to run pretty fast to stay powered up, too light,

That is a problem with the Bachmann speeder too. The only way I could see to make it heavier would be to scratchbuild the body out of 0.050" brass or lead. The lead would have to be handled with care to avoid bending the shell.

The speeder comes with two flat cars which have metal wheels. If you were really tricky you could install 0.010" phosphor bronze power pick up wires and use magnet wire to get the power to the decoder.

Dave

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Posted by C&O Fan on Thursday, May 31, 2018 9:50 AM

TerryinTexas

See my Web Site Here

http://conewriversubdivision.yolasite.com/

 

 

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Posted by NWP SWP on Thursday, May 31, 2018 10:16 AM

Just a suggestion, in addition to having power pickup on the trailers perhaps (if you are successful in powering a speeder) do another and couple them together, you could increase electrical contact by having twice as many wheels and the trailers could have increased weight to aid in contact, just a suggestion, sounds like a cool project!

Steven

Crooner, Imagineer, High School Graduate, living with Aspergers, President of the Republica Pacifica micronation,  President of the NWP-SWP System.

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Posted by C&O Fan on Thursday, May 31, 2018 10:29 AM

JD of TCS  has been watching my progress and promised to send me Some SM keep alive Capacitors

 

 

TerryinTexas

See my Web Site Here

http://conewriversubdivision.yolasite.com/

 

 

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Posted by E-L man tom on Thursday, May 31, 2018 1:41 PM

Yes, i've got one of those little handcars - - made by Bachmann, as I recall. Bought it at a train show (overpaid for it IMO, $15.00), over 20 years ago. My young sons were interested in it so I bought it mainly to please them. They lost interest in it very quickly. You're right, a rough runner at best.

Tom Modeling the free-lanced Toledo Erie Central switching layout.
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Posted by Darth Santa Fe on Friday, June 01, 2018 12:08 AM

"Speeder", like a Fairmont Speeder?  I've thought of trying to power one of those before.  Durango Press makes some cheap ones in HO that could be a good base for this.

_________________________________________________________________

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Posted by C&O Fan on Friday, June 01, 2018 5:43 AM

Yes go to the You Tube video for a look

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HtaOFIInWQ

 

 

TerryinTexas

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http://conewriversubdivision.yolasite.com/

 

 

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Posted by andrechapelon on Friday, June 01, 2018 7:08 PM

Bachmann UK has actually done a speeder, powered and also available with DCC. Granted, it’s OO, but the things are small enough that the scale discrepancy shouldn’t be all that noticeable. 

 

http://www.hattons.co.uk/60850/Bachmann_Branchline_32_993_Type_27_Wickham_Trolley_and_trailer_MPP0007_in_BR_engineers_yellow_with_wasp_str/StockDetail.aspx

Andre

It's really kind of hard to support your local hobby shop when the nearest hobby shop that's worth the name is a 150 mile roundtrip.
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Posted by hon30critter on Friday, June 01, 2018 11:05 PM

andrechapelon
Bachmann UK has actually done a speeder, powered and also available with DCC. Granted, it’s OO, but the things are small enough that the scale discrepancy shouldn’t be all that noticeable.    http://www.hattons.co.uk/60850/Bachmann_Branchline_32_993_Type_27_Wickham_Trolley_and_trailer_MPP0007_in_BR_engineers_yellow_with_wasp_str/StockDetail.aspx Andre

Hi Andre:

I really like the 'open' look of the Bachmann OO speeder vs. the North American model, but where do they suggest putting the decoder? The gondola obviously contains the motor. Is there any room left in it for a decoder?

Dave

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Posted by rrinker on Saturday, June 02, 2018 11:17 AM

 A Z scale decoder (and some are insanely tiny - they can fit in an N scale slope back tender alongside the motor) should fit up under the roof. Hiding the wires would be the hard part. There might be enough room in the cart along with the motor though.

                       --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by andrechapelon on Saturday, June 02, 2018 12:30 PM

hon30critter

If you scroll down on the Hatton’s ad, you’ll find that you can get it already DCC equipped. I have no idea where they put it.

 

Andre 

 
andrechapelon
Bachmann UK has actually done a speeder, powered and also available with DCC. Granted, it’s OO, but the things are small enough that the scale discrepancy shouldn’t be all that noticeable.    http://www.hattons.co.uk/60850/Bachmann_Branchline_32_993_Type_27_Wickham_Trolley_and_trailer_MPP0007_in_BR_engineers_yellow_with_wasp_str/StockDetail.aspx Andre

 

Hi Andre:

I really like the 'open' look of the Bachmann OO speeder vs. the North American model, but where do they suggest putting the decoder? The gondola obviously contains the motor. Is there any room left in it for a decoder?

Dave

 

It's really kind of hard to support your local hobby shop when the nearest hobby shop that's worth the name is a 150 mile roundtrip.
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Posted by C&O Fan on Saturday, June 02, 2018 5:31 PM

For those of you that are following the progress on this install/conversion

The

TCS Z-2 decoder Came today and it fits nicely in the cut out section i prepared

 

Now to  Route the wires and figure where to put a keep alive

 

TerryinTexas

See my Web Site Here

http://conewriversubdivision.yolasite.com/

 

 

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Posted by hon30critter on Saturday, June 02, 2018 11:17 PM

Hi Terry:

Nice small decoder! Does it stick up above the top of the shell or can you just cover it with a piece of flat styrene?

Dave

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Posted by C&O Fan on Sunday, June 03, 2018 6:48 AM

hon30critter

Hi Terry:

Nice small decoder! Does it stick up above the top of the shell or can you just cover it with a piece of flat styrene?

Dave

 

 

It fits just inside the opening i cut so i can cover it with a piece of Styrene when i'm done

meantime ive added a Headlight making use of one of the 2 light functions on the Z 2

I used a Warm White SM LED for this

Think i will also add a tail light

 

 

TerryinTexas

See my Web Site Here

http://conewriversubdivision.yolasite.com/

 

 

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Posted by hon30critter on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 12:05 AM

C&O Fan
meantime ive added a Headlight making use of one of the 2 light functions on the Z 2

The lights look great!

There are two ways I can think of to add a keep alive capacitor. One would be to incorporate a pre-made keep alive in a gondola that is permanently hooked up to the speeder. Loksound makes the smallest that I am aware of. They call it a 'Power Pack'.

The other way is to build a capacitor array into the roof of the speeder. That would require you to mount a bunch of smaller SMD (Surface Mount Device) capacitors under the roof or wherever else you could fit them and wire them up so that they become one larger cap. If you study the Loksound manual for their Select decoders, there is an illustration of how to use a standard capacitor with their decoders to make a keep alive circuit. Hooking up an array would be exactly the same thing. We are talking about some pretty fussy work here. I have never done it but I know it can be done. I'm not sure if the SMD capacitors would be hooked up in parallel or in series. Maybe someone can answer that.

Here is a link to the Loksound manuals. Scroll down to the 'Loksound Select Diesel & Steam Users Manual' (1.87 MB). The information on adding your own keep alive is on page 16.

http://www.esu.eu/en/downloads/instruction-manuals/digital-decoders/

You don't have to have the exact capacitance that they recommend which is 2200 uF, but the more you can squeeze in the better. They must be rated for 25v. If they are smaller they might explode.

Something to note is that you cannot program the decoder with the capacitor array hooked up. You need to be able to disconnect it to do any programming. If you can, find a place to put in a micro switch or a connection that can be disconnected if needed.

Whenever I get around to working on my own speeder I will try to install a capacitor array, or at least try to. Like I said, fussy fussy work!

Dave

 

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Posted by Tinplate Toddler on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 12:31 AM

Liliput, which is Bachmann´s continental European brand, makes an Austrian prototype speeder.

Just take of the buffers, change the lights and add knuckle couplers and it´ll go for a US speeder.

Sound & Stay Alive by LeoSoundLab.at

Happy times!

Ulrich (aka The Tin Man)

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Posted by hon30critter on Tuesday, June 05, 2018 2:04 AM

Hi Ulrich:

That is a neat little speeder, although it is a bit on the large side for a North American unit.

However, it would be interesting to take one of the Austrian speeders apart and see if the electronics could be squeezed into the Bachmann North American speeder. I'm guessing it would require a gondola to hold some of the components, but getting sound as well as DCC into one of those wee beasties would be something to be proud of! Hmmm.Mischief

Thanks for the video.

Dave

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Posted by NWP SWP on Sunday, June 17, 2018 8:42 PM

Ya know I was thinking it'd be kinda neat to take a model of an old tractor and maybe say a Bachmann 4-4-0 chassis, add a cab off an old semi truck and make a speeder/critter/switcher it'd be pretty cool.

Steven

Crooner, Imagineer, High School Graduate, living with Aspergers, President of the Republica Pacifica micronation,  President of the NWP-SWP System.

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Posted by hon30critter on Sunday, June 17, 2018 9:26 PM

NWP SWP
I was thinking it'd be kinda neat to take a model of an old tractor and maybe say a Bachmann 4-4-0 chassis, add a cab off an old semi truck and make a speeder/critter/switcher

Hi Steven:

This would be a much better doner for the drive system:

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/NIB-HO-Bachmann-46201-MOW-Pickup-Truck-w-Highrailers/390636973407?hash=item5af3c72d5f:g:d3IAAOxy9tpR-szO

Unfortunately they are getting pretty pricey but if you are patient you might be able to get one for a decent price.

Here is my high railer utility truck using the Bachmann drive, a CMW cab and a scratch built truck body. Please pardon the lousey paint job on the truck box:

Dave

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