I have three Athearn RTR Gas Turbine locomotives with narrow wheelsets. Watch this video to see how they bounce across a Walthers #8 double slip switch.
I have been unable to adjust/fix the wheelsets so they are within spec. I just can't budge them without using seemingly excessive force. What is your method?
Thanks.
[Edit: Post split from 2010 review thread found at the following link: http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/88/t/177561.aspx]
Modeling an HO gauge freelance version of the Union Pacific Oregon Short Line and the Utah Railway around 1957 in a world where Pirates from the Great Salt Lake founded Ogden, UT.
- Photo album of layout construction -
"...I have been unable to adjust/fix the wheelsets so they are within spec..."
This comprises a contradiction. Why adjust them if you have determined that they are in spec? If you adjust them for this one appliance, what effect will your adjustment have on other turnouts? Will it be salutary? Probably not. Maybe it won't have any effect. At first glance, I would say the flanges are too closely set to each other across the axle, but I could be wrong.
The wheels should be adjustable. It's a chore in some cases...you may need a puller. But if you were to objectively measure compliance in all the wheel sets, you may find one or two a bit tight. Or, you may find that both wheels on one axle are in gauge, but slid a bit toward one end. This means that the flanges don't track in line behind each flange ahead of it.
You'll have to take a cold look at the structure of the double-slip and measure flangeways and gauge throughout all routes. Look for tight gauge clearances, flashing in the flange paths...everywhere...pinches.
I had to do some minor fiddling with my Walthers/Shinohara #6 double-crossover before the trains mostly went through, to an item, with only minor wobbling here and there. I had to use a needle file in some places to get more consistent operation. Perhaps the double-slip needs the same kind of attention.
Like Selector, I have four Walthers/Shinohara double slips on my layout (#8) and there are a few pieces of equipment that seem to "hop and skip" through the frogs.
Checking wheelsets with an NMRA gauge shows that they are very close to being in gauge. Nearly all of my Shinohara frogs have had to have some degree of cleaning up with a knife-edge jeweler's file.
Any time I have had to make adjustments of gauge, especially with so many Proto split-gear replacements, the only reasonable way is to remove each wheel/axle assembly and use a twisting motion while applying a slight outward force.
It is trial and error, sometimes the axle pops free of the grip of the gear bore rather quickly and you find you have pulled too much. It then takes a bit of inward force to get the gauge perfect.
With three turbines in your roster it looks like you have a lot of wheelsets to adjust.
Good Luck, Ed
Has Athearn gone away from stub axles pressed into a central gear? Usually if they are stiff it helps to rotate while trying to work them out.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
Sorry for the confusion. My message was created as a reply to a message thread where the Athearn RTR Gas Turbine loco was reviewed and in the review the author noted that ALL the wheelsets on the review locomotive were out of spec (narrow) and the author was able to 'easily' fix the out of spec wheelsets. I replied to THAT message thread asking how the wheelsets were adjusted and a moderator pulled my reply out of that topic and created a new topic and therefore we lost the context needed for my comments to make sense.
The wheelsets on my THREE Athearn RTR Gas Turbine locomotives and tenders are ALL out of spec. They are all narrow by about 0.5mm. This causes major problems on this one turnout (as well as shorts on most of my Peco Insulfrog turnouts).
I tried to adjust (widen) a couple of the wheelsets, but they will not budge and I'm not sure how much force I can/should exert versus having the correct tool. If someone has a recommendation on proper technique for adjusting wheelsets safely I am very interested. I have 42 wheelsets (((8 (per loco) + 6 (per tender)) * 3 locos) to adjust. Ugh.
I was sent a link to the NWSL 'The Puller' tool recommended for adjusting wheelsets: http://shop.osorail.com/product.sc?productId=276&categoryId=15
I ordered one and I will use it on my Gas Turbines and report back.
OK. I hope that solves your problem.
However.
I'm not sure about the Gas Turbines, but all the other Atheran diesel-type locomotives I'm familiar with use axle "stubs" that press into nylon, or "slippery-engineering plastic" and any kind of wheel/axle press isn't going to change the gauge since they are turned out of a single hunk of metal.
IMG_0128_fix by Edmund, on Flickr
The above are only an example but are patterned after the "Atherrn Method" of diesel truck design. The only way to adjust the gauge is to have more or less of the axle stub inserted into the nylon gear.
Maybe the Gas Turbine is different.
Ed, they can't be machined from a monolithic chunk of metal. Think of what happens to the electrons between the two rails when they find a handy path toward each other....a short.
All wheelsets in the two-rail hobby have to have one wheel electrically isolated from the other side's wheel.
I think he meant each stub in one peice of metal, which is fine electrically, the plastic gear insulated each half. But they aren't - the wheels actually are high-pressure pressed on short stubby axles. A long time ago there was an MR article where they visited the factory. There were two presses - one put the wheel on the axle stub, the other pushed two stubs into the gear.
If you exert enough force on the wheel and stuf, you may actually be able to pop it loose, maybe even without bending the wheel - but once that happens, it's done for, you'll never get it to stay together again.
That's why I asked if Athearn changed their methods, because if the turbines are the same as any other Athearn, it's just a matter of sliding the stubd in or out of the central gear to adjust the gauge. And it usually helps to twist them a bit to get them to slide. Perhaps they factory apply a drop of locktite to them now.
The other thing to keep in mind when doing this, especially if they pop all the way off, the gear needs to be centered. The truck won't track right if you push one side all the way in and the other partly in, even if the gauge measured from wheel to wheel is exactly correct.
Regarding geared axles, the good news in this context is there are only 4 geared axles per loco/tender out of the 14 total axles (all 14 of which need to be adjusted so they are within spec on each of my three loco/tenders).
I wonder if the Athearn 'factory' ever fixed this issue with wheelsets being so far out of spec on later production runs?
I'm not sure if they (Sanda Kan) ever fixed it or not, but it's odd that they would have that issue considering it's the same factory that made trains for Atlas, Proto and others for a long time. Sanda Kan is owned by Kader (Bachmann) now.
The turbine's trucks use a solid axle unlike Athearn's other trains, so the NWSL Puller will do the job in this case.
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selectorAll wheelsets in the two-rail hobby have to have one wheel electrically isolated from the other side's wheel.
I see.
Cheers, Ed
I received the NWSL 'the puller' yesterday and used it to adjust all 14 axles on one of my Gas Turbines. It was very easy to do using the puller.
Thanks to all for the assistance/advice.
The gas turbine is MUCH smoother crossing the #8 double slip and it doesn't cause shorts on the Peco insulfrog turnouts anymore either.
gmpullmanMaybe the Gas Turbine is different.
Made a believer out of me! Yes, that axle/bearing/gear set is very different from the usual Athearn style "stub axle-pressed into nylon center gear" design.
An added benefit is that you have a good quality tool for handling any type of wheel and axle work in the future.
Thanks for the follow-up! Glad you're in gauged now...
Regards, Ed
gmpullman An added benefit is that you have a good quality tool for handling any type of wheel and axle work in the future.
Yep, 14 axles down, 28 axles to go. :)