anybody still build locomotive models like arbour loco kits
When you say "build" it can mean "manufacture". Or it can mean "assemble".
For the former, I would say "No". At least for US prototypes. Probably in Britain and Euro they still do.
For th latter, close to "No". People don't build kits as much as they used to. Back in the day, I built several steam loco kits, and at least one diesel (Hobbytown). I haven't built a loco kit in YEARS. I do work on them. I just don't assemble them.
I recall the Arbour kits, when they were introduced, as being about the most hideous kits ever. So an actual magazine review said. But I also recall more recently someone singing their praises. The problems were in the running gear, I think.
Ed
Arbour kits were Hidious! If you want to build a nice loco kit, find one of the old Bowser kits on ebay. Lots of PRR engines, a UP Challenger and Big Boy along with a NYC Pacific and a Mountain were produced for many years. Mantua also offered many of thier engines in kit form. But nothing USA prototype really offered anymore. But the kits show up all the time on that auction site and at train shows.
Silly NT's, I have Asperger's Syndrome
There is a company in New Zealand, Railmaster Exports, that makes Sn3 locomotive kits and some standard gauge S scale diesel kits.
I have heard that some British companies make etched brass kits for locomotives and occaisionally do a U.S. one - but I have not seen these marketed in the U.S. Also, I don't know if these are full kits or partial kits such as for the superstructure.
I still see locomotives kits at train shows from time to time. That and eBay are probably your best bet if you're looking to buy.
Good luck
Paul
Most (all?) of the old kits really aren't that nice looking when they're done. In a word, they're crude. I wouldn't waste my time working on one, now.
I think what would be fun if you wanted to build a "kit" locomotive would be to buy an older brass locomotive. They aren't that expensive for what you get. And they run nicely. Usually. And, out of the box, they're MUCH nicer than the old kits.
Then modify it as much as you wish. For example, you probably won't want to modify the steam and sand domes; but you can change the headlight. You can build an oil bunker if it's coal burning (but remember to remove the ash pan).
While I don't know when/if I'll get to it, I bought (I think for about $250) a very beautiful "Omaha" 0-6-0 brass steam switcher with the idea of backdating it. It's already got the classic lines of switchers from 1905, but it's been modernized. So I plan on de-modernizing it. That looks like mostly removing the headlight, generator, and tender light. And then adding older (gas?) lights. Oh, yeah. I think it's got a power reverse. That, too, has to go; and a Johnson bar has to go in. That's about it.
7j43k Most (all?) of the old kits really aren't that nice looking when they're done. In a word, they're crude. I wouldn't waste my time working on one, now.
Depends on how you build it.
I'm working on an Arbour 2-8-4 right now. It's a very flawed kit, but buildable with extensive work, and it should look very nice when it's finally done.
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The Bowser kits can rival vintage brass if you find the optional super detail kit that consisted of lots of Cal Scale brass detail parts. Takes lots of time to install but the model looks really nice and not crude afterwards(dependant on your skill level of coarse). That said, you can find a vintage PFM/United or Akane ect brass model for about the same as the kit will cost you. A dealer in Indianapolis has a nice PFM Nickle Plate Road Berkshire for $250, unpainted and ready to get put back to work again. He also has other models. Mike the Aspie
7j43kI think what would be fun if you wanted to build a "kit" locomotive would be to buy an older brass locomotive.
I agree with Ed on this count!
I recently "upgraded" a 1962-era LMB Models New York Central H-10 Mikado.
Before:
During...
Many of the kits were produced in zinc-alloy which leaves you with few options (epoxy?) to attach details and piping. With a little soldering experience and the proper solder and fluxes parts can be securely attached.
And After...
I attended a model railroad show just this weekend. A few vendors had brass locomotives at what I would call "bargain-basement" prices, many in the $150-200 range.
Not long ago I picked up my next "upgrade" project:
A PRR N1S with a Lines West tender, already equipped with a can motor and smooth running characteristics. This one will require very little detail enhancement. A missing front ladder, a sander line broken loose. As Ed pointed out, much better detailing than what you might get with a kit plus, much of the "fussy-work" i.e., frame, drive line and running gear, is already assembled sometimes requiring only a little finesse here and there to make it a perfect runner.
Don't 'ya just love that front-mounted air reservoir?
Have Fun,
Nothing says you can't use epoxy on brass locomotives. As opposed to soldering. But with both approaches, you had better plan your operations carefully.
With epoxy, you're not going to have parts coming unsoldered "over there" because you put the heat on improperly.
Also, if you go the non-solder route, you can use plastic parts. Either castings or sheet and strip Evergreen. I built a cab out of styrene, for example. And also an oil tank for a tender. At least twice, that I can recall.
On my little 0-6-0 switcher, I will likely not use solder. I'll probably de-solder with a resistance outfit. But adding the headlights and Johnson bar look like epoxy will do just fine. And a bit less stress.
However, to properly paint a brass engine, you need to be able to bake the finish at around 180'F for an hour for each coat. Most epoxys do not like heat like this. If one is going to own and work on brass, I highly recommend learning to solder it properly if one is going to do detail work. Pretty much anything you need detail wise for steam, is avaiable in brass from one of several companies still. Its really not that hard The trick is having a big enough iron to get in and out quickly. When they are build, by hand, they use large 200 watt irons, even for the little stuff! Getting the spot hot quickly is the trick, then the area around it doesn't get hot enough to unsolder other stuff already there, in and out. Beautiful NYC Mikado, and the PRR should look really good when done. Who is the importer for the Pennsy engine? I used to have a N2 2-10-2. I picked up this old GEM/Olympia 2-8-0 to redecal for my proto freelanced shortline. Paid $100 for it and she came with her original box in really nice shape as well. Runs really nice. All I did was replace the weak magnet in the open frame motor with a stack of the rare earth super magnets from Micro Mark. Its nearly as quiet as a Kato diesel when it runs. Mike the Aspie
emdmike However, to properly paint a brass engine, you need to be able to bake the finish at around 180'F for an hour for each coat.
However, to properly paint a brass engine, you need to be able to bake the finish at around 180'F for an hour for each coat.
I think that will depend on which paint you are using.
Don't forget that people manage to paint plastic diesels all the time, and they certainly don't bake them.
emdmike However, to properly paint a brass engine, you need to be able to bake the finish at around 180'F for an hour for each coat
However, to properly paint a brass engine, you need to be able to bake the finish at around 180'F for an hour for each coat
It's possible to paint brass without baking paint. Thin coats and adequate time between them will work.
The trick is having a big enough iron to get in and out quickly. When they are build, by hand, they use large 200 watt irons, even for the little stuff! Getting the spot hot quickly is the trick, then the area around it doesn't get hot enough to unsolder other stuff already there, in and out.
It's not really the wattage of the iron but more so the method and type of iron.
A 200 watt iron with a chisel/pointed/whatever tip isn't going to provide the heat that a resistance iron with carbon tipped tweezers would.
Resistance soldering is by far the way to repair or add details... or build up your brass kit. Add in soft sponges for "heatsinks" and you can readily prevent heat transfer to other areas. The application of high current between the carbon pads limits heat transfer due to the incredibly short time that it needs to be applied.
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7j43k emdmike However, to properly paint a brass engine, you need to be able to bake the finish at around 180'F for an hour for each coat. I think that will depend on which paint you are using. Don't forget that people manage to paint plastic diesels all the time, and they certainly don't bake them. Ed
Have to agree with Ed here, been using Scalecoat and Scalecoat II on metal equipment and metal parts for years without baking and with no durability issues for a long time now.
I do however "bake" even some plastic paint jobs with a cheap hair dryer once the paint is dry to the touch. I don't know that it really helps but it has never hurt....
Arbour kits, what a joke. I was managing a hobby shop train department when they came out. we sold two, then word got out about all the problems. But honestly, I took one look at the thing and said no way. And I built my share of Mantua, Bowser, MDC kits back in the day.
Sheldon
GraniteRailroader...Resistance soldering is by far the way to repair or add details... or build up your brass kit. Add in soft sponges for "heatsinks" and you can readily prevent heat transfer to other areas. The application of high current between the carbon pads limits heat transfer due to the incredibly short time that it needs to be applied.
If I could have afforded one, I certainly would have bought it. However, I managed to get by with various soldering irons, 25, 45, 80, and 200watt models, along with a plumber's torch, on this one...
I use small wads of wet tissue or paper towel as heat sinks, which allowed me to assemble and solder the handrails and the ladder mounted on this plastic tender, without damaging the tender at all...
As for paint, Scalecoat I is suitable without use of a primer on metal, and requires no oven time to yield a strong, durable finish.
Wayne
emdmikeBeautiful NYC Mikado, and the PRR should look really good when done. Who is the importer for the Pennsy engine?
Thanks, Mike!
The 2-10-2 is Westside made by Samhongsa. Nearly identical to this one:
https://www.brasstrains.com/classic/Product/Detail/056671/HO-Brass-Model-Train-WMC-Westside-PRR-Pennsylvania-2-10-2-N-1s-Unpainted
My cost was only a third of this price.
Recently (in the last few years) I have been using Scalecoat I and baking with excellent results. There were quite a few engines that I painted previously with PolyScale and they look just as good and are holding up well (no chipping).
7j43kAlso, if you go the non-solder route, you can use plastic parts. Either castings or sheet and strip Evergreen. I built a cab out of styrene, for example. And also an oil tank for a tender. At least twice, that I can recall.
One of the contributors to Weekend Photo Fun, RDG Casey has outstanding results with "hybrid" materials .
ATLANTIC CENTRALI do however "bake" even some plastic paint jobs with a cheap hair dryer once the paint is dry to the touch. I don't know that it really helps but it has never hurt....
Yes! I do that as well and, I believe, with out scientific backing, that it really helps to drive off the moisture which "should" improve adhesion.
Thanks, Ed
Wayne, I'm not a huge brass fan, and only desire one or two very specific pieces... but have repaired a number of them for folks.
Your steam is absolutely gorgeous. Great work. The tissue paper is an interesting idea; I've used small cloths and sponges, but I bet the paper would give a decent barrier under smaller pipes and grab irons...