Andy S - Ops Question - layout size vs # of operators

[Anonymous]

I haven't seen this kind of problem discussed and I might very well in the end take this question over to the ops Sig discussion group and ask there as well, but I thought I would pose this question here for my sake, and others who might be interested; and those who might have ideas. I designed an N scale layout in a study which has achieved the "empire" status I wanted. At present, I have two decks up, with a third planned underneath the first, to handle some, but not all, staging.

With out going into boring details of the layout configuration, I can say the layout can handle a lot of operations and operators. The room is difficult to describe, but is sort of 9 by 13 in one half and 7 by 13, in the second half of the room. Here is my dilemma. The room will only comfortably hold three operators, which I think will only keep the layout running "marginally." So if I have two decks and one train on each deck running, the third guy can be operating one yard and that is it.

In other words, I have more layout than operators. Is there a way to "stretch" operators? One thing I have considered is to have computer running in and out of staging. So the computer would take a returned train into staging, and move a requested train out of staging ready to run. But other than that I'm afraid I am limited on ideas.

Any thoughts?

[Big_Boy_4005]

Gee Rick, it sounds like you are a victim of your own success. By modeling in N, you have managed to build more layout in your space than you can handel. Realisticly, you should only expect to operate one train per person at one time. So, if 6 people fit in the space, and say 2 are working in yards, that leaves 4 on the road.

I think you are onto something when you bring up the idea of using a computer. This is what I am planning to do on my layout. I don't have the space problem, I may end up having an operator shortage. My concept is to let the computer be the dispatcher, and allow it to run the mainline under a CTC format. It would be in charge of generating traffic along the mainline, and allow the humans to work the yards and do the switching.

In theory the mainline is like a freeway with controlled access. Say for instance, you build a train in the yard, and it is a train that is going through, off the layout to staging. The yard operator would have to request permission or at least tell the computer that he has a train and where it is going. When the computer finds a break in the traffic, the train heads out, with the computer at the throttle.

Now the yard has a local ready to go. This job needs a human, but the human still needs to get permission from the computer to use the main.

All of a sudden your 6 humans go a lot farther, and your railroad stays busy. It is still challenging and fun, and the humans get the best jobs.[8D]

[wpsteve]

One thing you need to look at is why do you want more operators ? The worst thing that you can do is have more operators in the room than the room or layout will handle !!!!
I have been to those type sessions and it is not real fun climbing over each other...

Figure out what it takes to make the session run smooth and stick with it.
Numbers do not matter. For some they like to get as many operators as possible to a session.. Not me !
My railroad needs 16 to operate and I do not want extras.. 16 can be to many at times.. Work on making the sesssion a fun time, consider having back to back sessions if you want to include more folks, or seperate nights......
I always kind of liked the idea that another crew would come in and take over, just like the real railroads........

[Anonymous]

Perhaps I'm not making myself very clear. I don't want to add more operators and make the room crowded. I could add a forth, if the people were assigned an area and not a train, so in a sense they would act as dispatchers, rather than engineers. So they would take over the running of a train when it entered their "area." This idea just popped into my head, so I haven't really thought it out. Since the room isn't that large, you would still see lots of trains running, more in fact since there would be one more added operator.

[Big_Boy_4005]

Sorry Rick, I misunderstood. I thought you could get 3 people in each part of the room. It sounds like you are wanting to play "zone defense" instead of "man to man". A system in which the people never move but handle every train that passes through their area. That scheme may be less fun for the operators, and still has the problem of Total traffic volume.

If you are that human limited, the computer really makes sense, at least to me. It can take care of the more mundane aspects of operation, while you and your friends have fun.

[orsonroy]

Actually, I've got pretty much the same problem. I've got a P-shaped 12x25, three deck HO layout, and I've got more layout than room. I can easily support a multitude of operators:

One Peoria hostler
Two Peoria switch crews
one East staging operator
one West staging operator
two NKP mainline engineers
one P&E mainline engineer
one NKP Bloomington local engineer
one P&E Bloomington local engineer
one Bloomington interchange operator (GM&O and IC)

That's work for 11 people, all in a 3' wide by 30' long aisle, and a 2'x12' operator pit. Comfortably, I can fit three inside the aisle and one in the pit, with maybe one more operator running all the staging and interchange. Although I'd love to be able to fit more crews into the layout, I think I'll end up with two NKP engineers, one P&E and interchange engineer, and two P&PU yard engineers. When the mainline engineers don't have a train to run, they'll pinch hit by running extra yard assignments or interchanges.

All in all, it's about keeping the operators busy and having fun. Running lots of trains isn't necessarily a prerequisite of that. And just because you have a big layout doesn't mean you have to choke the mainlines with trains!

[Anonymous]

Well, I was initially seriously toying with having computer operated trains, like passenger trains run through the layout, while we three operators did our thing. But I realized that with the expense and electrical and electronic complexity, it was causing me to procrastinate on moving on in "growing my layout." So I have decided to limit computer operations to staging only.

The zone idea just came to me as I was typing the second post here in this thread. I was thinking something like this. If you had two operators, switching industries and/or yards and the third operator running a train through, a fourth train could be run through, if the layout was zoned off and each operator was responsible for that one "independent" train being handed off from zone to zone. I think I will at least give it a try and see how it works. I don't think I would zone all the ops.

Three could comfortably operate in this layout room while moving around, if I added a fourth, things would get...well... interesting...even with radio controls.