For those of you with layouts in a garage that shares space with other uses, what problems have you encountered and how did you overcome them? I'm thinking of building in my garage since that seems to be the only room in the house I won't get kicked out of.
Thanks,
Fred
Whereabouts do you live?
Is the garage heated, cooled, dehumidified?
Rich
Alton Junction
I live in Indiana and the garage is heated but no cooling.
I live in western Illinois and have a garage layout. The garage is fully finished just like the living quarters, heavily insulated, insulated double door. I have a small electric heater for winter use and usually keep the temp at 50 degrees, no A/C for summer heat and humidity. Most problems concern dust and keeping track, rolling stock and scenery clean. Dust doesn't make the best weathering. Good luck if you build.
To eliminate the dust problem, or most of it, I was thinking of building it as a shadow box. I was also thinking of either ducting the hvac into the garage or installing a window a/c unit.
The garage was hot in the summer and cold in the winter and dirty and dusty all the time. There was a quarter inch gap on each side of the garage door. I sealed up the gaps by using a piece of strip wood to make a jam of sorts. It cut down the wind and dust. I insulated the walls and ceiling. Dry walled the ceiling. Use a portable electric heater in winter. Waited until the cool of the evening in the summer, however I was going to run the ac duct but never got around to it.
Garages are usually used for storage so I made all the storage space under the layout including space for large items like bikes etc.
The other problems was the cats climbing on the layout and breaking the scenery. New rules: No cats allowed.
No cars allowed either. They can stay outside too. (unless it's a classic muscle car)
Hi derf
I'm facing the same quandry. I want to take a 10' x 23' section of our 2 1/2 car garage for layout space. I plan on building walls around the space with a few folding doors to allow access to the hard to reach areas.
The first thing I have to do is replace the ancient original garage doors. The newer doors will do a much better job of insulating and keeping the dust out, but I plan to augment the seals anyhow. The folding doors will also have to have weatherstrip applied.
One thing I would suggest you do before connecting your HVAC system to the garage is check the local codes. In Ontario it is illegal to duct the HVAC into a garage unless the space has been rendered inaccessible to automobiles or other carbon monoxide emitting devices. You could void your house insurance, to say nothing of other potential risks.
The other thing I would do is check the capacity of your existing HVAC system. If it has been spec'd properly for the area it currently serves it will very likely not be able to properly service the additional space. If it is too small, it will run forever trying to satisfy the thermostat which will add significantly to your energy bills and shorten the life of the equipment. Rather than changing both the furnace and the air conditioner, it would likely cheaper to install seperate climate control devices in the garage. Your not likely talking huge dollars to do that for most attached garages. You could get away with space heaters and a window mount or through the wall AC unit. A garage which is separate from the house, i.e. no common warm wall, will have different requirements, but that doesn't apply here.
I'm going on a bit (as usual) but I would make one more point. If the garage has an attic and you are going to finish the ceiling, make sure the attic space is properly ventilated. I would double the code recommendations on the roof and make sure air can flow in at the soffits. (Remember, the building code is a minimum requirement, not an optimum recommendation.) Otherwise you will experience significant heat build up in the summer. Insulation loses its performance capabilities if it is exposed to constant high temperatures over several hours. Eventually the temperature of the trapped air which is keeping the room cool will rise to the level of heat in the attic at which point the heat will be transmitted into the room. Extra ventilation doesn't cause heat loss in the winter if the space is properly insulated. A properly sized heating system will keep up with that.
There! Another diatribe from somebody who, having worked in the home improvement industry for years, knows just enough to be dangerous!
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
Thanks all for the suggestions. I had forgot about the dangers in ducting to the garage.
I have about a 7x17 area I can use. I can't wall it off due to the garage door needs room to open or that's the way I would have gone. Any wider and I get into not being able to access the attic stairs.
I'm have to work around a fridge, freezer, mower, bikes, tools and the grandbabies toys, no cars. Luckily 2 walls are insulated, just have to insulate the third and weather strip the garage door.
I've been "kicked" out of 2 rooms 3 times due to kids coming back or grandbabies needs so this was my last option.
derf I've been "kicked" out of 2 rooms 3 times due to kids coming back or grandbabies needs so this was my last option.
You need to regain control of your own destiny. You are the man of the house, you are at least entitled to use one spare bedroom. No basement?
No basement. The wife is always asking when I'm going to build a layout. My biggest problem is getting the layout from what I see in my mind to my hands.
How many rooms in your house?
The fact that the wife inquires about a possible layout is a positive sign. I think that our initial impression was that you are being driven out of the house and into the garage. Which is it?
derfI've been "kicked" out of 2 rooms 3 times due to kids coming back or grandbabies needs so this was my last option.
It may be Planning, Designing and Making Railway Layouts in a Small Space that describes building a model railroad in a chest of drawers. Each drawer is a module with fold down legs. The modules are pulled out and connected together. This allows the room to be used only temporarily either for modeling or other needs.
I believe it's written for Brits where homes are small and don't have basements. Other British books I've read describe small be well detailed layouts.
greg - Philadelphia & Reading / Reading
All you have to do is win the trillion dollar lottery,and live forever . Since we all know that is impossible, what about adding on to the house or back of the garage if space permits? this way the room could be built to acomadate everything (heating,cooling,dust control).What part of Indiana do you live?
I live in Greenwood. As you said, I haven't won the lotto so just trying to get the best I can with what I have. I've thought of a shelf layout but I, as well as the grandkids like to see trains go round and round, so the garage is my best bet.
There are 4 bedrooms. The grandsons take 2 rooms (with 2 more grandbabies on the way) and a guest room. I will have more running room in the garage, so that's a plus.
I wasn't very far along in bench work construction when I gave the rooms up.
Here in Texas many people do not park their cars in the garage. They use them for storage, party rooms, man caves, etc.
I divided my two-car garage the opposite way most folks do putting up a floor to ceiling "temporary" wall with a walk through door to enclose the back half of the garage (where you enter the house.) The front half (where the garage door is) I left open for my woodshop and workshop. This allowed much of the dust and dirt to drift outside. I even put a window air conditioner in the temporary wall even though our subdivision did not allow them. It only vented into the other half of the garage and was only visible if the garage door was all the way up. When we sold the house the "temporary" wall came down and I reused the lumber in my new home.
I think you're getting the general idea. Your enemy is the weather. Insulation helps in summer and winter, but I fear the extremes of winter and summer will reduce your layout time.
My own garage holds 2 cars, and that's basically what it's for. The garage is attached to one end of the house. We had them insulate the garage, but we didn't bother to heat it. It never gets below freezing, even in this brutal New England winter, and it's typically a bit cooler than outside in the summer. Still, neither of those is particularly comfortable.
My train room is the second floor of the garage. Even that has to be shared with "other users," but at least it's part of the house and it's got all the amenities.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
derf There are 4 bedrooms. The grandsons take 2 rooms (with 2 more grandbabies on the way) and a guest room. I will have more running room in the garage, so that's a plus. I wasn't very far along in bench work construction when I gave the rooms up.
richhotrainYou need to regain control of your own destiny. You are the man of the house, you are at least entitled to use one spare bedroom
Thanks Rich, I almost choked on my coffee
Jim
If you have the All Access Pass and are interested in a creative solution check out Ken Morrison's Midland Valley Railroad in the June 1977 issue. His layout was attached to hoists which would raise it up out of the way to make room for cars when he wasn't running trains.
Fred,
I've had layouts that share the garage with the family automoble for over 30 years. Here the weather is mild year round, but windy. Biggest challenge is the ongoing battle with dust and dirt.
Finishing and isulating the walls and ceiling helped with summer and winter temps and falling dust and debris. Coating the concrete floor with epoxy paint also helps with the dust. Biggest improvement came from having an insulated roll up door installed, it has rubber seals both bottom and sides.
I wanted a shadow box effect this time around, so, keeping dust control in mind I built a ceiling into my valance. Thinking about hanging some plastic tarps from the valance when the layout is not being used for yet another measure of dust control.
I'll end by saying, "I'm in charge of my house (when she's not around), and I do what ever I want, (if it's okay with her)."
Good luck and have fun, regards, Peter
hon30critter Hi derf I'm facing the same quandry. I want to take a 10' x 23' section of our 2 1/2 car garage for layout space. I plan on building walls around the space with a few folding doors to allow access to the hard to reach areas. The first thing I have to do is replace the ancient original garage doors. The newer doors will do a much better job of insulating and keeping the dust out, but I plan to augment the seals anyhow. The folding doors will also have to have weatherstrip applied. One thing I would suggest you do before connecting your HVAC system to the garage is check the local codes. In Ontario it is illegal to duct the HVAC into a garage unless the space has been rendered inaccessible to automobiles or other carbon monoxide emitting devices. You could void your house insurance, to say nothing of other potential risks. The other thing I would do is check the capacity of your existing HVAC system. If it has been spec'd properly for the area it currently serves it will very likely not be able to properly service the additional space. If it is too small, it will run forever trying to satisfy the thermostat which will add significantly to your energy bills and shorten the life of the equipment. Rather than changing both the furnace and the air conditioner, it would likely cheaper to install seperate climate control devices in the garage. Your not likely talking huge dollars to do that for most attached garages. You could get away with space heaters and a window mount or through the wall AC unit. A garage which is separate from the house, i.e. no common warm wall, will have different requirements, but that doesn't apply here. I'm going on a bit (as usual) but I would make one more point. If the garage has an attic and you are going to finish the ceiling, make sure the attic space is properly ventilated. I would double the code recommendations on the roof and make sure air can flow in at the soffits. (Remember, the building code is a minimum requirement, not an optimum recommendation.) Otherwise you will experience significant heat build up in the summer. Insulation loses its performance capabilities if it is exposed to constant high temperatures over several hours. Eventually the temperature of the trapped air which is keeping the room cool will rise to the level of heat in the attic at which point the heat will be transmitted into the room. Extra ventilation doesn't cause heat loss in the winter if the space is properly insulated. A properly sized heating system will keep up with that. There! Another diatribe from somebody who, having worked in the home improvement industry for years, knows just enough to be dangerous! Dave
I got kicked out of my layout room (also known as spare bedroom) so I killed many birds with one 2400sq ft stone. Detached Garage/Workshop Build :)
Modeling an HO gauge freelance version of the Union Pacific Oregon Short Line and the Utah Railway around 1957 in a world where Pirates from the Great Salt Lake founded Ogden, UT.
- Photo album of layout construction -
derfTo eliminate the dust problem, or most of it, I was thinking of building it as a shadow box. I was also thinking of either ducting the hvac into the garage or installing a window a/c unit.
Ducting the HAVC into that space may run afoul of building codes.
LIONS EAT BUILDING CODES!
The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.
Here there be cats. LIONS with CAMERAS
OnewolfI got kicked out of my layout room (also known as spare bedroom) so I killed many birds with one 2400sq ft stone. Detached Garage/Workshop Build :)
LION likes you work, and *loves* Your Avatar. It is not a wolf, but LIONS have several leopards who are good friends of mine.
Leopold Leonard von Leopard, III, esq.
ROAR
I would worry about the following in a garage where the layout was largely as exposed as any of the other shelving in the garage:
Exhaust particulate matter. On startup, an IC engine produces incomplete combustion and you'll get black stuff settling on surfaces.
Dust from rolling tires, but mostly from plodding feet. Oh, and the initial few exhaust strokes from a cold engine will blow up some dust as well.
Creepy night things, some with eight legs. All articulated, so if you model the N&W, put a sign they'll be welcome and blessed...but they have to work for a living and keep your tunnels clear of other intruders.
Moisture or drying....wide variances in either can cause track separation or noodling problems.
Cold could be a problem, especially for tight-fitting plastic shells. Lubes won't be especially keen to work, either.
Heat needs no real elucidation because it has many unpleasant effects, some damaging.
I may have to build in a garage next time, so it will be narrow and coverable shelves, up around the 5' level.
BroadwayLion Onewolf I got kicked out of my layout room (also known as spare bedroom) so I killed many birds with one 2400sq ft stone. Detached Garage/Workshop Build :) LION likes you work, and *loves* Your Avatar. It is not a wolf, but LIONS have several leopards who are good friends of mine. Leopold Leonard von Leopard, III, esq. ROAR
Onewolf I got kicked out of my layout room (also known as spare bedroom) so I killed many birds with one 2400sq ft stone. Detached Garage/Workshop Build :)
My avatar is Chester the Cheetah. Chester the Cheeto Cheetah to be specific. :)
Here's one you might not have considered:
A couple of days ago I replaced the garage doors.
I had to help the installer put the door tracks over the 4 foot wide layout after assuring him that the layout wasn't going to be moved.
Lackawanna Route of the Phoebe Snow
rrebell:
I thought of using pocket doors but I think I can do a better job of sealing the layout from dust (as much as is possible under the circumstances) by using bi-fold doors. With them I can get more compression on the weatherstrip. At least that's the theory!