G scale In 1/2" (1/24) Proto 24?

[sparkingbolt]

I have been wanting to post a topic on this subject for some time, but when I read in Joe Polska's topic about if you would change scales, Iron Rooster Mentioned G scale in 1/2", and the number of oddball scales used in "G" now, I can no longer resist.

Why this never caught on in the first place is beyond me. It seems such a logical choice since it is already an established scale and so easy to work in. Scaling a given structure or vehicle, or smaller details, is so easy to scale for modeling: 1/2 inch equals a foot. 40' boxcar=20 inches. I do it all the time.

The available choices of existing scales were chosen to work with the guage of LGB's guardrails they use for track. Yes, , it's so robust you can walk on it. That's fine as one option I guess, but before G scale ever existed I longed for 1/24 or 1/25 scale trains that I could compliment with my model cars and trucks in that scale.

Or Danbury and others including some budget priced diecasts could be used. I've seen toy cars at gas stations that are very close to scale that could fit the bill for outdoor use as far as vehicles go.

I have built one very detailed 1/24 scale diorama to go with my trucks and cars modeled in that scale. I love it.

Would there be any appeal in a Proto 24 model railroading scale if it didn't mean scratchbuilding everything from scratch? If some Manufacturer offered at least some basic variety of products to establi***hat scale, I think others would jump on the bandwagon. Yes there have been a scant few offerings in this scale, (wheels, figures, building doors...) but nothing to truly establish it and get it rolling. And please, make it standard guage, even if with comparitively smaller equipment.

Would it be worth an appeal to Bachmann or another manufacturer to kick off a new scale? I'll never buy into 1/20.9 0r 1/29, but I'd do a swan dive into a 1/24 scale, say proto 24 outdoor/indoor scale.

What do others think? Dan.

[Jetrock]

The problem is that G scale track is not 4'8-1/2" wide in 1:24 scale!! A major idea of the "Proto" designations is the accurate representation of gauge (such as in Proto:48, where the tracks are scale 4'8-1/2" wide, as opposed to 5 scale feet wide as is common in most O-gauge railroading.)

In 1:24 scale, the #1 gauge track (45mm) common to G-scale modelers would be 3'6" wide. If you want to model a 3'6" (sometimes called "*** gauge") railroad then you could make an argument for a Proto:24 standard, but never for a standard-gauge railroad. The wider Gauge 3 track would represent 5' wide track and, thus, 5' gauge wheelsets, etcetera.

So if you wanted to do Proto 1:24, you'd have a serious campaign on your hands. There is already enough confusion amongst the large-scale crowd without adding more.

Before G scale ever existed? I think G has been around for 30-40 years--and the #1 gauge track it runs on has been around for about a century!!

[IRONROOSTER]

For standard gauge railroading in 1/2" some manufacturer will have to take the risk of producing enough items to make it viable and then hoping he can sell them. He would need to produce track - straight, curved, RH and LH switches, freight and passenger cars, and a diesel/steam locomotive to get started. There are already 1/2" structures and structure parts, so he wouldn't need to do that. I suspect that some of the other large scales would then fade away. I, for one, would take a look at it.
Enjoy
Paul

[Anonymous]

Hi
There is so much confusion in the large scale already don't need any more
What is needed is for the manufacturers to sort it out so you know for sure what your buying will match what you have.
regards John

[sparkingbolt]

Hmmm. I guess I should have said "before I knew of G scale" instead of presuming it was relatively new. [:-^] Stands to reason.

Doesn't exactly look like I'm going to start a stampede here for a new scale campaign, huh?

That's why the forums are such a great place to test the waters. Never hurts to ask! Thx Dan

[Anonymous]

Delton made a fair number of 1/24 scale roling stock, a semi-accurate C-16, a freelanced gas electric, and other equipment several years ago until financial troubles caused the company to go thru a couple of hands and eventually be picked up by Aristo Craft. There passenger cars were okay, and I'm not sure if they were even of a US prototype, for they had a bit of a Central American NG look to them.

Their reefers and box are close approximations of DRG&W equipment, they have a free-lanced side braced low sided "hopper" not unlike a Quincy & Torch Lake" prototype, a nice long DRG&W offset cupula caboose, and some decent flat cars. Their trucks were too long a wheelbase for most applications, but Ryan Co. made accurate DRG&W prototype replacements. Metal wheels are a must, because there wheels sets sucked. too, although Ryan offered metal ones and Delron ones w/ closer to scale flanges, and in correct diameter. Another company made replacement and enhancing hardware for the reefers and the boxcars. Kadee couplers are easily body mounted. Some of the paint schemes were semi-accurate, while some were silly. Strip off the lettering, repaint w/ either Krylon ruddy brown primer or their gray primer, and you'll be close to accurate narrow gauge colors for the era. Microscale makes accurate and complete decals for several NG railroads.

By the way, the Ryan trucks were designed as replacements for Delton's and were )are?) avail. w/ and w/out brake beams and shoes, and in 3'6'' and 3' gauge. According to earlier reviews in Garden Railways and Outdoor Railroader, the box cars and reefers were very close to correct dimensions for 1/24 scale. The C-16 was close too and details out nicely, esp if one rearranges the domes and the bell. All the correct appliances are avail. in either resin or brass - generators, air pumps (single and double, pop off valves,blow down cocks, stanchions, marker lites, grabs, etc.

Also, MDC flirted w/ 1/24 and introduced a very nice approximation of the short DRG&W center cupula caboose about ten or more years ago. Do not know if still avail. It too needs new trucks and some details, but scales out nicely. Prescision Scale made specific brass details for a number of 1/24 scale items, as did quite a few other manufacturers.

I have (temporarily ?) shelved my involvement w/ G scale for the past several years and am not up-to-date on what is / what is not available now. I got into G scale to also compliment model car modeling, and have built a number of rail-powered gas-electrics, rail inspection trucks, an extended bodied '39 Chev rail ambulance, and a little industrial diesel on an MDC "Lil Hustler" motor block. NWSL makes single and dual axle repowering units and they are first rate. There are items avail, from USA Trains, Bachmann and LGB, among others, that can be readily kitbashed into 1/24 narrow gauge equipment, because there was so little uniformity in the sizes of narrow gauge equipment across the US.

Frankly I lost interest in G scale because it it is such a mish-mash of scales, and non-scale equipment, and mostly caters to either the toy train market, or at the extreme high bucks and very limited end of the market. It is very satisfying to kitbash and scratchbuild in 1/24 scale, however. (It helps to start out real young because it'll take you a lifetime to complete a roster ! )

I suspect if some manufacturer introduced a product line consisting of 1/24 scale flex track and some turnouts (kit or RTR) w/ truer to scale rail sizes in something other than brass (ugh), there may be a resurgence of interest in this scale. There are several people already making more accurate and smaller code rail, available in bulk to "roll your own". All that is needed is a properly gauged tie strip (w/more typically longer and more widely space ties than the silly LGB- and clones- trackwork) and the same for the turnouts. . .How hard would that be?

[vsmith]

1/24 scale standard gauge? aint gonna happen...unless your opening your own shop.

There are already too many player in the LS world doing there own thing. Trying to start a new guage is going to belong to the realm of the pure scratchbuilder. A while ago some guys started touting a new scale F, citing that 45mm representing 3'0 narrow guage should be called Fn3 and that proper F scale would be 1/20.3 scale trains on a proper 4'-8 1/2" scale track at I believe a 63mm guage. Everything they built is scratchbuilt and no manufacturer has stepped up to the plate to offer "proper" F scale equipment. Too much a fringe, so the F scale guys continue machining there brass engines and cars and the manufacturers continue to offer items in whatever screwy scale that manufacturer is chosing to create its own niche.

Right now garden or large scale (LS) manufacturers are the ones driving what scales get produced. Its mostly driven by trying to carve out a niche in the LS marketplace. There are Two "camps" in LS, "Mainliner" or standard guage 4' - 8 1/2" trains, and "Narrow Guagers" modeling 3'-0" or thereabouts trains.

Now CORRECT scale for "mainliners" using 45mm track to represent 4' -8 1/2" track is 1/32 scale, which has some fabulous models made by Accucraft, and some OK stuff from Marklin. This stuff is pricey, especialy Accucraft.

The most COMMON scale for "mainliners" is 1/29 scale being offered by AristoCraft and USA Trains. They chose 1/29 to give there trains a little more visual "Ummph" and so that the LGB rails looked a but smaller. LGB's American standard guage stuff is somewhere between 1/29 and 1/26 scale, all are very well done models, just NOT TO SCALE!

Narrow Guagers have a bit more accurate offerings although at a price. Now at a SCALE 3'-0" guage 1/20.3 is the CORRECT guage, with some fabulous but very pricey offerings from Accucraft, Hartford, and Berlyn. Bachmann has begun its Spectrum line at 1/20.3 and at very reasonable prices.

But beware, Bachmann's older stuff, the 2-4-2 Columbia 2-4-2T Lyn, the new 2-6-0 industrial mogul engines, and ALL the freight and passenger cars are 1/22.5 scale. Even if they are LABELED at 1/20.3 doesnt mean they'll scale out to that...unless you WANT a 5'6" high cab! and Bachmanns original 4-6-0 was ment to be 1/22.5 but can be use for either standard OR narrow guage depending on which scale card you chose, its abmiguous.

LGB offer narrow guage European Meter gauge, and American narrow guage at a scale of 1/22.5. Correct for meter gauge but about 3'-3" for American items. Nothing runs better than LGB but there level of detail is sometimes criminal for the prices they extort. !/22.5 is the most COMMON scale of narrow guage items.

Other manufacturers like Hartland (HLW) offer a good selection of possible narrow guage offerings but without ANY scale being given. HLW's popular Mack gas engine, and all of their others as well, appear to be closer to 1/24 scale but could be narrow or standard guage again depending on which scale card you chose.

Fun Huh? ...Most of us doing large scale simply stake out what scale we want to chose, them buy items that only match that criteria, IOW chosing a narrow gauge engine and narrow guage prototype cars, or a 1/29 diesel engine and 1/29 streamline cars. If it sounds very confusing, IT IS! But you learn very fast what works with what, and it gets lot easier very quickly.

[Anonymous]

As a point of clarification, Aristo Craft make both 1/29 scale stuff (once upon a time called REA Express) and has picked up the former Delton (and later reorganixed as Delton / Caledonia brand) of the 1/24 scale models I described in a prior post. Has anyone tried regauging the Delton / Aristo Craft C-16 2-8-0 to true 3' ng in 1/24 ?

[sparkingbolt]

OK, I'm too dizzy now to start a new scale-or revive one-or even continue it! I'm gonna go hide in my room with my HO stuff....Dan

[Anonymous]

Me too, most likely !

[Anonymous]

hi
Me i am going back into the garden to sort out that tunnel
HO is for when its Too [censored] Hot to go out in the garden
regards John