cacole, thanks for bringing that to our attention, and, Randy, thanks for that explanation.
Rich
Alton Junction
Just menas they won't dim as nicely, and the effects won't work so good. Incadescent bulbs are slow to turn on and slow to turn off. LEDs are neatly instantaneous. For an LED to appear dimmed, it needs a much hsorter on/off cycle than an incadescent bulb, hence the CV setting. TCS has some similar settings. That's why TCS and NCE decoders work well with either type of light. Digitrax doesn't have any special settings for LEDs - and their decoders don't generate as nice effects with LEDs as a result.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
On page 5 of the instructions enclosed with an NCE D13SR and SW9SR decoder, and possibly all other NCE decoders, Note 1 under the table of CV values for the different lighting effects states, "Functions are designed to use 12-16 volt 30-40ma incandescent lamps. If you are using a white LED (with 1K limiting resistor) add 128 to the CV value."Notes 2 and 3 then state to add 1 or 2 to the CV value if you want the lights to come on only in the forward direction, or reverse direction.
What happens if you don't add 128 to the CV value? I'm not sure, because I've always followed the instructions that come with NCE decoders.
I will add that CV120 control the front light and CV121 the rear light. If you use led you add 128 to whatever value there is in both those CVs.
Jack W.
Thanks, Jack, we will have to wait to hear back from cacole.
richhotrain It is cacole's use of the word "must" that concerns me. What happens if you don't set a value in CV120? Rich
It is cacole's use of the word "must" that concerns me. What happens if you don't set a value in CV120?
The only thing I noticed is the led is brighter when using the led option with a NCE decoder. This way the difference between full intensity and dim is more noticable. There may be more to it I don't know.
cacole You must also set CV120 to a value of 128 to tell the decoder that you're using an LED instead of an incandescent bulb.
You must also set CV120 to a value of 128 to tell the decoder that you're using an LED instead of an incandescent bulb.
This will only provide better control of the led intensity. Default value for CV120=1 and if I trust JMRI CV120 can be different values depending on the lighting effect one desire when using led and resistor.
Say what?
Is that true?
I never heard of that.
On an NCE decoder, if you're using an LED it must have a 1K Ohm resistor. You must also set CV120 to a value of 128 to tell the decoder that you're using an LED instead of an incandescent bulb.
If the decoder was fried because of the LED, it's because you didn't have a resistor in the line.
Call NCE and talk to Larry.
If the decoder is less than a year old, they will replace it free.
If over a year old, send a check along with the decoder.
$10 for a replacement and $2 to cover shipping.
Hustle_Muscle,
Although it is not very good news, at least,you found out,what was going on. Good Luck, on the return.
Cheers,
Frank
I took the loco with the decoder over to a friends house since he has a decoder tester and all of that other crazy computer stuff. It turns out that part of the decoder basically fried (something to do with LED milliamps) to where no cv's or anything else can be programmed and also where advanced consisting wont work, therefore, the decoder will need to be returned to NCE.
I do appreciate everyone's help in the end though.
Check out my work here:
http://rmd-painting.weebly.com/
jalajoie yankee flyer Hi I also think it is a procedure problem. On my Power Cab I just follow the promp's I only run two number ID's and since I only run one consist at a time My consist is #127. Chose front loco, (running direction) Enter, chose second loco ( direction) Enter, chose rear loco, (direction), Enter.It works for me, are you doing it differently? Good luck. Lee A small correction, on a NCE system it should be a)Chose front loco, b)Chose rear loco, c)Chose any loco in between. I am sure it is an oversight from your part and you do it correctly on your layout.
yankee flyer Hi I also think it is a procedure problem. On my Power Cab I just follow the promp's I only run two number ID's and since I only run one consist at a time My consist is #127. Chose front loco, (running direction) Enter, chose second loco ( direction) Enter, chose rear loco, (direction), Enter.It works for me, are you doing it differently? Good luck. Lee
Hi
I also think it is a procedure problem.
On my Power Cab I just follow the promp's I only run two number ID's and since I only run one consist at a time My consist is #127. Chose front loco, (running direction) Enter, chose second loco ( direction) Enter, chose rear loco, (direction), Enter.It works for me, are you doing it differently?
Good luck.
Lee
A small correction, on a NCE system it should be a)Chose front loco, b)Chose rear loco, c)Chose any loco in between.
I am sure it is an oversight from your part and you do it correctly on your layout.
Hey, give me a break. I worked on a B29 when it was still in military service.
The mind is the first to go.
Now were is the train room again?
How about this, for what it is worth.
Set up a 2 loco advanced consist, front and rear locos, with the two locos with Digitrax decoders.
Get that consist running to your satisfaction.
Then see if you can add the loco with the NCE decoder to the consist.
P.S. - Previously unanswered questions
What is the consist number and how are you selecting the consist?
Are you selecting the consist number or the lead loco number?
mfm37 Will it run on its own normal address? Any function control on its normal address? Martin Myers
Will it run on its own normal address? Any function control on its normal address?
Martin Myers
It will run on its normal adress and all functions work like they should, but I can't figure out how I can solve the issue of the loco not running in an advanced style consist. I'm kind of stupid when it comes to CV values and factory resetting.
rrinker So, what you have is a decoder that either will not accept a value into CV19, or won;t recognize it as having a value - you can test that, if you have the loco working on say address 1234, on the main program CV19 to 10. You should be able to select short address 10 (very critical, make sure you select SHORT address 10 and not long address 10) and run the loco. Read back CV19 on the program track and see if it actually is 10. If it is, then the issue is the decoder does not recognize that it has a consist address. If it is not 10, then the problem is the decoder won't accept a value in CV19. Either one will prevent consist operation with NCE (other than what they call old style consists).
So, what you have is a decoder that either will not accept a value into CV19, or won;t recognize it as having a value - you can test that, if you have the loco working on say address 1234, on the main program CV19 to 10. You should be able to select short address 10 (very critical, make sure you select SHORT address 10 and not long address 10) and run the loco. Read back CV19 on the program track and see if it actually is 10. If it is, then the issue is the decoder does not recognize that it has a consist address. If it is not 10, then the problem is the decoder won't accept a value in CV19. Either one will prevent consist operation with NCE (other than what they call old style consists).
What Randy says, makes me think of something else.
Programming CV30-2 won;t stick, it's just a trigger to the decoder to run a reset routine. Should be done on the program track. If after doing this, the loco is working an an address other than 3, then it didn't actually reset. If it does revert to address 3, then it reset.
It's a very odd malfunction, to be sure. If it works in an old-style consist, that's because it is using the loco's regular address - and since it runs fine by itself, that much is working. Working as a lead unit in an advanced consist, is because of the way NCE addresses consists, again using the loco's singleton address. Bet if you have it working like that and use the menu option to reverse teh direction of the consist, it will stop working, same as if you try to add it to a consist anywhere behind the lead loco - in those cases, it needs to have CV19 programmed and then responds to CV19's address. So, what you have is a decoder that either will not accept a value into CV19, or won;t recognize it as having a value - you can test that, if you have the loco working on say address 1234, on the main program CV19 to 10. You should be able to select short address 10 (very critical, make sure you select SHORT address 10 and not long address 10) and run the loco. Read back CV19 on the program track and see if it actually is 10. If it is, then the issue is the decoder does not recognize that it has a consist address. If it is not 10, then the problem is the decoder won't accept a value in CV19. Either one will prevent consist operation with NCE (other than what they call old style consists).
CV30 on the NCE decoder is just a reset register, it should probably just read 0 if it reads at all. CV8 is the manufaturer ID, that should read with NCE's number which is 11.
First of all, sending the loco and the decoder to NCE is not the thing to do. If you suspect a decoder problem, then send the decoder to NCE, but not the loco.
It sounds like a decoder issue, specifically CV19, but if you cannot read the Manufacturer ID (cannot read CV), something seems wrong with the decoder.
Can you pull out the decoder and run it on DC. I assume you can from what you say. I seriously doubt that there is any problem with the loco.
Can you do a reset to factory default (CV30=2) on the Programming Track? Or, can't you even do that?
If you do a reset to factory default, that should clear CV19 to zero.
Weird problem.
Did the P2K GP30 ever run properly in an advanced consist?
Well, I just tried out the decoder again and I found out the for some strange reason, it will run as a trailing unit on an old style consist, but not on an advance consist. When I go to menu and then to "use program track" and try to program CV30=2, it looks for the manufacturer number and then it says "can not read CV". I even tried hitting 7 on the key pad under "use program track" and still have no luck. I can not figure out the problem and i'm about ready to send my loco with the decoder back to NCE after all the troubles i've had with it. This is getting really frustrating and I do not want to have to replace it with another brand of decoder.
The menu option on the PowerCab menu for a reset shouldn;t be too difficult to follow. Just do not try it on any non-NCE decoder. It doesn;t do an actual decoder reset, which varies from manufaturer to manufacturer, instead it resets certain CVs to the defaults, and some of them are specific to NCE decoders. Alternately, you can use single CV programming to do the decoder's specific reset, on the NCE decoder it's setting CV30=2. That will reset everything, including the address, to factory default.
There's no reason it shouldn;t work, unless somehow CV19 isn;t working in the decoder, but all current NCE decoders support CV19 consisting, so it should work fine.
I noticed recently when I consist my 3 locomotives with my NCE Powercab, the 2nd locomotive will not move. It is my P2K GP30 with the NCE P2KSR decoder and the rest of my locos have Digitrax DH123 decoders. Is there a way to resolve this issue? It will run just fine alone or as the lead unit in a consist, but not as a trailing unit in any consist (checked decoder, no bent pins. I'm not sure how to reset a decoder with the Powercab. The instructions honestly aren't clear enough to me)