Guy Papillon Tanks everyone. I ordered a TCS T1. Will be my first install involving soldering.
Tanks everyone. I ordered a TCS T1. Will be my first install involving soldering.
Just be sure to relocate the orange wire and clip that metal tab. Better yet, after clipping the tab off, place a piece of Kapton tape, or some other type of tape, between the frame and the remnant of the metal tab to insulate that area.
Rich
Alton Junction
Guy
Modeling CNR in the 50's
Exactly, it is the BRUSHES that need to be isolated. The metal part of the motor frame is not part of the circuit, the brush holders are in a plastic cap on the end of the motor frame. Think about this - the metal frame surrounds the motor. If it were electrically connected to the brushes, it would be a dead short across them. On the P2K small motor, the brushes are isolated from the rest of the motor frame by the plastic cap, only that tab on the bottom connects the lower brush to the loco frame.
In a DC permanent magnet motor, the current comes in only to the brushes and brush holders, and from there is transferred to the commutator and the motor windings. The frame provides no part of the circuit, it's there to hold the magnets and hold the motor together.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
Guy Papillon Thanks to everyone. I think I can do it. BUT, if the screw that holds the motor to the bottom frame is made of metal, the motor is not insulated from the frame despite the electrical tape between the motor and the bottom frame.
Thanks to everyone.
I think I can do it. BUT, if the screw that holds the motor to the bottom frame is made of metal, the motor is not insulated from the frame despite the electrical tape between the motor and the bottom frame.
When I first encountered problems with my P2K switchers, I turned for help to the NCE-DCC forum on Yahoo. Those guys are pretty knowledgeable and provided a lot of help to me to fix the problem. But, that started a spirited controversy about metal screws versus nylon and delrin screws. Some said to replace the metal screws, and others say nonsense. What I wound up doing as a precaution was to place a piece of Kapton tape over the screw hole, pierce it with a needle, and then tighten the metal screw.
One other comment. The motor is isolated from the frame. It is the brush that is grounded to the frame because of the misplaced orange wire and the metal clip.
Guy.
Common misconception. The motor brushes and brush holders only have to be isolated/ insulated from the frame. The metal jacket of the motor does not carry any current and does not have to be insulated. DC motors use a permanent magnet instead of a wire coil winding to excite the armature.
Pete
I pray every day I break even, Cause I can really use the money!
I started with nothing and still have most of it left!
Guy:
As long as the motor brushes are isolated from the frame you are good to go. If you are still worried substitute a nylon or delrin screw.
Joe
I have three of the S1 switchers and two of the S3 switchers.
I installed D12SR decoders on the S1 locos and D14SR decoders on the S3 locos.
All of those five locos were purchased back in 2004 and all were DCC Ready.
If I recall correctly, the Proto 2000 S-series of switchers were all DCC Ready.
The problem with those older P2K switchers is twofold: the orange wire is soldered to the bottom of the brush assembly which grounds to the frame and a small metal tab which touches the frame.
The soluntion is to move and resolder the wire and clip the tab so it no longer touches the frame.
I found out the hard way. These two flaws do not automatically short (or fry) the decoder except on derailments where the truck rotates, causing the metal wheels to touch the opposite rails. POOF!
Grab some and , this may help a little...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=feTfDSZe34g
Inspired by Addiction
See more on my YouTube Channel
I simply replaced the large circuit board with a TCS DP2X and changed the bulbs to 12v, 50 ma (you might prefer a different bulb alteration).
Dante
I have to redo my pics since webshots shut down. I shoulda just kepot them on my server all along, but I was running the original site on my own system with a very limited bandwidth. Now I have tons - all the newer pics are hosted locally instead on one of the services.
The basic idea: remove screws on bottom to remove motor, carefully unscrew bottom brush cap (don;t let the spring and brush get away!), solder a piece of orange decoder wire to the cap (if you leave it on the motor you could damage the plastic part of the motor). Decoder wire actually fits in the little hole in the cap, so that's what I did, stuck it in the hole then soldered on the outside. Leave off the ring terminal with the tab when reassembling. Put a layer of black electical tape in the bottom of the motor area where the tab used to contact the frame. Put it all back together, and use the new orange wire to connect the decoder - remove the oriange wire with ring terminal that was trapped under one of the upper frame screws.
It's really not difficult. My pictures are a little out there because I then filed part of the upper frame so I could fit a DH163L0 like I used in my first Geeps, so the light bulbs didn;t have to be changed. The more recent one I did, I repalced the bulbs with LEDs and 1K resistors, and used a TCS T1, no frame filing.
Here is a link to the TCS web site on the older / earlier run of the S1. http://www.tcsdcc.com/public_html/Customer_Content/Installation_Pictures/HO_Scale/Life_Like/Proto_2000_S1_Special%20Edition/Proto%202000%20S1%20Special%20Edition.html
But. The older run had the orange wire from the motor that attached to the frame. This was a potential problem where the decoder could fry in a simple derailment. Here is the work around for that.
http://www.tonystrains.com/tonystips/2001/120601.htm
I have 2 of the S3 locos from the earlier run and hardwired the decoder and LEDs. The S3 and the S1 used the same chassis. I used the TCS MC2 decoders in mine and they are very good runners for the few diesels I own.
I hope that Walthers fixed the hot frame issue in the latest run but I doubt it.
Found it: http://www.readingeastpenn.com/decoderinstall.htm
Unfortunately, the link to the Webshots page doesn't open up to the decoder pictorial. Perhaps Randy has a workaround.
It's a pretty tight fit under the Proto 2000 S1 shell so you'll want to find a decoder that's small enough. I was able to find one that I didn't have to mill the chassis to get it to fit.
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
Guy,
Randy (rrinker) had a handy pictorial on how to isolate the motor from the frame on his website. He may still have it. I'll see if I can locate it for you...unless Randy chimes in first.
My fleet of DCC equipped locomotives is growing. I now want to convert a P2K Alco S1 to DCC but I read that this particular loco an be challenging. Where can I find instructions on how to do it, preferably with pictures?