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PRR Signal Disk Heads Only

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PRR Signal Disk Heads Only
Posted by alloboard on Thursday, March 7, 2013 1:41 PM

     Does anyone know a vendor that makes prewired  PRR amber disk heads in HO scale, so I can mount them at signal bridges? If not I will have to wire these myself.  I also need a circuit board that will connect my LEDs from my signal disks to my Digitrax SE8C signal system.

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Posted by tstage on Thursday, March 7, 2013 2:07 PM

Do you mean position signals, like the one on top?

You asked about this before back in 2011:

http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/744/t/200638.aspx

Tom

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Posted by alloboard on Thursday, March 7, 2013 2:19 PM

    Yes like the one on top. I apologize. I forgot the other tread. I'm trying to keep up of all these other projects. I'll try better keeping up with my threads better this time. I can't believe it's been that long.

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Posted by tstage on Thursday, March 7, 2013 2:25 PM

Here's a circuit diagram from the Alkem Scale Models web site.  It's in N-scale but should be tweakable for HO.  You're still going to have to solder if you want it bullet-proof.

https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling

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Posted by alloboard on Thursday, March 7, 2013 2:36 PM

I saw that earlier on but it was for N scale.

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Posted by rrinker on Thursday, March 7, 2013 4:27 PM

 NJ International has pre-wired PRR signals, but they are $40 for a single head.

Signalling isn't cheap, unless you're willing to do the bulk of the work yourself.

         --Randy

 


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Posted by alloboard on Saturday, March 9, 2013 2:01 AM

     I finally bought my first real signal in my 11 years of HO scale modeling, besides the test signal head on the Digitrax SE8C. I is an NJ International Amtrak Northeast Corridor color position signal found here http://www.hobbylinc.com/htm/nji/nji1149.htm I tried testing the lights by putting the wires with resistors on a 9V battery and my Digitrax DCC track but none of the leads will light up. How should I correctly test the lights and eventually install this first signal I have purchased into my Digitrax SE8C.

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Posted by tstage on Saturday, March 9, 2013 3:15 AM

First off, do you realize that the link you've given is for an O-scale signal?  Secondly, since the LEDs didn't light up when you connected the wires to the battery, did you try switching the wires to their opposite battery terminals?  Remember: Diodes (which LEDs are) are unlike conventional light bulbs and current can only travel through them in one direction.  Also, since the LEDs are probably fitted with resistors for 13-14V (your track power), 9V won't even light them them up.

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, March 9, 2013 5:47 AM

tstage

First off, do you realize that the link you've given is for an O-scale signal?  Secondly, since the LEDs didn't light up when you connected the wires to the battery, did you try switching the wires to their opposite battery terminals?  Remember: Diodes (which LEDs are) are unlike conventional light bulbs and current can only travel through them in one direction.  Also, since the LEDs are probably fitted with resistors for 13-14V (your track power), 9V won't even light them them up.

Tom

Here is the link for the HO scale signal, probably what the OP meant.

http://www.hobbylinc.com/htm/nji/nji1149.htm

A 9 volt battery should be sufficient to light the LEDs.  As Tom says, reverse the wires on the battery terminals to align the LEDs properly.

If the LEDs aren't lighting, how are you testing them?  Are you holding the wires and resistors in your hands or have you soldered them?  Be careful not touch the wires to the battery terminals without the resistors because that will instantly burn out the LEDs.  I would want to be sure that the resistors are firmly attached to the wires before messing with the 9 volt battery.

Also, which wires have resistors added to them?  The common wire(s) should not have resistors attached.

Tell us more about what you are doing and how you are doing it.  How many wires are on that signal and what colors are the wires?

Rich

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Posted by alloboard on Saturday, March 9, 2013 9:26 AM

I meant to send you the link to the HO scale one. I tried switching to opposite battery terminals. I think the 9V won't light it up.

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, March 9, 2013 9:32 AM

Do you have a DC power pack that you can wire the signal up to in order to test it?

How do you plan to power the signal on the layout?

How many wires are on that signal and what colors are the wires?

Rich

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Posted by alloboard on Saturday, March 9, 2013 9:34 AM

     I'm trying to test them. They have the resistors. I have not soldered anything yet. all the wires have resistors except for the black wire. There are 13 lights on the two disk heads. There 8 colored wires. There are 2 yellow 2 green 1 black 1 blue 1 white and 1 red.

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Posted by tstage on Saturday, March 9, 2013 10:40 AM

richhotrain

Also, which wires have resistors added to them?  The common wire(s) should not have resistors attached.

Actually, Rich, the resistor can go on either one of the LED leads.  I put mine on the cathode (-) just to be consistent.

Tom

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Posted by tstage on Saturday, March 9, 2013 10:47 AM

alloboard

     I'm trying to test them. They have the resistors. I have not soldered anything yet. all the wires have resistors except for the black wire. There are 13 lights on the two disk heads. There 8 colored wires. There are 2 yellow 2 green 1 black 1 blue 1 white and 1 red.

You'll have to check them one at a time, alloboard.  The blue is your common (+) wire and goes to the anode or longer lead of an LED.  The blue wire will go on the positive (+) terminal of your battery and the other wires (one at a time) to the negative (-) terminal.

If the resistors are already soldered on, again - a 9V battery may not have sufficient juice to light them up.  If it does, it will probably be pretty weak.

Tom

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, March 9, 2013 10:50 AM

tstage

richhotrain

Also, which wires have resistors added to them?  The common wire(s) should not have resistors attached.

Actually, Rich, the resistor can go on either one of the LED leads.  I put mine on the cathode (-) just to be consistent.

Tom

What I meant, although I didn't say it very eloquently, is not to place resistors on both wires leading from the LED legs.  As a practice, I always solder resistors to the green and red wires (or whatever colors) and treat the white wire(s) as common, without a resistor.

Rich

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Posted by tstage on Saturday, March 9, 2013 11:05 AM

richhotrain

What I meant, although I didn't say it very eloquently, is not to place resistors on both wires leading from the LED legs.

Agreed, Rich.  The resistors on both leads is only for the special "dark" LEDs. Smile, Wink & Grin

Tom

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, March 9, 2013 11:50 AM

tstage

richhotrain

What I meant, although I didn't say it very eloquently, is not to place resistors on both wires leading from the LED legs.

Agreed, Rich.  The resistors on both leads is only for the special "dark" LEDs. Smile, Wink & Grin

Tom

Tom, that's what I do for my black LEDs.   Wink

Rich

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Posted by rrinker on Saturday, March 9, 2013 12:37 PM

 There's a much easier way to make a black LED, simply connect a 9V battery to one without a resistor. In less than a second you will have made a DED, Dark Emitting Diode. You can churn out hundreds in a few minutes at the bench. Saves the expense of all those reistors, and the pain of soldering them in place.

 As to the actual topic of this thread, the signals should have come with a wiring diagram that shows what goes where. If they are resistored for 12V operation, they should still light on a 9V battery. I would not randomly test across different wires without a wiring diagram, because even the slightest touch of the battery with no resistor will ruin the expensive signal.

 Witing them to the SE8C requires a little extra work. Digitrax has an app note on the SE8C product page for color position signals as well as PRR position signals, it's a bit more complicated than wiring a simple 3 color signal because of the multiple LEDs, the PRR ones need extra diodes because the middle light is on for all 3 indications.

             --Randy

 


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Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by tstage on Saturday, March 9, 2013 1:00 PM

rrinker

There's a much easier way to make a black LED, simply connect a 9V battery to one without a resistor. In less than a second you will have made a DED, Dark Emitting Diode. You can churn out hundreds in a few minutes at the bench. Saves the expense of all those reistors, and the pain of soldering them in place.

Randy, I had an engineer friend who was also very fond of FEDs: Flame emitting diodes. Big Smile

Tom

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, March 9, 2013 3:05 PM

rrinker

The signals should have come with a wiring diagram that shows what goes where. If they are resistored for 12V operation, they should still light on a 9V battery. I would not randomly test across different wires without a wiring diagram, because even the slightest touch of the battery with no resistor will ruin the expensive signal.

 

It is not clear to me from what the OP has told us whether (1) wiring instructions came with the signal (2) the wires are differently colored or not or (3) the resistors that came with the signal are already attached to the wires or not.

My fear is that the OP may have already burned out the LEDs.  If he has tested the wiring with a 9V battery and the LEDs don't light, and assuming that he placed the correct wires on the correct battery terminals, the outcome of this thread does not appear good.

Rich

 

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Posted by zstripe on Saturday, March 9, 2013 4:03 PM

The link that tstage gave him, although N-scale, has a wiring diagram in it that shows how to test the LEDS, using a 9volt bat and 1k resistor.. Whetther he read it or not, I don't know. maybe him thinking it was N-scale it would not work....Just a thought.....

Cheers,

Frank 

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Posted by rrinker on Saturday, March 9, 2013 4:09 PM

 He sent me a PM that indicated he tested with a 9v battery AND DCC track power - seems likely it's toast.

            --Randy


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Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by tstage on Saturday, March 9, 2013 4:12 PM

richhotrain

rrinker

The signals should have come with a wiring diagram that shows what goes where. If they are resistored for 12V operation, they should still light on a 9V battery. I would not randomly test across different wires without a wiring diagram, because even the slightest touch of the battery with no resistor will ruin the expensive signal.

 

It is not clear to me from what the OP has told us whether (1) wiring instructions came with the signal (2) the wires are differently colored or not or (3) the resistors that came with the signal are already attached to the wires or not.

My fear is that the OP may have already burned out the LEDs.  If he has tested the wiring with a 9V battery and the LEDs don't light, and assuming that he placed the correct wires on the correct battery terminals, the outcome of this thread does not appear good.

Rich

Rick,

While I don't know whether there are actually any wiring instructions, I thought alloboard did indicate that there were different color wires and added resistors from his previous post:

alloboard

     I'm trying to test them. They have the resistors. I have not soldered anything yet. all the wires have resistors except for the black wire. There are 13 lights on the two disk heads. There 8 colored wires. There are 2 yellow 2 green 1 black 1 blue 1 white and 1 red.

Tom

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Posted by zstripe on Saturday, March 9, 2013 4:14 PM

OH, OH .. no refund for DEDS...

Cheers,

 Frank,

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Posted by tstage on Saturday, March 9, 2013 4:22 PM

rrinker

 He sent me a PM that indicated he tested with a 9v battery AND DCC track power - seems likely it's toast.

            --Randy

I noted that in his earlier response on pg. 1 (see below), Randy, but wasn't sure if alloboard was saying he tested them simultaneously or separately.

alloboard

I tried testing the lights by putting the wires with resistors on a 9V battery and my Digitrax DCC track but none of the leads will light up.

Expensive lesson if the LEDs are now indeed DEDs.

Tom

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Posted by zstripe on Saturday, March 9, 2013 4:24 PM

Somehow 13 lites and 8 wires don't sound right to me, possibly 2 mast heads in series????

Cheers,

Frank

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Posted by tstage on Saturday, March 9, 2013 4:29 PM

Good question, Frank.  Perhaps for a few of the LEDs?  At the very least, it's a mining expedition to get needed info from the OP.

Tom

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, March 9, 2013 5:02 PM

tstage

At the very least, it's a mining expedition to get needed info from the OP.

 
That is proving to be the biggest problem.
 
Among the many issues that are not clear to me is whether the pre-wired signal head came with resistors attached or whether they were separate in the package and the OP simply twisted the wires around the legs of the resistors.
 
Rich

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Posted by tstage on Saturday, March 9, 2013 6:05 PM

From prior posts, Rich, alloboard is not real keen about soldering.  From what he wrote in this thread, I took it that the signal came with the resistors already soldered on.  However, alloboard will have to verify that...or whether he did just twist the wires around the resistors before testing them.

alloboard tends to be a night owl so we probably won't get a reply till the wee hours of the morning - at least for me.

Tom

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Posted by alloboard on Saturday, March 9, 2013 10:39 PM

     The signal comes with color codes wires: 2 yellow 2 green 1 blue and 1 white to match the color of the signal lights. The wires came with resistors already soldered on. There was no manual with this signal. If there was, I would not have asked this question on this forum. I finally got them all to work by using a 9V battery for testing. I put the black wire on one of the leads of the 9V battery and the colored ones one by one with the black wire. I will get the same results when I use track power instead of the 9V battery except that polarity does not matter on DCC track power. I thank you all for your inputs, ideas, concern and help.

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