I have a Lenz Set 100 DCC system with two CVP Products T5000 wireless throttles in addition to the Lenz LH100 tethered throttle. While debugging a problem with my Autoreverser which I detailed in another thread, I discovered an apparent solution to another problem that had become a nuisance recently. I believe all DCC systems are programmed to shutdown power when a short is detected so as to not fry the decoders. The Lenz is no exception. Recently I sometimes cannot restart the system after removing the cause of the short. The LH100 has an emergency red STOP button in the upper right of the keypad and you also use this button when starting or restarting the system. When I was unable to restart following a derailment that caused a short, I would shut everything down and when I came back, everything would be fine until the next derailment.
This morning I discovered that I was unable to start up the system and I noticed I had already powered up one of the T5000 throttles. I powered the throttle off and then restarted the system and it came up without a problem. I did this three times successfully. Then I tried it three times with the throttle powered on and each time it failed. The problem with restarting after a derailment is less predictable. Sometimes it will and sometimes it won't. I caused a deliberate derailment and first tried to restart with the throttle on and this time it failed. Then I turned the throttle off and was able to restart.
Now that I know why I have been having restart problems, it should no longer be a problem. However I have no idea why this would be an issue. Any guesses as to why the Lenz system won't start/restart with the wireless throttles powered on? As anyone who has been following my recent threads should know, electronics is not my strong suit.
My former club had the same system. Is there a ground wire from the wireless receiver to the command station? I think we also had the same issue but grounding it solved it. I still have my LH90. I loved that throttle. Just wish it had more function buttons.
Pete.
Are you sure that is an air wire t5000. And not an t2400ec easy dcc throttle?
shane
A pessimist sees a dark tunnel
An optimist sees the light at the end of the tunnel
A realist sees a frieght train
An engineer sees three idiots standing on the tracks stairing blankly in space
i'll guess it's a minor flaw in the design, with an easy workaround. wireless was added later after the command station design was complete.
looks like Lenz uses Railcom as their controller interface, as well as the interface to the wireless controllers and the command station may be getting confused while the wireless controller is active, probably pinging the command station.
the command station may be interpreting this as another command station
understanding a problem is 80% of the solution
greg - Philadelphia & Reading / Reading
gregc i'll guess it's a minor flaw in the design, with an easy workaround. wireless was added later after the command station design was complete. looks like Lenz uses Railcom as their controller interface, as well as the interface to the wireless controllers and the command station may be getting confused while the wireless controller is active, probably pinging the command station. the command station may be interpreting this as another command station understanding a problem is 80% of the solution
if he really is using a cap air wire T5000. The he is trying to use a g scale dcc system with a smaller scale system. The g scale systems are very different systems designed for battery power only where that dcc chip is the entire base unit and receiver chip on one board in the loco. With some functions of the base station in the controller itself. T5000 has a high power setting that signals up to 80 feet. T5000 is not completely comparable with Lena or anybody else, but can be used as a second throttle, identifiable by the base system if the t5000 is turned on after the base system( in his case lens) is already online. I have an nce system. for Ho and a airwire for large scale. Caught myself with this a couple times when the airwire was on and forgot when I turned the nce on. The airwire confuses the base station if not turned on in the right sequence. The t5000 is also discontinue. note cvp's airwire is where dead rail was created from. Same company.
NVSRR Are you sure that is an air wire t5000. And not an t2400ec easy dcc throttle? shane
Yes, I'm sure.
I just went to the CVP website and it lists both the T5000Ev4 and T5000Ev6 as obsolete throttles, replaced by T2400E and T2600E respectively. I believe my throttles which I estimate I've had for 10 years predate both these discontinued items. My throttles simply say T5000 on the cover. At the time I purcased these, I contacted CVP by phone to get a second RF1300 throttle which they told me was obsolete. They recommended the T5000 which at the time was their latest and greatest. It appears it is not only obsolete but so are its replacements. I have no idea what the difference is between the T2400E and T2600E but as long as my T5000s are working, I don't need to find out. I also replaced my CVP wireless receiver a few years ago and it has a much stronger antenna. I used to have a couple dead zones in the corners of the basement but this receiver responds almost immediately to any command.
How many sound decoders are on the layout? My old club had the wireless throttles with the rotary address switches. Your Lenz set 100 may not recover from a short if too many sound decoders or already running trains are on the layout. Running the ground wire helped the wireless throttles recover and we had several boosters so only one or two sections would need to reboot.
I have dozens of locos and a majority of them are sound locos. I have a shut off switch to my round house so those locos aren't drawing power except when I loco is going into or out of the roundhouse.
Overload wouldn't be causing this problem because while trying to debug the other problem, I removed all locos from the track except the one I was running tests with. That loco isn't sound equipped.
I also have a Lenz System and a CVP add-on to provide wireless. I have never had any of the restart problems described. Most of my sound engines are shut off unless I'm running them. I have two reverse loops. I am a lone operator so I switch back and forth between throttles, but seldom use more than one unless it's running a subway loop by itself. Since the CVP throttles are battery powered, I keep them off unless actually in use.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
could there be a bug that has developed in the lenz base unit programing?
NVSRR could there be a bug that has developed in the lenz base unit programing?
Until I figure out what it is, I can't say what it isn't.
My guess is that this condition has always been present. The normal sequence of events would be to power up the base station and then power up the wireless throttles. Most of the time, the condition pops up following a derailment and since I began full blown operations late last spring shortly before my summer hiatus, the derailments became more frequent. This was usually due to operator error, failing to properly align all the turnouts on a train move. It was only this morning that I discovered the sequencing error by accident. I went down to work on the problem with the autoreverser. For whatever reason, I picked up one of the wireless throttles and powered it up before powering up the base station. I was surprised when the problem popped up because I couldn't remember it happening when the system was cold. On a hunch, I turned off both the base station and the wireless throttle, then powered up the base station first. It powered up successfully. I then tested it three times each way. When I powered up the base station first, the system came up successfully. When I powered up the wireless throttle first, it failed.
I have no idea why this would be an issue but out of curiosity, I started this thread to see if anyone had any ideas as to why this would be. As the title says, it's not really a problem since I now know I need to power up the base station first. If the system shuts down due to a short, I know I need to turn off the wireless throttles and then reboot. At most, that's a nuisance.
MisterBeasley I also have a Lenz System and a CVP add-on to provide wireless. I have never had any of the restart problems described. Most of my sound engines are shut off unless I'm running them. I have two reverse loops. I am a lone operator so I switch back and forth between throttles, but seldom use more than one unless it's running a subway loop by itself. Since the CVP throttles are battery powered, I keep them off unless actually in use.
I'm always forgetting to shut off the wireless throttles which is why I use rechargeable batteries. Otherwise it would get real expensive. I use the auto shut off feature on the T5000 throttles but sometimes I don't always turn the throttle setting down to 000. If I leave it at 001 by mistake, the auto shutoff won't kick in.
I don't know what combination of factors is causing this condition which is why I'm curious about it. My base station is an LZ100 whereas I think the current system uses model LZV100. I don't know what the differences are and whether this contributes to the problem. They look exactly the same on the outside except for the model number. I've wondered recently if my power supply is sufficient for as many locos as I run. I have two zones in addition to the two reversing loops. I'm using an Atlas Generator for a power source which is 3 amps. When I first got the Lenz system, it was an upgrade from the basic Atlas system. I didn't have nearly as many locos as I do now and none of them had sound. I've been adding sound equipped locos since without giving a thought as to whether I need more juice. However during recent testing, I had removed all but one or two locos and this issue still occurred.
wrench567 My former club had the same system. Is there a ground wire from the wireless receiver to the command station? I think we also had the same issue but grounding it solved it. I still have my LH90. I loved that throttle. Just wish it had more function buttons. Pete.
The wireless receiver connects to a phone jack which connects to the LMAB port on the LZ100 base station with four wires. I don't know enough about electronics to know if any of these are a ground wire.