I am building a new layout, my layout room is a trapazoid shape with the walls 15 1/2' x12 1/2' x20' and the front being about 15' across. I am planning another room for a staging yard that will probably be along two walls 6' x 12'. I have a log of engines and a good number of them have sound. I have noticed that these engines draw more power and on my last layout I was limited to five engines at a time. Bascially two trains, one with two engines and one with three. If I ran any more than that the DCC system would short out. I also have a couple of big steam engines, with sound and smoke. Those seem to draw even more power.
In addition to my command staiton, I think I need two boosters. I can split the main layout in 1/2, between the command station and a booster. Then use the other booster for the staging yard. I might build the staging yard off of a wye, so the booster would also be the auto reverser.
I would like to hear anyone's oppinion on this?
I think the fact that the layout will be set up in two different rooms may be reason enough to divide the layout into two booster districts, one booster in each room. That will give you better control over the layout.
My experience is with an NCE 5 amp wireless PH-Pro system with a second 5 amp booster (DB5). I started out with one booster but eventually added the second booster for better control over multiple power districts.
Have you decided which DCC system you will use on your new layout?
Rich
Alton Junction
NILEI would like to hear anyone's oppinion on this?
Hello,
I didn't see it mentioned what the output capacity is of your present command station/booster. It seems you already know that it overloads when you are running five + locomotives so there certainly looks like there is at least one additional booster in your future.
Dedication another booster just for a reverse "loop" (or wye) seems wasteful to me especially when you can get an auto reverser that will also act as an electronic circuit breaker would suffice. Plus, a staging yard wouldn't normally see all that much current draw unless you have lighted passenger cars plus idling locomotives.
Kill switches aren't a bad idea for a staging/storage yard for the little cost/effort it is to install them.
Probably more importantly is to have your layout divided into segments protected by circuit breakers. One PSX quad could be wired as two pairs and you can divide the main line into two power districts then feed other sidings and yards off the other two and the wye on its own reverser/breaker.
If you're switching or placing locomotives on the track in a yard or engine terminal you don't want the main line shutting down becase of a brief short or running through a closed switch.
I, too, have many sound locomotives and lots of lighted passenger cars. I have three Digitrax boosters (8 amp!) each divided into four power districts. Still, with four trains running, sometimes a total of 12 to 15 engines, and several tracks full of idling locomotives each booster never sees more than about 2 - 3 amps of current draw.
I'd say get one booster, one auto reverser and one quad breaker and see if that takes care of your needs. You can always add another booster at a later date.
https://dccwiki.com/Power_District
LastspikemikeFor DCC you just wire all the power districts together, effectively bypassing the insulated blocks.
Not sure I'm following this. A booster doesn't define a "power district" but a circuit breaker protecting a length of track, defined by the location of an insulated joint on each rail, does. One booster may feed any practical number of breakers. The breakers will help avoid the unnecessary shutting down of trains running in other areas of the layout.
Good Luck, Ed
hopefully summarizing
it's not the number of boosters but the current capacity of the boosters. one 10A booster instead of 2 5A boosters
the density of trains in a section of the layout determines the # and sizes of the power districts. if a circuit breaker is set to 2A, the power district should be sized to handle some # of trains such that there total current is < 2A.
and finally, you could have 6 or 7 power districts all supplied by a single 10A booster. they are not all likely to draw 2A at the same time (e.g. 14A).
if you have a command-station/booster rated at 5A you may need to add a 5A booster. 3 power districts connected to one and 4 less heavily used power districts connected to the other
greg - Philadelphia & Reading / Reading
Please don't hook up a big booster directly to the track. That puts a lot of available power which could concentrate in one spot and do some damage. Instead, heed the advice to use individual circuit breakers to protect smaller power districts.
Think about this early on so you can isolate layout sections with insulators or gaps.
My layout was in a 24x24 foot room and I was working on the trackage on the third wall. I had a lot of track and about a hundred square feet of layout. I have about 20 powered engines, mostly with sound, but I typically only ran about 3 at a time. I have a 5-amp Lenz system, which seems to handle all the DCC with no trouble.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
Hello All,
NILEHow many DCC boosters are needed for HO scale layout?
To answer your question there are three (3) things to consider:
Now, a little math...
NILEI have a log (lot?) of engines and a good number of them have sound. I have noticed that these engines draw more power and on my last layout I was limited to five engines at a time. Bascially (SIC) two trains, one with two engines and one with three. If I ran any more than that the DCC system would short out. (Paragraph breaks added for clarity.)
To determine how many boosters (power sources) you require, you need to calculate the Maximum Amperage Draw required (with approximately 10% to 20% "Headroom").
NILEI also have a couple of big steam engines, with sound and smoke. Those seem to draw even more power.
With sound-equipped motive power there is also a "start-up" spike in amperage.
Think of it this way...
When your refrigerator "starts" there is a brief moment, in its power cycle, when the amperage "spikes" over what the running amperage is rated at. This "spike" can be accommodated within the calculated "Headroom".
Now for the big math...
Let's presume that each locomotive draws 1 amp. If you have a 10 amp system you can simultaneously run 10 individual locomotives- -minus any other "powered" cars. (A consist draws the amperage of the total number of units in the consist.)
OK, so now we've calculated the approximate total amperage draw of the number of locomotives being used, this gives an approximation of power sources "boosters" needed.
Now let's look at the physical size of the layout and the signal path or "signal run" from the cabs (throttles) to the command station/boosters.
For many, not familiar with electronics and signal flow, the concept of the output of the command station/power source (booster) to the bus wire or track, contains both electronic signals- -power source and signal packets
That's what those "jumper" wires do to connect the two separate units in the same enclosure to provide the DCC signal to the bus/track.
For traditional, tethered cabs (throttles) the placement of powered UTPs are required to maintain the strength of the signal to the command station/power source (booster).
Each manufacturer has its own Recommended Practices on placement.
Wireless; Radio and/or WiFi systems should be factored into the signal load.
As I mentioned above, yes...you can power the entire pike with one 50 amp booster (power source), but that would be unsafe.
Even with a 5 amp system power management or "Districts" are recommended.
NILE...so the booster would also be the auto reverser.
If you dedicate a booster as an ARU, it only powers/protects that individual reversed section. If this is a small loop perhaps a single standalone ARU, downstream of the booster, could be a possible solution.
Take a look at your track plan, consider which "blocks" or "districts" would benefit from circuit protection.
On my 4' X 8' pike there are five (5) power districts protected by four (4) single circuit breakers and a single standalone ARU and ECB.
There is a myriad of possibilities/solutions given your particular situation.
Understanding the challenges of the components will hopefully help you achieve your goal.
We can only suggest.
Ultimately, it's up to you to find a solution to your goal.
Hope this helps.
"Uhh...I didn’t know it was 'impossible' I just made it work...sorry"
I'm surprised that the OP has not responded since his initial post.
Rich,
This might be over his head...lots of different aswers. I'm having a hard time keeping it straight myself!!!
Dave
Dave N Rich, This might be over his head...lots of different aswers. I'm having a hard time keeping it straight myself!!! Dave
Duplicate post
NILEHow long should a power district be for a double main line? I had thought you needed a different booster for each district, I see that is not the case.
Booster District is dictated by the power requirements for a given number of current-consuming locomotives and rolling stock.
A Power District would further divide the output of that booster to particular segments of track primarily determined by "If I have a short here, do I want the inconvenience of the trains stopping over there".
Imagine if your house only had one main breaker, for everything. By dividing up the circuits if you plug in an old, faulty toaster in the kitchen the lights upstairs in the bedroom don't go out.
I used to have my power districts grouped by areas on the layout. After a while I found this to be rather inconvenient as a derailment on a yard track would shut down all the track in that area.
Now I have just that yard on one breaker and each of the main line tracks passing through are on their own breakers. Now when that yard engine runs a switch or a car derails, both the main line tracks can continue running.
NILEHow long should a power district be for a double main line?
My double track main is probably 140 feet or so. Each track is divided into roughly half that length so there is a total of four breakers, track one east, track one west — track two east, track two west.
The length of the track in each power district is only limited by the robustness of your supply feeders and power bus, up to a point. Most of us won't reach that point as voltage and signal loss won't degrade very much until you get into those huge modular setups found at some shows and such.
The length of a power district can be limited by how long a run can be without significant loss of power of that length/distance from the booster. I assume you will be running a power bus with feeders to the rails along the way. If using 14 AWG bus wire, for example, the longest run would need to be limited to 50 feet.
https://dccwiki.com/Wire_Sizes_and_Spacing
From the wiki:
According the Big Book of DCC by Digitrax, runs up to 100 feet are possible with 12AWG wire, and 50 feet with 14AWG. This is for one leg; in theory it is possible to have a 100-foot run (14AWG) with the booster in the middle (50 feet on each side). Don't skimp on wiring, plan for future power needs.
For the layout represented in the track plan, I plan to start with 1 Command Station/booster and employ 4 PSX1 breakers/power districts. I can add a 2nd booster if needed later. One for each yard, one for the mainline and one for the branchline.
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
Take into account how many engines are going to be in each district at one time. I divided my mainline into two roughly equal power districts but after looking at it, I realized the second district will not have nearly as many locos sitting idle as the first district which has the main yard, engine terminal, roundhouse, and five track passenger station. I rerouted the wiring for the roundhouse to the second district to balance the load but I also have an on/off switch to the roundhouse so it's not drawing power except when engines are being moved in and out.
gmpullman Booster District is dictated by the power requirements for a given number of current-consuming locomotives and rolling stock. A Power District would further divide the output of that booster to particular segments of track primarily determined by "If I have a short here, do I want the inconvenience of the trains stopping over there". Imagine if your house only had one main breaker, for everything. By dividing up the circuits if you plug in an old, faulty toaster in the kitchen the lights upstairs in the bedroom don't go out. I used to have my power districts grouped by areas on the layout. After a while I found this to be rather inconvenient as a derailment on a yard track would shut down all the track in that area. Now I have just that yard on one breaker and each of the main line tracks passing through are on their own breakers. Now when that yard engine runs a switch or a car derails, both the main line tracks can continue running.
A booster district monitors the amount of current draw (amps) from all of the running locomotives in that district even if a booster district is further subdivided into power districts. Amps in excess of the booster's capacity will shut down the booster to protect itself from damage.
A power district protects the district that it directly controls by shutting down the district if a short circuit occurs within that district.
Early on in this thread, I suggested that the fact that the layout will be set up in two different rooms may be reason enough to divide the layout into two booster districts, one booster in each room. That will give NILE better control over the layout. I stand by that suggestion. The second booster is to assure better control over two physically separate areas. Then, he can add however many power districts he wants within each booster district.