I’m looking to pre-order a Broadway Limited Imports (BLI) EMD NW2/SW7 locomotive in HO scale with their new Paragon 4 system. In a previous thread where users were discussing the changes going from Paragon 2 to Paragon 3 one contributor noted that BLI “…put cheap 3-pole can motors with copper finger brushes in the paragon 3” whereas up to that point BLI had always “... touted 5-pole skew wound motors…”. In his opinion the Paragon 3 motors were 1970’s era technology and caused him problems with burned out decoders. My question now is whether anyone has looked at the motor in one of BLI’s new Paragon 4 locomotives and can tell me what the current production is offering. BLI’s web page for the Paragon 4 NW2/SW7 simply states it has a “can motor with skew wound armature”. I’m not very technically inclined so I never take my locos apart and I wouldn’t be able to tell a 5-pole from a 3-pole motor anyway. I’d also like to hear if anyone out there thinks that this is a non-issue. Thanks for your input. It’s much appreciated.
I do not recall what BLI is using in Paragon 4 right now, however, the issue really is/was not them using a 3 pole vs a 5 pole motor, but the issue they had was their factory had sourced motors from another vendor and some of the motors were incorrectly oiled (I believe is what I was told), which ultimatly cause them to use excessive current, thus causing the other "secondary" issues, such as burning the motor controller chip on the decoder. Those issues had since been corrected, so it should not be an issue. So again, the motor as far as how many poles they have or not, that should never have an impact on burning up their decoder. At this point too with the newer motor controller chips they are using, the chip would never allow a motor to burn the chip. The chip just will cut off current, so you have an engine that moves very slow, or not at all, verses frying the decoder and needing a new decoder and motor. If you have older engines from them and are mostly interested because of the built in GoPack, you can "buy" the newer decoders and self install if you want. Only requires 1 wire to be moved to a new connector since it has a rear light.
loubmac I’m not very technically inclined so I never take my locos apart and I wouldn’t be able to tell a 5-pole from a 3-pole motor anyway.
Thanks so much for your reply tsd! You seem knowledgeable about the situation and your review of the issues completely and precisely answers my questions. It’s a relief to hear that BLI acknowledged that they had a problem and fixed it. It’s also good to know that the issue isn’t 5-pole vs 3-pole motors. My own technical skills won’t allow for my upgrading my old BLI locos by replacing the decoders, but others reading this thread will benefit from your tip. On the other hand, I’ve really enjoyed my BLI locomotives in the past (both paragon 2 and 3) and don’t mind at all to fork out the cash for new Paragon 4 versions. You have alleviated all of my concerns!
You're very welcome. I would not quite say that they "publicly" have stated what I have as far as the issue with the motors, but I know it was never "bad enough" to justify say a recall. And they do tend to have the best support/service in the industry, even if their repair turnaround can get a big long at times. I know their engineer really really well, who developes their decoders and software, which is where I get most of my knowledge about their product and issues that have come up. It's also one reason why I decided to register here because I have seen a lot of misinformation about what the issues were and just blanket statements such as Paragon 3 has decoder issues, when in fact most/many issues were actually related to the motors, and why they updated their decoder design as well to at least prevent the decoders from going if the motor is going/bad. I know that really came up with the GG1 (I think) because of the dual motors in the engine. It's also why when someone asks me if its worth upgrading their older BLI engines, usually I say yes because if its had no issues now, then it surly wont with the upgrade, and they will get the extra features now.
Unforuntatly, it also is not always super easy/clear to know if a motor goes as well as I know they have sent engines back to customers after replacing the decoder only just to have the new one burn up in a couple of months. I have had the same thing happen to some repairs that I have made, because what I found was when testing the motors, sometimes it would only for a fraction of a second have a surge in current but then it "break" through that and then go back to a low draw and then be OK.