I have two engines that need decoders and sound. Both are basically yard engines. I purchased both engines about 2 years ago.
The first in a Bachmann, HO scale S4 diesel that is DCC ready. The first picture below is of the S4 with the shell removed.
The second engine is a Walthers Proto 2000 Heritage, HO scale 0-8-0 steamer that does not say it is DCC ready, so I guessing it is not DCC ready. The second picture below is of the inside of the tender of the 0-8-0 with the shell removed.
I know what decoders do, but I know nothing about purchasing one. Which decoders and sound modules would you suggest for my two engines? Also, how do I add a decoder to the steamer that is not DCC ready.
I am using a Digitrax Command Station.
Thanks for your help.
Jack
TCS Wow sound shows two versions of the Proto 2000 0-8-0 and uses 2 different decoders. I don't know what the difference is. Someone here will.
https://tcsdcc.com/installation/ho-scale/2049
https://tcsdcc.com/installation/ho-scale/1522
Looks like you will be replacing bulbs with LED'sLife is easier if you stick to one brand of decoders, although I use ESU for diesel and TCS for steam.
Henry
COB Potomac & Northern
Shenandoah Valley
The P2K one is actually MORE DCC ready, because Bachmann has capacistors on their factory board that cause issues with any halfway decent decoder, and need to be removed. The P2K loco will need the incandescent bulbs replaced with LEDs.
My default mode for installing, DCC ready or not, is to remove factory boards and just wire in whatever decoder fits.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
Thanks for your replies!
I looked up the kit Henry referred to for the 0-8-0, and it involves removing all the electronics in the tender and replacing them with a decoder, sound board, speaker, and light. It looks easy enough to do.
I’m not exactly sure what I need to ask about my S4 diesel. Randy, when you say my diesel is more DCC ready than my steam engine, does that mean I can plug a decoder directly into the diesel and not have to rewire anything? If so, what decoder would you recommend? I looked at TCS decoders but did not see one for my diesel. Also, is P2K the correct designation for my S4 diesel? Thanks,
starmanRandy, when you say my diesel is more DCC ready than my steam engine, does that mean I can plug a decoder directly into the diesel and not have to rewire anything?
That is not what he said or at least not what he meant. The Bachman has a plug, but the capacitors in the circuit board cause less than smooth running. The other issue with that loco is where do you put a speaker? Maybe in the cab?
Yes, I said the P2K was more DCC ready. You (OP) seemed to think it wasn't DCC Ready at all - that part with the little black caps is an 8 pin socket, the board with the round black components (diodes for constant/directional lighting) plugs in to it.
Speaker in the Bachmann is another issue, since the frame is large. Some milling may be required to get even a small sugarcube speaker in there. With limited space - replacing the board with a decoder board instead of using the 8 pin socket is definitely the way to go here.
Replace the PC board in the S4 with a sound decoder. The capaciters are on the motor. Bachmann sells an encloser with speaker for the S4. You will need to modify it a bit to get the decoder to fit. Bachmann sells a sound decoder for the loco as well, but it is limited in functions and sound.
Enclosure: https://estore.bachmanntrains.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=68_573&products_id=7121
Joe
“With limited space - replacing the board with a decoder board instead of using the 8 pin socket is definitely the way to go here.”
Randy, I now understand what you meant. It looks like I will be removing all of the electronics in the tender of the 0-8-0 and soldering in a TCS decoder and adding a sound module, speaker, and LED light. They have great instructions concerning how to do the replacement.
If I can replace the inside of the 0-8-0 tender, I can also do it to the P2K. (I assume you are suggesting I remove the electronics present in the P2K and solder in a decoder board, and add a sound module and speaker). I have noted there is not much room for any decoder as whatever I use will have to sit on top the of motor. Do you have any particular decoder you would use, or would you explore a TCS decoder so that both decoders are from the same manufacturer?
Joe, I appreciate your comments as well. With the limited space in the P2K, the Bachmann speaker is certainly a consideration as well as a sugar cube speaker in the cab.
Thanks for all comments.
You're mixing up the locos. You said the 0-8-0 was life Like Proto 2000 model - that's P2K. But still I'd replace the board. I have some P2K diesels that have a similar board, I remove the factory board and hardwire the decoder.
My replace the board mentality comes from other older locos, that have an 8 pin connection, or in some cases just 8 holes in the board to solder the wires from a decoder, but have traces marked with an X that say "Cut here for DCC". Well, after tracing out some of these factory circuits, I've found them mostly worthless, and it's just simpler to replace it completely, and use LEDs for the lights. Some of the P2K E units have a Mars light, with a fairly complex circuit on the factory board to make a special dual filament light bulb blink between filaments. A decoder can do a better looking simulation of a Mars light with a single LED, no fancy dual filament light bulbs, so removing the factory board just makes sense - nothing on it is used except the 8 pin socket and all those plastic tabs holding the wires on - which is somethign else I usually do away with, as they can be unreliable - even if the factory board stays, I solder those wires instead of retaining the plastic caps.
Randy – I eventually catch on! I now understand that P2K is who made my 0-8-0 steamer, not a different name for my S4 diesel. Thanks for straightening me out on that.
I am going to order the TCS replacement kit from for my steamer. I will probably do the same for my S4 if such a kit is available.
This is off topic, but I have a question concerning our conservation about switches. I see that I need to power the frogs on some of my switches that we giving me trouble. I understand a Frog Juicer is exactly what I need; however, Tam Valley sells several types. My command station is 5 amps. To me, it looks like the HEX Frog Juicer, that can power up to 6 frogs, would be the one for me as I have several switches that I want to power. Also, should I add a DCC Circuit Breaker, that Tam Valley has, to protect the Frog Juicer. It appears that one DCC Circuit Breaker would be enough to protect all Frog Juicers, if I use more than one. Is this thinking correct? Thanks,
You don't need a circuit breaker in front of the Frog Juicer, it would never trip. You would use circuit breakers to divide up the rail power around the layout, but the Frog Juicer needs to tap off BEFORE any circuit breakers so it can work and change the frog polarity before a circuit breaker shuts off the power.
starmanThe second engine is a Walthers Proto 2000 Heritage, HO scale 0-8-0 steamer that does not say it is DCC ready, so I guessing it is not DCC ready.
To clear up some confusion, Life-Like was a company that used to make model railroad equipment, including their "Proto" line of quality engines that were first produced in the late 1980's. In the early 2000s they sold their model line to Walthers. As far as I know, all Proto engines made by Walthers have some type of DCC plug in them...in fact, most Proto engines made in the 1990s by Life-Like had them too.
TCS makes "Wow Sound" decoders; part of their line are kits that include a speaker and enclosure and is designed for you to replace the engine's lightboard with one of their boards, which has a "Keep Alive" in it to keep the engine running over poor track etc. Then the Wow Sound decoder plugs into that.
However, TCS and other companies (Soundtraxx, Loksound) make decoders with attached plugs that you can just plug into the existing light board's receptacle if the engine runs well and doesn't need the "Keep Alive". For both engines, I would try a plug-in decoder first and see if it works, rather than assume there will be a problem and do a lot of major work that may not be needed. I have a couple of Bachmann engines with TCS sound decoders plugged into the lightboard, works fine.
starmanMy question is “should it move when I call address 03, or is it not going to do anything until it has a decoder?”
I won't move with an NCE Powercab unless it has a decoder. It doesn't know it's supposed to be a #3 until it gets a decoder.
I don't know how you are powering your track. You should test it on a DC track before you remove the electronics. If it doesn't run well on DC, changing to DCC isn't going to help. If it doesn't run at all in DC and you haven't tested it you will be replacing decoders to get it to move, and that won't work.
Thanks, Henry. That's a good suggestion. I will try it on DC first.