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From the What Were They Thinking department

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From the What Were They Thinking department
Posted by SpaceMouse on Sunday, February 18, 2018 1:06 PM

So I have a 2-6-0 from Roundhouse. A new one. I have older ones I've already installed decoders into. The old ones have 8-pin harnesses. Plenty of room for decoders. 

The new one is set up for sound. It has a one inch receptical for a speaker. and enough space for a pretty large one. 

Above the circuit board there is about 3/16" clearance. 

The what were they thinking is that they set it up with a 9-pin harness. As soon as anything is plugged into it, it exceeds the 3/16 inch clearance. 

Every single sound decoder I've seen for small steam uses an 8-pin harness. I have two decoders that would easily fit if it had an 8-pin harness. 

It looks like I'm going to have to splice in an 8-pin harness if I want to get this loco to work.  

I'm beginning to wonder how well this loco will fly.

Chip

Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.

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Posted by rrinker on Sunday, February 18, 2018 1:54 PM

 Most of the 8 pin ones from TCS and Digitrax terminate in a 9 pin on the decoder.

The real answer is to rip out the factory boards which are often more trouble than they're worth, and hard ware the decoder. It leaves more room for the speaker or a not as tiny decoder.

                                           --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by SpaceMouse on Sunday, February 18, 2018 2:04 PM

rrinker

 Most of the 8 pin ones from TCS and Digitrax terminate in a 9 pin on the decoder.

The real answer is to rip out the factory boards which are often more trouble than they're worth, and hard ware the decoder. It leaves more room for the speaker or a not as tiny decoder.

                                           --Randy

 

 

That was the idea behind the new harness, which I was already thinking about. The board is helpful in that 8 black wires come from the engine into a plug and then they are color--coded to the 9- pin. The rear lights and tender pick-ups also attach to the board.

 

Chip

Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.

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Posted by BroadwayLion on Sunday, February 18, 2018 2:59 PM

SpaceMouse
I'm beginning to wonder how well this loco will fly.

 

This is a good questions. Locomotives usually do not fly.

 

ROAR

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Posted by SpaceMouse on Sunday, February 18, 2018 3:35 PM

I thought I'd post a couple pictures and see if you have any more/better/howto ideas for me. 

Chip

Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.

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Posted by SpaceMouse on Sunday, February 18, 2018 4:00 PM

Okay, I'm thinking about it. I was just being lazy. I didn't want to tear into the engine. If I hard wire anything though, it will be a harness. I know sound is coming eventually and no point doing it twice. 

Chip

Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.

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Posted by garya on Sunday, February 18, 2018 4:02 PM

rrinker

 Most of the 8 pin ones from TCS and Digitrax terminate in a 9 pin on the decoder.

The real answer is to rip out the factory boards which are often more trouble than they're worth, and hard ware the decoder. It leaves more room for the speaker or a not as tiny decoder.

                                           --Randy

 

 

I've trimmed the heat shrink on Soundtraxx decoders to get to the 9-pin plug.  Worth a try, or tear it all out...

Gary

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Posted by SpaceMouse on Sunday, February 18, 2018 4:04 PM

BroadwayLion
Locomotives usually do not fly.

I'm thinking a water ballon launcher like in college. Four strands of surgical tubing with a funnel pocket in the center. Two guys stand straight as posts holding the tubing while the third guy pulls the funnel to stretching limit. 

Effective range 1 city block. 

Chip

Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.

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Posted by SpaceMouse on Wednesday, February 21, 2018 2:00 AM

SpaceMouse
ve any more/better/howto ideas for me. 

 

 
So I've been spending a lot more time thinking about this rewire that is probably good for me--especially since I really can't do anything until the replacement trucks arrive. 
 
What is bothering me is the six extra wires in the tender. The two for the rear light and 4 power leads to the truck. The board does a good job of organizing those 6 wires--admittedly by using up all availible space in the tender. 
 
I guess I'm looking for ideas on how I should encorporate these 6 wires into the 9 that come with the decoder wiring--and be neat about it. 
 
 

Chip

Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.

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Posted by rrinker on Wednesday, February 21, 2018 7:19 AM

2 right rail pickups tie together, go to the red decoder wire.

2 left rail pickups tie together, go to the black decoder wire.

blue wire from the headlight plus blue wire to the backup light tie together and go to the blue wire on the decoder.

white to the loco for headlight, yellow to the other wire of the backup light.

Either tie the pickup wires together then tap off, or just make a 3 way splice with the approriate decoder wire.

Or use a strip of copper PCB - saw cuts to make a series of parallel bu unconnected pads, solder all right side wires to one pad, left wires to another, etc. That way you cna shorten the truck pickup wires in the tender (just glue the little PCB on the tender, and the only wires that need to be slightly longish would be the ones to the decoder itself, to give you enough slack to lift it up and pull the 9 pin to remove it.

                                  --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by woodone on Wednesday, February 21, 2018 8:42 AM

Like Randy said- rip out the board- ring out the wires on the plug that go to the tender. Don’t forget resistors for the lights!

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Posted by SpaceMouse on Wednesday, February 21, 2018 11:31 AM

rrinker
Or use a strip of copper PCB - saw cuts to make a series of parallel bu unconnected pads, solder all right side wires to one pad, left wires to another, etc

That's what I was looking for. I have a ton of these. I knew the wiring, but the idea of each of the power leads having 3 wires attached... I'll show them, I'll make my own mini-board. 

Chip

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Posted by SpaceMouse on Wednesday, February 21, 2018 11:33 AM

woodone
Don’t forget resistors for the lights!

Probably wood have. I don't know what kind of lights are in there. (yet)

Chip

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Posted by 7j43k on Wednesday, February 21, 2018 12:54 PM

SpaceMouse

 

 
BroadwayLion
Locomotives usually do not fly.

 

I'm thinking a water ballon launcher like in college. Four strands of surgical tubing with a funnel pocket in the center. Two guys stand straight as posts holding the tubing while the third guy pulls the funnel to stretching limit. 

Effective range 1 city block. 

 

 

A funnel, eh?  Seems a little risky for the, uh, launch-master.  We used to use a plastic bowl.

 

Ed

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Posted by hobo9941 on Monday, March 12, 2018 12:25 AM

SpaceMouse
Okay, I'm thinking about it. I was just being lazy. I didn't want to tear into the engine

Welcome to the club. That said, I have found most of my DCC installs ended up being hard wired. "DCC Ready" means different things to different people.Big Smile

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Posted by richg1998 on Monday, March 12, 2018 1:25 AM

SpaceMouse

So I have a 2-6-0 from Roundhouse. A new one. I have older ones I've already installed decoders into. The old ones have 8-pin harnesses. Plenty of room for decoders. 

The new one is set up for sound. It has a one inch receptical for a speaker. and enough space for a pretty large one. 

Above the circuit board there is about 3/16" clearance. 

The what were they thinking is that they set it up with a 9-pin harness. As soon as anything is plugged into it, it exceeds the 3/16 inch clearance. 

Every single sound decoder I've seen for small steam uses an 8-pin harness. I have two decoders that would easily fit if it had an 8-pin harness. 

It looks like I'm going to have to splice in an 8-pin harness if I want to get this loco to work.  

I'm beginning to wonder how well this loco will fly.

 

Not a big deal. Some years ago I bought the 4-4-0, 2-6-0 and 2-8-0, DCC ready with 9 pin and DC adapter. I unsoldered the 9 pin socket wires and the socket for the tender light. Moved that socket and soldered in the SoundTraxx 750. Put in the speaker. Problem solved. I think I modified the PC board mounting a little for clearance.  The locos run fine. No overheat issues with the decoders. Sometimes you just have to make it work.

I did not touch anything in the engine. A one evening job for a loco tender. Just match the wires.

Been some years. I posted pictures here but PB is gone. Sorry.

Not going to bother with another photo hosting site.

Rich

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Posted by RR_Mel on Monday, March 12, 2018 8:54 AM

I found some 9 pin harnesses on eBay and used them in my diesels.  Here’s an old post on my blog of the install into a Model Power E7A.
 
 
 
 
Mel
 
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My Model Railroad   
 
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Posted by wjstix on Monday, March 12, 2018 10:02 AM

Of course those Roundhouse engines came out originally as kits from MDC decades before DCC came about. I guess once Athearn took the line over they did the best they could to make them "DCC friendly". But IIRC it's a pretty small tender so there's only so much you can do.

Stix
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Posted by BRAKIE on Monday, March 12, 2018 12:03 PM

SpaceMouse

Okay, I'm thinking about it. I was just being lazy. I didn't want to tear into the engine. If I hard wire anything though, it will be a harness. I know sound is coming eventually and no point doing it twice. 

 

Check a  N Scale decoder..They work like their HO brethern.

Larry

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Posted by richg1998 on Monday, March 12, 2018 2:18 PM

When Athearn first sold them with sound, they came with an MRC decoder in a new tender frame in the 4-4-0. I bought one and put in a SoundTraxx 750.

You can see this frame and the older tender frames at at HO Seeker page and a better motor with a flywheel.

I had a couple older pre Athearn 2-6-0 with the MDC Wild West Livery and older style tender frame and bought the new tender frames and new trucks from Athearn some years ago. More room and a speaker location. Eyes went bad and gave those to Space Mouse. They had the same motor and flywheel as the Athearn do.

I still have a couple older MDC with the larger open frame and no flywheel like the MDC Boxcab motor.

Also bought the DCC pickups and plastic windows for the 2-6-0 locos.

I have pre and post Athearn Roundhouse locos.

About four years ago I asked an Athearn rep at a train show in West Springfield, MA if those steamers were coming back and they said yes but nothing so far and I seriously doubt they ever will. Just no demand anymore. The detail does not compare to the Bachmann steamers. I have both.

Rich

If you ever fall over in public, pick yourself up and say “sorry it’s been a while since I inhabited a body.” And just walk away.

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Posted by SpaceMouse on Tuesday, March 13, 2018 2:54 PM

richg1998
I did not touch anything in the engine. A one evening job for a loco tender. Just match the wires.

Unfortunately all the wires coming from the engine are black. They color cooridinate from the board to the harness only. I don't know how I'd be able to match them without taking the engine apart. 

Chip

Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.

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Posted by SpaceMouse on Tuesday, March 13, 2018 2:56 PM

BRAKIE
Check a  N Scale decoder..They work like their HO brethern.

I have a couple for that reason. I will if I need the space. I think if that board is gone I'll have plenty of room.  

Chip

Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.

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Posted by SpaceMouse on Tuesday, March 13, 2018 3:00 PM

richg1998
I have pre and post Athearn Roundhouse locos.

I have two pre and one post Athearn. The post Athearn is much more cheaply made, but it does have the spearker receptical. Those paarts you sent will do the trick. But I'm not going to tackle it until I get at least the lower trackwork done. 

Chip

Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.

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Posted by richg1998 on Tuesday, March 13, 2018 5:13 PM

The Athearn tender design with speaker hole was for a rectangular PC board type sound decoder like my first 4-4-0 had with the MRC decoder. Makes sense.

Edit. Finally found the photos in my external hard drive. The original MRC decoder was a rectangular decoder the size of the metal frame. Low profile. A connector on the bottom of the decoder board was to connect the light on the tender. The DCC ready version was right in the center of the PC board that I had to move but no big deal.

I started working on modifying cars in the fifties. You worked with what you had and did not complain.

Rich

If you ever fall over in public, pick yourself up and say “sorry it’s been a while since I inhabited a body.” And just walk away.

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Posted by richg1998 on Tuesday, March 13, 2018 6:43 PM

If you go to HO Seeker and look at the 4-4-0, the only one, you can see the one with the MRC decoder I had. I believe their first Roundhouse sound loco. The DCC ready followed. The 4-4-0, 2-6-0 and 2-8-0 are all identical except for drivers. The PC board in the tender was the real issue.

Rumor some years ago they would go with SoundTraxx like Bachmann but never happened as far as I know.

The 4-4-0 is a Plain Jane next to the Bachmann 4-4-0. I have both.

Rich

If you ever fall over in public, pick yourself up and say “sorry it’s been a while since I inhabited a body.” And just walk away.

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