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Two decoders fried in the last week

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  • Member since
    August, 2017
  • 9 posts
Two decoders fried in the last week
Posted by Gary Morton on Saturday, December 30, 2017 9:38 PM

The first was in a Tenshodo brass GN R2 2-8-8-2 to which a Tsunami decoder had been added by a previous owner (I bought it off eBay). There is no model # on the decoder, but it looks like a TSU-1100, though it may be an earlier version. The second was in a brand new BLI GN S2 4-8-4 with Paragon 3 sound.

This is a new layout, and I've been debugging track glitches for the past couple of weeks, making sure all locos would run the whole layout. It is a DCC HO layout using a Digitrax Evolution (DCS 210 booster/command station and a DCS500 throttle). Here's the history:

R2: Tested the R2 first. It ran the layout fine with no derailments, except it would not negotiate a couple of 22" curves, which did not surprise me (all other curves on the layout are 30" or 36"). I ran it for a couple of days, avoiding the tight curves. It ran fine, all DCC functions worked. I set that loco aside, off the track, and tested the others. The S2 would not negotiate those curves either, so I re-laid that section of track to gain 2 more inches of radius --- all the room would allow. That solved the problem for the S2. Then I put the R2 back on the track to see if it would handle the wider radius. It immediately tripped the breaker in the DCS210. It had been off the track, undisturbed, for several days. Made sure all wheels on the loco and tender were on the track. Kept tripping the breaker. With this loco track power is picked up by the loco drivers on one side, tender wheels on the other side. The tender feeds to the decoder in the loco via the coupling strap. Separated the loco from the tender. That solved the short, but of course it would not run since the decoder was getting no power from the tender pickup. Pulled the shell off the loco, looked for frayed wires, etc. All looked OK. So removed the decoder from the loco entirely, snipping all wires. Connected track power to the red and black leads on the now-bare decoder. It tripped the breaker. Removed the 220uf capacitor connected to the decoder, thinking the cap might be bad. Still tripped the breaker. So the short is in the decoder itself. 

S2: The S2 was also derailing on one of the turnouts. I discovered it would track it fine if not pulling a train. Apparently the load caused the loco to enter the turnout at a slightly different angle, and a wheel would catch on the guard rail. Ran it around the layout a couple of times with no train, then killed track power and added a few cars to the loco --- about half as many as before, to see if it still failed on that turnout. Turned track power back on and the breaker immediately tripped. Checked the loco and all the cars for proper tracking. Still the breaker tripped. So then removed all the cars, leaving only the S2 and its tender on the track. It kept tripping the breaker. It had been powered down for maybe 5 minutes. In this loco all the electronics are in the tender. A connecting cable feeds power from the decoder to the loco motor, headlight, and smoke heater. Disconnected that cable and removed the loco from the track, leaving only the tender. It tripped the breaker. Then I put the tender on the bench, removed both trucks, and connected the axle wipers to the track with jumper cables. The trucks were no longer connected to the tender body, the only connection was the two wires from the trucks to the decoder. Still tripped the breaker. So it looks like this decoder has an internal short also. 

I also have a Walthers F7 A&B pair which are running fine. But now I'm afraid to run them, lest they also suddenly develop internal shorts. I did use my multimeter to see if the command station/booster was somehow sending some sort of power surge through the tracks when cycling track power on and off. Nothing registered; AC track power is a steady 13.75V. But I'm not sure that meter would show a spike if it lasted for only a few milliseconds. 

Does anyone have any suggestions as to why this is happening? Locos run fine for a few days, then suddenly develop shorts for no apparent reason? Are there any combinations of CV settings that could short out a decoder? Replacing decoders every couple weeks could get expensive!

Any suggestions would be appreciated!

 

Tags: DCC , Digitrax , shorts
  • Member since
    January, 2010
  • From: Chi-Town
  • 7,143 posts
Posted by zstripe on Friday, January 05, 2018 4:18 PM

Did You follow any of the advice given to You on the Modeltrain forum?

If Not....You should try......I would more than likely be repeating what They said. Especially the quarter test.

Good Luck! Big Smile

Frank

  • Member since
    September, 2004
  • From: Dearborn Station
  • 17,227 posts
Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, January 06, 2018 5:46 AM

Gary Morton

Does anyone have any suggestions as to why this is happening? Locos run fine for a few days, then suddenly develop shorts for no apparent reason? Are there any combinations of CV settings that could short out a decoder? Replacing decoders every couple weeks could get expensive!

Any suggestions would be appreciated! 

No suggestions, just a few observations.

No, there are no combinations of CVs that could short a decoder.

From your description, I would have less reason to question the locomotives or the decoders than I would to question the wiring or the DCC command station.

The odds of two decoders developing internal shorts without some outside influence is highly unlikely.

Rich

Alton Junction

  • Member since
    February, 2002
  • From: Mpls/St.Paul
  • 10,574 posts
Posted by wjstix on Monday, January 08, 2018 10:54 AM

FWIW you don't need to 'snip' the wires in a hardwire decoder installation. The decoder is connected to the wiring harness with a 9-pin connection. You can just remove the decoder by unplugging the harness, leaving the wires intact.

Stix
  • Member since
    August, 2017
  • 9 posts
Posted by Gary Morton on Monday, January 08, 2018 7:50 PM

wjstix

FWIW you don't need to 'snip' the wires in a hardwire decoder installation. The decoder is connected to the wiring harness with a 9-pin connection. You can just remove the decoder by unplugging the harness, leaving the wires intact.

 

 
Aaargh! Wasn't aware that the Tsunami harness was connected via a JST-type connector. It was concealed by the purple sleeve they wrap around their decoders. Thanks for that info.

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