My lack of electronics experience is showing.
If a steam locomotive has DCC with sound installed, but I want to put an upgraded decoder into it, how much of a job is it to change decoders? Do decoders of different brands have standard wire coding (red always the same function, green the same function)? I know that some are hardwired and others are plug in but if the wires are the same colors, I can see that shouldn't be too difficult to overcome.
Since I haven't yet purchased the locomotive, nor do I know what new decoder I would put in, I realize there may additional things for me to consider.
Thank you for your thoughts,
Richard
Hi Richard.
Most locomotives use some form of plug to connect all the various wires to the decoder. If that is the case the only thing you need to worry about is getting the plug the right way round in the socket.
If you do decide to hardwire the decoder, most decoder wire colours are pretty much standard:
- Black - left side track pick up
- Red - right side track pick up
- Orange - motor lead
- Gray - motor lead
- Blue - common lead for accesories (positive)
- White - front headlight
- Yellow - rear light
- Accessory functions are usually green, pink, etc.
- Speaker leads can be brown or purple.
Where you may run into some confusion is what colours the manufacturer has used to connect to all the actual bits and pieces. Most recent locomotives follow the same colour scheme as the decoders but you may get some older locomotives where everything is either black or red.
Something to consider, since you haven't purchased the locomotive yet, is to save yourself some money and just buy the locomotive in the DC version and then install your own decoder of choice. Otherwise, you are spending money on a decoder that you are just going to toss in a drawer.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
Speaker impedance should be noted on any retro fit.
Older Loksound applications used 100 ohm speakers if I remember correctly.
QSI, Soundtraxx, new Loksounds and TCS use 4 to 8 ohm speakers.
I do not know about Digi Trax or MTH.
As Dave mentions above, consider buying the non DCC version and install a new LokSound Select or SoundTraxx with Tony's Sugar Cube Mini or Micro Speakers. Go to Tony's Train Exhange website to get info on these speakers.
I have heard good reports on the TCS sound decoders. I have not used a DigiTrax decoder so I can not speak to them. I am sure they are a good product as well.
Chris
There can be size differences between sound decoders as well. With steamers, the decoder typically goes in the tender so there's usually room for larger ones.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
I just bought a new BLI locomotive and all the wires are black and white. To change the decoder would require a wiring job. This decoder looks like it was made specifically for this frame. There are no plugs that will fit a standard decoder that I'm familiar with.
The locomotive stall current (how many AMPs the motor draws) should, as well, be taken into consideration for installing a decoder with a lower AMP rated motor controller which could burn out the decoder.
All the best.
Joe F
RDG1519I do not know about Digi Trax or MTH.
I use Digitrax sound decoders, they're not the best but they're cheap and "good enough". Generally they're also going in lower end engines that I'm upgrading, so the bar isn't that high. But most of all, they're "good enough" for my untrained (getit haha) ears.
For higher end locos, I buy with DCC+Sound pre-installed, and prefer LokSound when given the option.
Thank you all for the replies. I knew there was more to this than plug and unplug, like amps and speakers needs. I do know that I may also need to change the light bulbs in older locos.
As stated before, I'm not great in electronics, but the idea of just buying a decoder and installing in a loco I already have did hit a nerve somehow. Throwing something as expensive as a sound decoder isn't appealing to me.
I have several older IHC locos that I could do a little praticing on. I'm sure I can find on google somewhere a "how to" video. Now to overcome my lack of experience in soldering. I have a couple of higher end models I could do after I figure out what I am doing (or not do if I am a total klutz).
There was a recent post on "how many projects you have going at once." At the moment I'm planning a new layout with a sector plate or similar staging (which I bought a piece at a show to day to move that along), a Walthers caboose with binding trucks (actually I have several that probably have the problem, solution in Jan MR, which I just got and need to read) and installing or changiing decoders as well as some kits started. Maybe I should stop thinking and get doing.
Thanks again for the thoughts and ideas. Now to go clean the bench so I can do something besides sit here and (over)think.
Have fun,
Generally a loco with a sound decoder does not have to be upgraded unless you are a rivet counter. Even that is iffy. Sometimes some find a particular locos has the wrong horn.
You did not mention a particular loco.
Many do upgrade Bachmann locos that have "non sound" onboard in steam or diesel. Those so far are low end Lenz decoders. I have had a couple.
Bachmann onboard sound uses Tsunami decoders.
Other brands will vary. A Google search might help but that can varywith older runs of sound locos.
You will find many brands have different ways of connecting decoders.
For older locos, current draw at 12 vdc is important. Most decoders are limited to 1 amp including lights which can add up if 12 volt light bulbs are used.
The motor contacts cannot connect in anyway to the pickups. Some motors only two contacts to the frame. Some motors, each motor half is connected to the brush.
Rich
If you ever fall over in public, pick yourself up and say “sorry it’s been a while since I inhabited a body.” And just walk away.
The loco is a Bachmann-Spectrum 2-8-0 with an MRC decoder.
After thinking over the number of projects in progress and cost of just a new decoder, decided to just buy the loco and leave it as is. (Barely more than the cost of a new decoder.) I think Rich's last post cemented the deal. I have a stable full of DC locos which I can sell or take my time learning to put decoders in while still being able to run some sound steamers.
Thanks again,
If the 2-8-0 has the decoder plugged into an eight pin socket, just plug in a better brand if you count all the rivets. MRC decoders can be problematic. If you are happy with it, stick with it.
A hardwire install is a challenge.
Generally an onboard with sound will be the cheapest way to go. Diesel or steam. Just be careful with private sales and read the description of what you are buying carefully.
SoundTraxx site and TCS site both have photos and instals for different locos.