It is being discussed quite a lot on the Yahoo SoundTraxx DCC Group.
Try one before passing judgement.
Rich
If you ever fall over in public, pick yourself up and say “sorry it’s been a while since I inhabited a body.” And just walk away.
We actually already had this discussion..
They ARE smaller than the micro-Tsunami, and rated at 1 amp instead of .75 amp, so the improved the main chip somewhat - the chip completely filled the width of the micro-Tsu board, so if these are smaller, that chip has to be smaller. Yet can handle higher current.
The real key is if they are the same recordings or not. If they are, then the horns will continue to be weak. The new price point though, compared to the others, is what the Tsunami ought to be selling for, Loksound has been undercutting them for some time now.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
For any JMRI users out there, a decoder definition file has been created for the Econami.
It's currently in the "Files" section of the JMRI Yahoo! Group if you want to install it manually, and it should be in the upcoming JMRI 4.1.1 release.
davidmbedardThe only....and I mean ONLY advancement they made....according to the manual.....is the support of CV 5 and 6. Everything else looks like a rehash from the Surroundtraxx System.
I thought the "advancement" as the name implies, is the price. Or am I not "getting it"? Old street price was around $8x, new street price $6x. Thus, economical?
Personally I have to snicker at the names the companies are coming up with these days, like "Wow", and "Econami" ... the latter sort of has a euro sort of spelling seems sort of goofy to me. I married to a Brit and she gives me a perspective I didn't used to have and I've noticed that many things marketed as "Euro" in America are really not Euro much at all. Now my wife observes things all the time she sees that are strange and odd and she has a saying that really says it all - "only in America!" Now America is really good at some things but at others ... like the naming conventions are sometimes really funky or goofy so I have to say often she is right sometimes.
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
Being discussed quite a lot in the Yahoo SoundTraxx forum with many SoundTraxx users.
Also, one persons experience below.
Experience, not opinion.
The ECO-100 is smaller (27 x 10.5 x 5mm) Tsunami Micro sister. One of the nice things about this decoder is its easy programming and the newly added auxiliary FX 3 and 4 outputs. The Tsunami Micro only had the front and rear light outputs so generally an additional function decoder was needed to animate custom lighting. Included sounds are similar but the fireman Fred sounds are mostly gone. There is a watering sound sequence and a whistle road crossing sequence that is always welcome. Loco sounds are still there and add a lot of variety. The really nice thing is that there are multiple loco types within a single decoder so one decoder can be used from a 4-4-0 on up to an articulated. The Steam decoder has 16 whistles to choose from. Use of the on board equalizer is the same as the Tsunami so the overall sound can be tailored to individual taste. This decoder fixes the start, mid and high volts settings and now has the usual CVs 2, 5 & 6 to custom tailor the motor response. Driver chuff sync is a bit challenging but for N Scale steam. DDE is also similar to the Tsunami Micro. The decoder continues the Soundtraxx tradition of a solid wired sound decoder now at a very reasonable price structure. The price is a keeper at MSRP 79.95.
Just to mess with the Soundtraxx supporters, the Loksound Select Micro sells for $81.99 and while it is almost exactly the same width and length, it is thinner than the Econami by 1.2mm (24%).
Nobody has mentioned heat buildup. Does the Econami get hot like I believe other Soundtraxx decoders do? The Loksound Micro doesn't generate enough heat to bother anything.
Granted the Loksound Micro is only .75 amp but nothing that I have put the Loksound into has ever come close to needing more amperage than the decoder can supply.
For my money, I will stick with Loksound. They work great!
There! That ought to stir the pot a bit!
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
Dave,
At least your not insisting there's ONLY been one change.
Loksound has a good product from what I hear, but just never needed anything other than a Tsunami and that hasn't been recently.
Of course, in HOn3 I'm in a bit of a captive audience. Cost of decoder is already rolled into the loco cost. The package remains an outstanding value and I personally have seen no need to replace perfectly good decoders.
I'd have to buy more brass to develop a need for more steam decoders and that won't be anytime soon. Now, a dozen EMD diesel decoders could be put to use, but the budget isn't there for that right now, even for economical ones.
Then there's the fact that my decoder volume is turned way down. People want to make a big deal of minor differences, but they're there to provide background noise for the most part the way I see it, not be the star of my model showcase.
But I know how it is when you wanna rock
I, too, am curious about the heat issue. My TSU-750-equipped locos are babied by running 12.5 volts and that makes a big difference. I don't know this for a fact, but I suspect that the Econami is built on what is basically the low end version of what will be the new nextgen Tsunami. Given it's likely the version with the least HP under the hood, it's probably got a slow clock speed, etc, that should run pretty cool on a chassis set up to keep the faster stuff chilled that will be coming along soon. My best guess there, so we'll have to see how close I actually am.
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
Hi Mike:
Each to his own! I really didn't intend to put down Soundtraxx's products. I have a couple of the old LCD-100s and I'm quite happy with them. I certainly don't intend to replace them any time soon, if ever.
Nah, I didn't take it that way. I just wanted to point out there's many things at work in one's decisions about sound decoders.
Sometimes this sort of discussion gets wildly off track, sort of like talking about cars. Sure, I'd LIKE to have a shiny new Porsche 911 Turbo, but I feel very lucky to be driving a 97 LandCruiser -- and also that I'm not missing much from meeting my expectations. You can tell some folks -- not you -- have a pretty chronic case of decoder insecurity or they hope to persuade someone else that they should have one.
My dog is just too lazy to get into that fight
hon30critter...the Loksound Select Micro sells for $81.99...
And the Soundtraxx Econami sells for $64.
CSX Robert hon30critter ...the Loksound Select Micro sells for $81.99... And the Soundtraxx Econami sells for $64.
hon30critter ...the Loksound Select Micro sells for $81.99...
Yeah, that's street price. Dave was using the MSRP because he was comparing the Loksound MSRP to the Econami MSRP someone cited in the post before his. I suspect the Loksound decoder is around $65 with the usual discounts applied. basically they;re the same price, it just depends what your preference in features and brand is.
Plus I think you need something to load sounds into the Loksound if you want something other than the factory ones. The Econami offers different choices on the decoder, but there is no uploadable capability. As I mentioned in another post, it wouldn't surprise me if the next gen Tsunami has uploadable capability when it hits the market. The Econami is a half step in that direction from previous Soundtraxx decoders.
mlehmanYeah, that's street price. Dave was using the MSRP because he was comparing the Loksound MSRP to the Econami MSRP someone cited in the post before his. I suspect the Loksound decoder is around $65 with the usual discounts applied. basically they;re the same price, it just depends what your preference in features and brand is.
No, Dave was quoting street price, that's why I mentioned the street price of the Econami. The MSRP on the select micro is $99.99.
OK, thanks for the correction. So the Econami is about 20% cheaper than the Loksound. That does make a difference for some people.
Any of the name resellers will load your choice of sound on Loksound decoders. Anything in their library.
Upload IS the way to go, another reason I've come to not think Tsunamis are so awesome. If my dealer is out of a TSU-AT1000 EMD First Gen, I'm stalled. Can't put a decoder in my loco. If I have a Loksounbd loaded with Alco 251 and I've set that loco aside and instead want to get an EMD FT running, I can simply swap the Alco sounds for an EMD 567 and continue on my way.
Yes, you need proprietary hardware. Same with any of the loadable decoders - QSI and Digitrax. But many DCC systems need a program track booster just to set CVs on Tsunamis. Loksound decoders don;t need that. However, for the same price at the program track boosters, you can get the Lokprogrammer unit and not only change out the sounds, but also read and write all the CVs (and there are thousands) in a couple of minutes. Far faster than any DCC system with or without a program track booster, even faster than SPROG, which is one of the fastest programming devices there is.
My Econami-100 diesel decoder gets EXTREMELY hot within 6 seconds of being put onto the track, and a little red light comes on, in addition to the blue light. The sounds don't come on. I suspect something got screwed up with the decoder.
Onto LokSound for me!
gatrhumpy!
OK! Another modeller converted to Loksound! Geez, I sound like a bible thumper! (Is that ok to say here? No offense to any religious types.)
Seriously, if you haven't done it already I would send the Econami decoder back for a refund. I doubt that's how they're supposed to operate.
Can't. I bought it at a train show, and I grinded down part of the decoder to make room in the shell, which killed the warranty.
gatrhumpy Can't. I bought it at a train show, and I grinded down part of the decoder to make room in the shell, which killed the warranty.
Those darn Tsunamis!!
Im with Mike, low volumes is the rule, Tsunami's work just fine, this love for Loksound on this forum is another topic
I'm currently installing a Soundcar chip into a caboose, which I originally thought was kind of hokey, until I used it. Very cool indeed, all with low volumes so one thing doesn't overpower the rest.
My TSU750 never overheats because my volume is low. No heat sink is used.
Your experience may vary, especially if you grind on sensitive electronic components. Good luck with Loksound
"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination."-Albert Einstein
http://gearedsteam.blogspot.com/
I have a number of econami's I installed in diesels both hard wired and 21 pin applications and have not had any overheating problems.
Additionally, the new eco 200 is a two amp decoder and is even thinner than the 100. It also has a nine pin harness that allows plug and play and an additional plug for a current keeper.
Marty C
Perhaps when you ground down part of the decoder you damaged it in addition to voiding the warranty?
Joe
FYI, last I heard, present line of Tsunami production is going away soon. Some components on the decoders will not be available to SoundTraxx anymore.
It still worked for more than four hours after I gently grinded down the plastic in the decoder.
Well I will stir it. Yes the Econami is thicker, but it will fit into narrow hood N scale loco's. has it is a tad bit narrower. Has a better amp for more volume. They don't get HOT! if you over load them they will shut down. Plus they have an 7 band Equalizer and the new Flex map technology lets you map to any function key. ON TOP OF THAT. THEY ARE MADE IN THE USA! Not China! And they provide very good customer support!
I thought the Econami didn't have the 7-band equalizer? *edit* Im wrong...it does have the equalizer, it doesnt have reverb. *end edit* I bought 3 of them and haven't installed them yet (2 life-like proto2000 E8's and an old Atlas RS-3) so I don't know...yet. I know the sound isn't totally correct for the E units (they're not dual 567's) but it's close enough for me because they will always be run with another unit...I can always swap decoders in the future if the sound bothers me.
I'm not trying to start anything, just here to look up info and tips on installing the Econami's because I've never used them and they are relatively new (I wanted to try something different). I will use two different speakers with them...a 1 watt 1.1" TCS speaker with enclosure in one and a 2 watt 1.06" high bass TCS speaker with enclosure in the other to see how much of a difference there really is in two virtually identical locos with the same decoder. I didn't realize the high bass speaker was rated at 2 watts until I got the speaker in my hands (but I think it shouldn't be too much of a problem). The RS-3 will use a sugarcube with homemade enclosure (I can't really count it as a comparison because of the differences in speaker placement, etc but I guess I could change the sound from an Alco 244 to the EMD 567 for demonstration purposes). I just wanted some inexpensive sound in these older locos...we'll see how they measure up to my Atlas, Genesis and BLI diesels. :)
One reason I didn't get the ECO-200 decoder is that it puts out 2 watts of sound and I didn't want to overdrive the speaker accidentally. I measured the amp draw of the E units at 1.1 stalled and around 0.7-0.8 slipping so I hope the drive never gets jammed and locks up. I guess I will be the first to test the limits of a 1A Econami.lol
Cheers!
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