Geared Steam Thanks for the quick response, hope you have better luck with #2
Thanks for the quick response, hope you have better luck with #2
I may try their audio assist to program this one
TerryinTexas
See my Web Site Here
http://conewriversubdivision.yolasite.com/
Many clueless are stuck in a time warp and are not aware that DCC is evolving.
Look at the companies that are producing digital wireless controlled train systems that are not considered DCC.
Basic DCC is strictly NMRA designed.
Tsunami and some others have been around and the original technology does not allow upgrading the sounds. They will have to come out with a new style decoder.
Also many here are not aware of how a decoder company is built and operates. Many different styles of decoders are designed and built by different technicians/engineers. That is what competition produces.
Companies on the other side of the pond are different.
Rich
If you ever fall over in public, pick yourself up and say “sorry it’s been a while since I inhabited a body.” And just walk away.
Yeah, keep us posted on this one Terry. I'm about to finish an updated Mantua Mikado and I'd like to put a WOW decoder in and try.
Or I may go back to ESU Kinda depends on your result.
One other thing, what system is everybody using ? NCE, Digitrax, etc, and with or without JMRI? I'm curious to see if there are any individual system shortcomings with the new decoders. The reason I ask is that I have seen folks reporting that they have to disconnect KA2s with certain systems for programming. I have not seen that issue. I recently did a Micro-Tsunami with a KA2, no problems at all!
For the record, my system is an NCE PHP with a Power Pax and JMRI 3.4
Karl
NCE über alles!
In the past when programing a KA2 with a tsunami i had to disconect the KA2
not sure about the new Wow Sound Decoder only got as far as changing the address
before it took off running on its own
Im using JMRI Test rel 3,5,3 (it has all the Wow files)
Hooked to a digitrax zephyr and a Powerpax booster to the programing track
Returned the decoder on 9/8 still waiting on the replacement
one thing i don;t like is their braking system
i really don't want to mess with pressing buttons to brake
How else would you activate a brake? Every decoder that has an actual brake (not jsut turnign on a sound, but actually slows down the loco) uses a button to activate it. You can always just turn down the throttle, with less or no momentum, in which case the loco will brake when turning down the throttle. No common DCC system yet has a variable brake lever that could send controlling packets to a decoder to operate as a brake. Closest you cna get to that is use a TAT throttle as a jump throttle on a Zephyr and have the decoder set for no momentum, so it's all simulated in the throttle.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
rrinker How else would you activate a brake? Every decoder that has an actual brake (not jsut turnign on a sound, but actually slows down the loco) uses a button to activate it. You can always just turn down the throttle, with less or no momentum, in which case the loco will brake when turning down the throttle. No common DCC system yet has a variable brake lever that could send controlling packets to a decoder to operate as a brake. Closest you cna get to that is use a TAT throttle as a jump throttle on a Zephyr and have the decoder set for no momentum, so it's all simulated in the throttle. --Randy
Well Randy Go to the TCS web site and look at the video for Prototype operations
http://www.tcsdcc.com/
or watch
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfpdwOxQ0B4#t=31
It expains the braking operation
They refer to throttle control as "Slot Car" operation
I think what they have done is extended the momentum then by double clicking on # 7
you lessen the momentum by 20 percent till after several times the loco comes to a stop you can release the brake by clicking on # 6
I'm hoping there is a way to deactivate this feature as it's far more than i want to do to run a train
That's pretty much the same as Tsunami and QSI's braking works. You put momentum in teh decoder, then you can turn off the throttle and the loco keeps moving, slowing down very gradually. Hit the brake button applies the brakes and slows down faster than the momentum setting, releasing is more or less a lap setting where it maintains at the current rate, gradually slowing down at the momentum rate.
You don;t HAVE to do that - what they mean by 'slot car' is a the same as any decoder with CV3 and 4 set to 0 - it responds instantly to the throttle setting. Putting some momentum in, for acceleration, on QSI and Loksound anyway, means you cna crank the throttle to get the prime mover to 'load up' or the cuffs on a steam loco to become stronger, whiel the loco accelerates slowly, even with the throttle wide open. Converse on slowing down - Soem momentum makes the train handle a bit more realisticilly. A LOT of momentum makes it so that unless you have a barn size layout, or don;t mind the loco making 20 laps of a smalel rlayout before stopping, you must use the brake to actually stop it. But this is all at the user's discretion, you can chose to use this feature or not. You can always set deceleration momentum to zero, but slowly turn down the throttle know so the train doesn't just stop on a dime. Or you can use a larger momentum setting, shut off the throttle, and bring the train to a stop using the braking feature. Your choice.
Yep but what I am trying to avoid is using throttle buttons all together since I use UT-4 Digitrax throttles
(which are as close to one handed as you can get}
With the UT-4 I'd have to use 2 hands to push the #7 button
one to push the shift and the other to push #7
See Photo>
http://www.digitrax.com/static/apps/products/throttles/ut4/images/UT4_jpg_2000x2000_q85.jpg
which defeats the purpose of a one handed throttle
I can control the loco fine with just a bit of momentum and a slow start and stop with the throttle knob
with one hand leaving the other hand free to aid in switching and picking the couplers when needed
also for switching there is no need for braking
I've added a small amount momentum to all my locos as it helps when the grand kids come over to keep locos on the rails
I'm hoping i'll be able to disable the braking feature
I have no doubts that the brake feature is NOT a requirement. If it works even slightly like the others, unless you have a LOT of momentum enabled, it wouldn't really do anything. I can't imagine anyone setting it up so that the only way to actually stop the loco is to engage the brake. Even with crazy levels of momentum, I'm sure the loco will still stop (eventually) just by turning the throttle to stop. I also can;t see TCS leaving out a rate of change threshold to automatically activate a brake squeal, should you want the sound. I've seen no inclination so far of TCS being insnae, so the chances of there truly being no way to stop a loco without pressing the brake button is slim to none, and slim just took the last train out of town.
Well, I've had my WOWSound decoder installed for a few hours and am quite pleased with it.
I used double-sided foam tape to mount it to the underside of the coal load in a P2K 0-8-0, then mounted the speaker facing downward, again using foam tape, to the underside of the deck behind the coal bunker. Since I used the "Steam-8pin" decoder, with the eight-pin DCC plug, that allowed me to keep all of the speaker wiring in the shell half of the tender. I replaced the Life-Like bulbs with LEDs and mounted the resistors to the DCC socket assembly, which I affixed to the floor weight with foam tape
I'm quite pleased with the motor control and the sound. The sound chamber I had was a bit too tall to fit, so I mounted the speaker without it, "for now". Still, I was pleased with how it sounded, so I'll leave it off. Now, this was intended as a "quick-n-dirty" temporary installation to see how things would fit, but I'm quite happy with how it sounds, even without drilling holes in the tender to let the sound out.
One thing I definitely want to do is to move the "Rotate Whistle" function off of F9, maybe down to F25 or somewhere else-- personally, I like to have any function that reconfigures the decoder moved well outside of the F0-F12 range. TCS makes that easy, though.
I'll probably also move the brake to a function easier to get to on a Digitrax UT4D. I've used that kind of braking on a friend's layout and quite enjoy using it.
Wednesday night I'll take it to the weekly work session at the Ops Road Show layout, where we have a set of rollers I can put it on. Then, I'll synchronize the chuffing.
-Fritz Milhaupt, Publications Editor, Pere Marquette Historical Society, Inc.http://www.pmhistsoc.org
fmilhaupt Well, I've had my WOWSound decoder installed for a few hours and am quite pleased with it. I used double-sided foam tape to mount it to the underside of the coal load in a P2K 0-8-0, then mounted the speaker facing downward, again using foam tape, to the underside of the deck behind the coal bunker. Since I used the "Steam-8pin" decoder, with the eight-pin DCC plug, that allowed me to keep all of the speaker wiring in the shell half of the tender. I replaced the Life-Like bulbs with LEDs and mounted the resistors to the DCC socket assembly, which I affixed to the floor weight with foam tape I'm quite pleased with the motor control and the sound. The sound chamber I had was a bit too tall to fit, so I mounted the speaker without it, "for now". Still, I was pleased with how it sounded, so I'll leave it off. Now, this was intended as a "quick-n-dirty" temporary installation to see how things would fit, but I'm quite happy with how it sounds, even without drilling holes in the tender to let the sound out. One thing I definitely want to do is to move the "Rotate Whistle" function off of F9, maybe down to F25 or somewhere else-- personally, I like to have any function that reconfigures the decoder moved well outside of the F0-F12 range. TCS makes that easy, though. I'll probably also move the brake to a function easier to get to on a Digitrax UT4D. I've used that kind of braking on a friend's layout and quite enjoy using it. Wednesday night I'll take it to the weekly work session at the Ops Road Show layout, where we have a set of rollers I can put it on. Then, I'll synchronize the chuffing.
Sounds good
I'm still waitin for them to replace mine
They recomend a High Bass speaker but theres no room in the little slope tender for it
I'll be intrested to see what you think of the braking operation using F6 and F7
Got my replacement Decoder this week
Good to know they stand behind their product
Lots to like about this one
Was very happy to find the braking feature was optional
But agree One thing I definitely want to do is to move the "Rotate Whistle" function off of F9
and the small slope tender doesn't give much space for a speaker
The short video proves the need for a better speaker
this is a small plastic speaker
to much hiss sound for me but i'm not used to the steam cocks sound
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a1Hp9N-Du2o&feature=em-upload_owner
I may try a Sugar cube speaker for this one i wish there were room for a high bass speaker
Here's a cool Speaker test Video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DqeUytPfEbo
part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4eJ38DK1nw
This video demo by Gerry Hopkins came up as related to yours: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgxM2HDCgug
Watch that and tell me you'd EVER buy a Tsunami over this. I agree with one of the commenters, WOW Sound is kind of a silly name, but after listening to it, especially the fully playable whistle demonstrated on the 0-8-0, WOW is about all I can say.
Also, I am going to add keep-alives to everything they fit in.
I have to agree Randy. WOW! I wonder how long until they produce diesel versions.
Joe
rrinker This video demo by Gerry Hopkins came up as related to yours: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgxM2HDCgug Watch that and tell me you'd EVER buy a Tsunami over this. I agree with one of the commenters, WOW Sound is kind of a silly name, but after listening to it, especially the fully playable whistle demonstrated on the 0-8-0, WOW is about all I can say. Also, I am going to add keep-alives to everything they fit in. --Randy
Yes i saw that Video before i bought my decoder
I didn't care for the first loco But the 0-8-0 was a real WOW
I really need a better speaker for mine
Ive added 4 KA2s to my fleet and they are worth every penny
Installed a new speaker BIG difference
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebvsq_LhRYk&feature=em-upload_owner
Also added a wow sound to a Bachmann Berk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQmb5mU_8OY&feature=em-upload_owner
but not able to set momentum as Decoder pro files for that option are still being worked on
SEE NOTE FROM JMRI below read bottom up
Some of the "Writes" work some don't Road# Speed Curve Were successful Writes Momentum Settings under the basic paine did not take effect Programing on the Programing track Using JMRI Rel 3.53 and a Digitrax Zephyr with a power pax booster
I have a Wow Sound decoder ordered from Litchfiled Station, and in anticipation of installing it in my Bachmann Daylight. I have been reading the online install instructions on the TCS site. I became confused about the references to sound mode vs. light mode so sent them an email.
Here's what their tech came back with :
"The WOW Sound decoder has so many things, and all throttles that we know of only have up to 12 buttons, even though the NMRA supports up to 28! So we break down functions / features into two sections. Press button 8 twice and it toggles between the two groups. Light mode.... turn on your lights. Sound Mode ... play your sounds. In short buttons 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10 etc. all do two things! Think of it as a two speed transmission"
Well, I'm now too happy about that. I use NCE with wi-fi, a USB adapter and an iTouch Ipod running WiThrottle, and all 28 functions are readily available right on the screen. Even if I just use the NCE dogbone, there still is access to 28 functions. Isn't this going backwards to 1999? I don't want to have to toggle back and forth between two sets of function tables to go between sound and lights. could someone please verify if this is true? Can you set the software so everything is within reach for controllers that have 28 functions? Thanks! Bob J
The real reason why they did this? So that lights and the sounds don;t overlap. It's common to do things like put the ditch lights on F1 and F2, maybe trigged by F2 so when you blow the horn, the ditch lights flash per most common US practice. But what about a rooftop beacon? So you put that on F3, then every time you turn the beacon on and off, you get an air release, or coupler crash, or whatever sound is also on F3 - completely unrealistic.
The easiest access to all 28 functions is probably with the WiThrottle, on every brand of DCC's handset, it's awkward at best, they are not directly avaialble on anyone's system (can you imagine, an extra 16 or so buttons just to get the extra functions without pushing a shift or some other key first, just how big these things would be?), so I think it's great keeping everything within the first 12, which ARE directly accessible on most systems.
There never really was a reason to have 28 functions anyway, byt MRC's marketing machine sort of forced the issue. WHat do we get on those higher functions with sound decoders? Silly things like radio chatter, train crashes, and station IDs. And barnyard sounds.
rrinker The real reason why they did this? So that lights and the sounds don;t overlap. It's common to do things like put the ditch lights on F1 and F2, maybe trigged by F2 so when you blow the horn, the ditch lights flash per most common US practice. But what about a rooftop beacon? So you put that on F3, then every time you turn the beacon on and off, you get an air release, or coupler crash, or whatever sound is also on F3 - completely unrealistic. The easiest access to all 28 functions is probably with the WiThrottle, on every brand of DCC's handset, it's awkward at best, they are not directly avaialble on anyone's system (can you imagine, an extra 16 or so buttons just to get the extra functions without pushing a shift or some other key first, just how big these things would be?), so I think it's great keeping everything within the first 12, which ARE directly accessible on most systems. There never really was a reason to have 28 functions anyway, byt MRC's marketing machine sort of forced the issue. WHat do we get on those higher functions with sound decoders? Silly things like radio chatter, train crashes, and station IDs. And barnyard sounds. --Randy
I Agree Randy too many functions are a waste for me as i have trouble remembering more than 6
And using the shift key on a UT-4 Throttle is a pain
I wish they would have chosen a different Toggle button rather than # F-8 as sometimes i end up muting rather than toggeling
It shouldn't be an issue with most steam locos, there usully isn;t more than a headlight, and that you DO want with the sound, so the turbogenerator spins up when the lights go on. And that's the way it works as far as I can tell from seeing videos and so forth.
Might eb more of an issue when they do diesel sound (not for me, I model an era before ditch llights and I do NOT model the Espee with the christmas tree lights on their diesels, so I only need basic front and rear lights). It appears configurable though, so it's not liek you'll have to hot F8, then hit F2 to flash the ditch lights, then hit F8 again, then hit F2 to blow the horn. That would be very much unacceptable, but I don't think it works that way. It CAN if you wish.
I just got off the phone with TCS on the light vs. sound mode issue. I"m happy to report that I was told it just comes that way on default. if you want to configure all 28 functions directly not through F8 you can do that. Their website has a number of very helpful videos and programming aids. I got my Wow decoder yesterday, and it is going into a Bachmann Daylight GS4 along with a Seuthe smoke unit. There is quite a bit of room in the tender, so I'm placing a 1.22" diameter (32mm) speaker facing down playing through holes drilled in the floor. No coal load on an oil fired GS4 to drill holes into, so the floor mount will be fine and the large tender body will serve as an enclosure for the high bass speaker. There's also plenty of room for the small Radio Shack 275-0233 SPST 12VDC Reed Relay with IN4001 Diode to control the Seuthe unit with a function key to keep current flow through the decoder minimal. Based on the Wow Sound videos on the TCS site, I won't need to go through the trouble of installing a chuff cam, I'll just follow the programming steps to dial it in. Bob J, using Itouch iPod throttles
Don't count on the tender shell alone to be an adequate enclosure for the speaker, because it alone would provide too much open space.
Cacole is Right you're better off using an enclosure that is air tight and smaller than the tender
here's a link to some
http://www.litchfieldstation.com/xcart/home.php?cat=95
Just when I'm getting use to it they bring out a new one
http://tcsdcc.com/public_html/Zen/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=46_94_95&products_id=602
i like the older ones better because they had the built in keep alive
larger but cheaper
I think that there is no such thing as speaker enclosure being too big. The bigger, the better, but sealed (air tight), of course. Bigger enclosure will provide deeper bass.
Very useful document, see rule No. 5:
http://www.qsisolutions.com/pdf/loco_acoustics_design.pdf
Regards,
Hrvoje
Spalato68 I think that there is no such thing as speaker enclosure being too big. The bigger, the better, but sealed (air tight), of course. Bigger enclosure will provide deeper bass. Very useful document, see rule No. 5: http://www.qsisolutions.com/pdf/loco_acoustics_design.pdf Regards, Hrvoje
It's not the size as much as the air tight that matters
The article that you referenced specifically addresses that issue
I've tried using a tender twice and both times i was severly dissapointed in the quality of the sound
because # 1 I failed to use a silicone with a gasket to seal the speaker down to the floor and #2 The tender had several small holes making it leak
using a small made to match the speaker enclosure will guarentee good results
C&O Fan Spalato68 I think that there is no such thing as speaker enclosure being too big. The bigger, the better, but sealed (air tight), of course. Bigger enclosure will provide deeper bass. Very useful document, see rule No. 5: http://www.qsisolutions.com/pdf/loco_acoustics_design.pdf Regards, Hrvoje It's not the size as much as the air tight that matters The article that you referenced specifically addresses that issue I've tried using a tender twice and both times i was severly dissapointed in the quality of the sound because # 1 I failed to use a silicone with a gasket to seal the speaker down to the floor and #2 The tender had several small holes making it leak using a small made to match the speaker enclosure will guarentee good results
Does anyone know how to access that PDF document? Both myself & a number of other folks have referenced it in the past, but I don't seem to be able to bring it up again??
Brian
My Layout Plan
Interesting new Plan Consideration
railandsailDoes anyone know how to access that PDF document?
Maybe try to PM Terry (C&O Fan), and/or Spalato68.
Mike.
My You Tube
Looks like QSI is working on an updated website and new host site: updated 11/26/17
http://www.qsindustries.com/index.html
Try to use the contact page and ask for the .pdf you want?
Good Luck, Ed