OK what do I need to buy next? I have the PR 3 and the PS 14 power supply and it works great with my Digitrax decoders. As posted before it will not read my Blue line sound decoders. OK, not a big deal. Tonight I tried my PCM Sound Y6-B on the PR 3, again it would not read the decoder, said error 308.
I knew that it may not work with the QSI decoders in my BLI's and sort of understand why it does not like my Blue Lines. Simon 1966 has a older version of the PR 3 and it will read and write to QSI decoders. If his would not work with QSI I may have went a different way.
From what I understand it is the lack of power from the PS 14. My PR 3 is free standing, it is not hooked to my Loconet. If I hook it to my SEB with the power from the DB 150 will it read the problem decoders?
If not what do i have to buy next? Hey, I have a idea I have a MRC 8 AMP Power Station 8 I am not using! Just kidding, it will never eat a decoder again at my house.
Spend, spend and spend again, Cuda Ken
I hate Rust
Ken, to be clear, I have a Locobuffer II, which while quite a bit older than the PR3 was not made by Digitrax. I take it that the error code 308 was displayed by Decoder Pro? It means "no acknowledge from loco"
There would certainly be no harm in connecting the PR3 to the loconet and programming on the main. You won't be able to read CV's this way though.
http://www.decoderpro.com/help/en/html/hardware/loconet/PR3.shtml look at this link, it shows how to configure Decoder Pro as a loconet interface via the PR3
Simon Modelling CB&Q and Wabash See my slowly evolving layout on my picturetrail site http://www.picturetrail.com/simontrains and our videos at http://www.youtube.com/user/MrCrispybake?feature=mhum
What do you need to buy next? As you suggested - STAMPS!
You might want to consider a PowerPax. It sounds as if you're nor delivering enough juice to overcome the initial power requirements of the QSI decoders so your Digitrax system thinks there is no decoder.
cudaken From what I understand it is the lack of power from the PS 14. My PR 3 is free standing, it is not hooked to my Loconet. If I hook it to my SEB with the power from the DB 150 will it read the problem decoders? If not what do i have to buy next? Hey, I have a idea I have a MRC 8 AMP Power Station 8 I am not using! Just kidding, it will never eat a decoder again at my house.
I had similar issues with the power supply for my PR3. A better power supply fixed all my issues. Others have reported strange behavior that was fixed by switching the USB cable. If you have another USB cable in a printer or scanner or something, try that.
What is a Power Pax and where can I get one?
Ken
cudaken What is a Power Pax and where can I get one? Ken
Ken,
Tony's Train Exchange sells the PowerPax programming booster.
http://www.tonystrains.com/technews/powerpax.htm
There is another type made by Soundtraxx called the PTB100 that I have used for over three years and have never had an issue with it. Just another option for a programming booster. I don't know which is "better" but I like the PTB100
http://www.soundtraxx.com/access/index.php?p=ptb100.php
ED
I have both Power Pax and the SoundTraxx PTB100 boosters.
The big drawback to the Power Pax is that it requires a separate wall-wart power supply and you cannot leave it connected to your programming track through a toggle switch arrangement without destroying it. Tony's documentation specifically warns about trying this.
The SoundTraxx PTB100 draws its power from your DCC system and can be left permanently connected if you use a toggle switch to change between "program" snd "operate" positions.
Functionally, I have seen no difference between the two, but using a different power supply for your PR3 may be cheaper than either of these devices.
davidmbedardYou dont need a powerpax with the SEB nor would I consider one for the PR3 as it isnt designed for it.
Dave, I know you think reading CV's is over rated, but how can I read CV's with the PR 3? Like I said before, my PR 3 is not part of my bench. Loconet is not hooked to the PR 3.
Guess it is time to call Digitrax and see what they say.
Cuda Ken
Ken I don't understand your problem, I can read Blue Line and Paragon 2 decoders with a PR3 in stand alone programmer mode. The only difference with your set up is that I don't use a PS12 or PS14 power supply, Instead it is a power supply with the same output as the PS14 that was bought locally for $4.00 CAD.
Jack W.
Can you list the specs pritned on that power supply? I'm goign to take a wild guess here that for so cheap it's not as tight to 14 volts output as the PS14. Under the light load of the PR3 (and decoder when reading CVs) it may be as high as 16-18 volts which could be a clue as to why it seems to work better. Measuring the actual voltage while it's powering the PR3 would be helpful too. I would like to see actual numbers before making any recommendations to use other than the PS14. I'm not one to usually go on the anecdotal evidence of others, plus I have a PR3 on order for myself, although I have no Blueline locos to test with.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
You have a good point Randy, the wall wart is at the club's local, I will gather the info you are requesting and report back to you this coming Thursday.
When I said anectdotal evidence I didn't specifically mean you, I was referring to some people I've heard claim they picked up an 18 volt power supply at Radio Shack and found it worked way better than the PS14. That's why I'm surious what yours is putting out, perhaps 14V isn't quite enough for every decoder (after it goes through the PR3 circuitry, how much is actually applied to the program track? Since it's pulsed and not continuous, the only real way to measure it is with a scope). But how much is too much? Maybe 16V is the best compromise between increased programming ability and not frying the PR3.
Thing that I find odd is, if a sound decoder needs more power to work with the PR 3 and PS 14. Then how does it read and write to a Digitrax sound decoder? Does there sound decoder need less power? That was one of there selling points.
It would not be C&K Rail Road if something is not working right!
Ken and again thanks for all the answers.
Digitrax sound decoders are properly designed and do not have current inrush problems that others have. That applies to both programming and when there is a short while they are running. people with lots of sound locos report that if there is a short and things shut down, the won't power up again when the short is removed because the soudn decoders have a high initial inrush current and the booster or circuit breaker sees this as the short still in place. The solutions available are using 1157 bulbs in parallel with the breaker, or switching to the (surprise!) more expensive Tony's PSX breakers. Neither IMO is acceptable - the real solution is the 2 cents worth of components needed to keep this from happening in the first place. But I don;t see QSI changing their decoders anytime soon. It's obviously posisbel to make a sound decoder that doesn't cause excessive inrush, and can be programmed without any extra cost program track boosters. Either AJ ar Digitrax is the only one who knows, or the others just don't care.
Cuda Ken:
I had problems very much like you had. I tried several things, bigger power supply included. The bigger power supply did correct some of the issues but not all. In the end I tried a different USB cable and now everything works as it is supposed too using the PS14 for power.
Ed
Randy,
I've experienced first hand the problems with too many sound locos causing the Zephyr not to reset after an initial short. The high inrush of current to charge the keep alive capacitors in some sound decoders is seen as a short causing the Zpehyr to shut down and rest again, and again, and again until you remove enough of the sound locos until the Zephyr can reset. This was tested and documented in a tech tip on Tony's Trains website a number of years ago.
http://www.tonystrains.com/technews/pshield-restart.htm
Their test was conducted using a 5A system. With the lower amp rating of a Zephyr I would think that the number of locos that can be reset would be at least the same, if not less.
The simple solution was to remove locos or tip them slightly to remove one side from the rails until the system reset. An annoying problem that showed up when you had too many sound locos in a yard/engine terminal controlled by a Zephyr.
FOUR caused them a problem with a 5 amp booster?? I really have a hard time with this. I had EIGHT locos on the track with my Zephyr, 2 were PCM with Loksound decoders, 2 were BLI with QSI, 1 has a Soundtraxx LC (no keepalive in those), 1 was an Atlas with QSI, the other 2 were non-sound, one a Stewart and one a P2K. While these were all running, I stuck a screwdriver across the tracks to cause a short, and then removed it. Everything restarted just fine, no sound glitches or continued short detection or sudden fast takeoffs. I had a couple more I could have put on the track since this wasn;t overloading the Zephyr but it was overloading my ability to keep them from crashign in to one another.
I don't deny an issue exists here, the circuit design alone shows that it will cause a problem. However, it seems to be exaggerated, perhaps to sell special circuit breakers?
Like you Randy, I have fired up my Z with plenty of sound decoders in its yard district. Right now there are 8 plus another 6 non sound loco and it wakes up no problem and recovers instantly from a short. I own more sound than this, so I can guarantee that it has had more than the 8 currently in the yard.
I was struck by the apparent discrepancy between the Z and reports of problems with the DCS100 and actually took the trouble to write to Digitrax about this some time ago. They responded that as the newest command station in the Digitrax line, that it had different circuitry than the older DCS and DB units and was better protected against surge. No other details, but that was the explanation I received.
That's totally believable - but would mean AJ was looking ahead yet again, since the Zephyr was designed before the QSI decoders ever appeared.
I have a PR3 and use a PS 12 for power I use it in stand alone mode with Decoder Pro and I can read and program these decoders with no problem or errors Digitrax, T55(digitrax), QSI, and Tsunami.
I had problems reading a T55 sound decoder which is a digitrax decoder , QSI, and of course Tsunami when I used my program track through my command station (DCS 200).
go into decoder pro and select PR3 as stand alone and try it that way...
rrinker Can you list the specs pritned on that power supply? I'm goign to take a wild guess here that for so cheap it's not as tight to 14 volts output as the PS14. Under the light load of the PR3 (and decoder when reading CVs) it may be as high as 16-18 volts which could be a clue as to why it seems to work better. Measuring the actual voltage while it's powering the PR3 would be helpful too. I would like to see actual numbers before making any recommendations to use other than the PS14. I'm not one to usually go on the anecdotal evidence of others, plus I have a PR3 on order for myself, although I have no Blueline locos to test with. --Randy
Here is the info requested.
The brand name is SPN4202A class 2 transformer.
Model no DV-1250
The output is 14V DC at 360 mA.
Cost 3.99 $ CAD
For what it is worth, a reading with a regular meter show 16 V AC while reading a decoder.
Now - I wonder what I PS14 reads....
Also I wish someone had them that cheap in the US. At 4 bucks a pop I'd buy a dozen of them.