First off, let me just describe my overall layout for you. It is basically an L shape, single mainline, with a small yard and a couple of passing sidings, etc. I like the design of my layout, I have gotten it up to a scenery/detail level that I am happy with, and overall I like it for my first layout. I used all Kato Unitrack just to be simple the first time up, 24" curves throught the whole thing and #6 switches. Even so, my layout just doesn't operate well at all. I'm at my wits end with the track and wiring.
Track wise I have put in feeder wires about every 2-3 feet, and I use a Prodigy Express DCC system. I basically have two engines, a Proto FA (A and B unit) and a Spectrum Consolidation. The problem is I can't consistently run on the layout. I have cleaned the track and cleaned the locomotive wheels. My Proto FAs will run the entire length of the layout, with maybe a couple of stutters or slowdowns, but overall not bad. My 2-8-0 runs on the layout and has intermittent headlight blinking, and there is a curve that it will not go through with stopping dead. My FAs cruise right through this area.
I am just very frustrated, because my layout just doesn't run the way I want it to. I have seen people run engines on track that isn't gunked up, but definitely isn't clean either and they have no problems. I have the amount of feeders I should, clean my engine wheels, and clean the track and my only steam engine just blinks and stutters.
I don't know what is wrong, but I would appreciate some help figuring this out.
I'd be starting with the wiring---are the feeders properly connected? are they plugged in correctly? Cleaned? How are the tracks laid--hand, or? If hand I'm thinking anything like joins not properly soldered together---Oy, lots of things---but the first thing I'd be checking is for dirt/ballast in places it shouldn't be in----there will be more with better coming----
Any argument carried far enough will end up in Semantics--Hartz's law of rhetoric Emerald. Leemer and Southern The route of the Sceptre Express Barry
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Yes, it could still be several things. Are the pick-ups clean where they wipe against metal so that power transfer is good and positive? Where are the feeders in relation to joiners that are not soldered? How have you connected all the feeders, both at the rail and at the bus? How solid are all connections at your base unit?
Could your track be somewhat uneven? If it causes the trucks or drivers to rock sideways or forwards and backwards, you may get intermittent pickup. Are we talking DCC? Is there a tether between the tender and the Consolidation? Are you sure it is seatedly very firmly...as in, did you use the blunt end of a wooden kabob skewer to press it in on both sides of the wires, and on the top lip and bottom, too?
If all that I mention is solid, then you have inner wiring issues...broken solders, broken circuits, ones that heat and then cool.
Well, I'll try to check off all of these different things.
The feeders are Kato feeders, and I have the wiring soldered on each to the power bus. I may have some uneven spots, I would have to check that. Would a smallish wheelbase steamer have more trouble with this than a diesel unit?
The layout is DCC, and there is tether on the Connie and I will have to check that out since I have heard about tether issues with some Spectrum locos. Thanks for the suggestions so far.
If your Proto goes through that curve OK, I'd be looking for something loose or a short in the 2-8-0. Does the steamer stall out going through that turn facing either direction or just one way?(like maybe the drivers are shifting to one side and loosing contact with the wipers??) Is it shorting out the whole layout when it stops?
A steamer stopping in the same spot on a curve is often the sign of a short somewhere in the running gear. Try turning off the lights and look to see if you can see the flash of a short as it occurs.
Does the loco stop in the same spot in both directions? That is more likely to be a feeder issue.
Given you have just two locos, you might try borrowing a known, good loco and see what happens with it.
Finally, you say you're using the Kato feeders. I presume that you don't have these on each piece of track and are relying on the built-in contacts for sections between the feeders. I've not familiar with Kato track, but it sounds like this might be stuff you don't need to ballast. Gluing ballast can often result in issues. However, if you've used various washes on the surrounding scenery, this could also be causing contact problems. I presume that the rails have been cleaned, but if anything soaked into the contacts on each piece of track where they connect, that could be an issue.
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
loathar If your Proto goes through that curve OK, I'd be looking for something loose or a short in the 2-8-0. Does the steamer stall out going through that turn facing either direction or just one way?(like maybe the drivers are shifting to one side and loosing contact with the wipers??) Is it shorting out the whole layout when it stops?
Well, here is a fun fact for you.... If you think about it, if my mainline is an L shape, then all the curves except one will curve the same way. If I'm running in one direction, the curve that is different than all the others is the one I'm having trouble with. Recently I've only run the engine one direction, so I switched it like you said, and what do you know. It goes right through the problem curve and won't go through any of the others. Basically the engine can't turn left.
If you've seen my other recent post... I now own two engines, and have two engines with shorts. Great.... So what should I been looking for on the Spec. Consolidation to fix this?
By the way, Thanks Loathar
You also mentioned the FA's stutter/slow down---any consistency with those or are they just intermittant?---losing contact could mean track not quite even in spots--Consolidation may have stuff on it--dirt and such could move around the contacts---seen that on my layout as well--- If the FA's do same around other direction it may be track as well---
These locomotives should have a two pin connector between the locomotive and the tender. Check the connectors using a small ohm meter to check not only the wiring, but the sockets for continuity. DO NOT force the probes of the ohm meter into the receptacles, unless they are small enough. Rather, wire wrap 16-20 gauge wire around the probe and insert it into the receptacle. Remember, all we are looking for is continuity in the curve. If everything is ok, then focus your attention on the right side pick ups, wheels and valve gear first, then the left side. As previously mentioned, turn out the lights and look to see if a spark appears anywhere in the running gear and in the connector between engine and tender. Do this by slowly operating the locomotive repeatedly into the problem curve. This will take time, patience, a good eye and maybe a magnifying glass.
If the probe test shows a lack of continuity, then some disassembly will be required to track down the location of the break. The tender holds the DCC board, so go there first, inspecting the trucks and pickup gear as well as making a careful inspection of the plug and receptacle. Work your way back to the boards with the probes until you get good continuity. The problem will be behind the probe.
If the tender looks good, then check the wiring on the engine itself, doing the same thing as with the tender.
These locomotives are reportedly famous for intermittent running, and especially running on DC and not on DCC, due to a capacitor issue on the DCC board.
I had one of these, and the problem was similar. It was in the receptacle between locomotive and tender. Once corrected, the engine ran fine.
The first thing I would try to determine is whether the problem is in the track, the locos, or both. If there is another layout nearby that you could run your locos on, I'd give that a try. If they run well on another layout then the problem is almost certainly in your track or wiring. My LHS has test tracks in all scales so that might be an option as well.
Well, to sum everything up, my real problem here seems to be my engines, not my track or wiring. My Consolidation has some sort of short that prevents it from turning left properly, so that needs to be tracked down. In regards to any other intermittent stutters on the rest of the layout, I figure this must just be the fact that I am basically using sectional track, even if it is "nice" Kato sectional track. Would anyone surmise that wiring a few jumpers between track pieces here and there might help some of the connections?
Thanks for everyone's help. I'll track down the steam engine short and fix a little thing with my Protos I should be running much better already.
If you have power feeds every 2-3 feet, even with sectional track you shouldn't have any contact issues. Unless this Unitrack is well-used and the metal portion of the joiners is exceptionally loose or missing. It's easy enough to test, just take some jumper wires with alligator clips and when the loco stalls, jumper power from a terminal section to the rails that the loco is sitting on, without disturbing the loco in any way. If that makes it run, with no nudging or anything, then you do have a contact problem between where you pulled the power from and the piece of track the loco stalled on.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
Take a look at the area between the steam engine and it's tender. On Spectrum engines there usually is a "flap" that is attached to the back of the engine cab at floor level that is supposed to lay on top of the lip at the front of the tender. (I think they call it the flap the "apron" on real engines(?).)
Anyway, when moving the engine, be sure to fold that flap all the way up, and then reach in with a pencil or screwdriver and lower it only after the engine is properly seated on the track. If you don't do it that way, it's very easy for the flap to get caught up under the lip that sticks out at the front of the tender, causing problems with pickup, running, and even derailing.
Just something to check on.