Will I need a program track booster?

[cudaken]

 I have finally out grown my Bachmann E-Z, not do the lack of fiction's but my DCC fleet is well over 10 engines now. I have picked the MRC Radio DCC system mainly because it state's I can program on the main line in what I think is called op's mode. (sorry but still wet behind the ears on the DCC terms)

 I have 5 engines with QSI decoders and have read many times they need a programing track booster, why? Is it something like stereo gear? Programing track has the power of a preamp, and main line has the power of the power amp? 

 If I can program on the main line and I do have a 8 amp power supply powering the main line. Would I still need a programing track booster for the QSI engines?

 I was onces told "the only stupid question is the one not asked". Person that said that never meet me!

                    Cuda Ken

[CSX Robert]

...I have picked the MRC Radio DCC system mainly because it state's I can program on the main line in what I think is called op's mode...

Digitrax, Lenz and NCE let you use OPS mode programming. If this is your MAIN reason for choosing MRC, I would suggest that you look at the other features of the various systems to decide which one is best for you.

...If I can program on the main line and I do have a 8 amp power supply powering the main line. Would I still need a programing track booster for the QSI engines?...

You do not need a programming booster when programming on the main.

[cacole]

A programming booster is connected only to a programming track, not the main line, so you do not need one if you're going to use OPS mode programming.  Connecting a programming booster to the main line will burn (literally) the booster.  As CSX Robert wrote, the MRC is not the only system that can do OPS mode programming and MRC is not the only system with radio capability, so you need to learn a lot more about the various DCC systems before making such an expensive purchase.

Here's a good place to start:

http://www.tonystrains.com/productcompare/dcccomparison.htm

To me, the biggest red flag in this chart is the NMRA Conformance row.  What aspect of the MRC systems does not conform with NMRA Standards, or does this just mean that MRC has not submitted any systems for NMRA evaluation?  Only The Shadow knows.

[johncolley]

Yes, a programming track booster will help a lot. Sure, you will be able to program CV changes on the main (be sure to remove all locos that you don't want changed) BUT... you will need the program track and booster to change from 03 to two or especially to four digit addresses. The need comes from the duel between the inrush current draw of the sound system versus the limited power of the programming track. jc5729 John Colley, Port Townsend, WA

[wjstix]

The very earliest QSI sound systems had a problem requiring a booster to re-set the CV's. I have a first-run NYC Hudson from 2001 or so that needs a booster, all the other later QSI-equipped engines I have are fine programming CV's with my Digitrax Zephyr.

[CSX Robert]

Yes, a programming track booster will help a lot. Sure, you will be able to program CV changes on the main (be sure to remove all locos that you don't want changed) BUT... you will need the program track and booster to change from 03 to two or especially to four digit addresses. The need comes from the duel between the inrush current draw of the sound system versus the limited power of the programming track. jc5729 John Colley, Port Townsend, WA

There is no need to remove locos you don't want changed when doing OPS mode programming. OPS mode programming is sent to a particular address, and only locos with that address will change. Just don't program to the short(2-digit) address 0 because that is the broadcast address and writes to this address will change all the locomotives on the layout.

Changing the address can sometimes be an issue with OPS mode programming. Some command stations do not allow you to change the address using OPS mode programming; however, I think most will allow it(I know Digitrax allows it). Also, some decoders will not allow you to change the address in OPS mode, but QSI does. If the command station does not allow changing of the address in OPS mode, QSI has a method for changing it using their "indexed" CV's(CV 56.129).

[locoi1sa]

  Cuda

  You might want to look at the NCE power cab. It has a setting in program track mode for those decoders that need the extra power. I have an early version 1.8 and it programs and READS any decoder I throw at it. Program track mode is great for a new instal so if there is a problem you dont get the full amperage to let the smoke out. Program track mode is the only way to read CVs to diagnose decoder problems and see if the changes work or not. Some decoders do not support address changes on the main. Tsunnamis come to mind and most people have problems with Blueline. With those and a power cab the program and read CVs on the program track for me. When I got my first Blueline loco all I did was put the decoder in it and put it on the program track and programed both motor and sound decoders together with out a problem.

  If you are worried  about power with the Power cab (2.7 amps) I have had 7 HO scale sound and 4 non sound locos running at the same time. If I had more locos they would have been on it too. The power cab has a built in amp meter and it only hit 2 amps driving all those locos.

    Pete

[claycts]

Program Boosters are NICE and come in handy to speed up some programing and allow others. I have a program track and run decoder pro on a MAC and PC. OPS mode is great for anything but address change IMHO. The draw back is? The positive is the ability to see instant results. I started with Digitrax and never looked back.

That is my $.02

[CSX Robert]

..If you are worried about power with the Power cab (2.7 amps) I have had 7 HO scale sound and 4 non sound locos running at the same time. If I had more locos they would have been on it too. The power cab has a built in amp meter and it only hit 2 amps driving all those locos...

I have seen the PowerCab advertised as 1.7 amps and as 2 amps, but never anything above 2 amps(the PowerCab manual says 2 amps). If you were running it at 2 amps, I suspect you were right at the edge of tripping the circuit breaker.

[ereimer]

 Is it something like stereo gear? Programing track has the power of a preamp, and main line has the power of the power amp?

                    Cuda Ken

you're close to right . the programming track is set to a lower current output than the main track , the theory being that you're less likely to damage the decoder (or command station) if you're outputting less current . the problem is (in some cases) that sound decoders require more power than the programming track outputs and they can't be programmed . the solution is the program track booster which increases the output

 

 

ernie

[selector]

I wonder what the difference is in output with the booster adding its impetus between that and the regular output that would be provided in Ops Mode.  For a person to get a system that has a deficient Paged Mode output for even one of their resident decoders, they might just be further ahead to programme on the main and save themselves all the nause of the booster, including its cost.  To me, using a booster is defeating the logic of having the programming output in the first place.  Use the programming output for those decoders that do respond that way, and simply have an isolated section of track to which Ops Mode signals can be applied for the odd decoder that has a heartier appetite.

My

[CSX Robert]

...Use the programming output for those decoders that do respond that way, and simply have an isolated section of track to which Ops Mode signals can be applied for the odd decoder that has a heartier appetite...

You do not need an isolated section of track for OPS mode programming.

[selector]

Robert, I was thinking of the odd time when a person has two engines on the layout that have new decoders.  If both are out on the main and you use Ops Mode, any changes, including new address assignments, will be taken up by both new decoders.  So, if you have one a QSI and the other a 100LC, both new, and both on your main, but you don't want to purchase and wire or configure a booster or resistor, you simply slide the QSI onto the isolated section, turn power off to the rest of the decoders, and then do your Ops programming of the QSI.

My reasoning is to obviate the requirement for addtional costs when Ops Mode will do.

-Crandell