Info on when certain types of rolling stock were used...

[WaxonWaxov]

Hello all, I'm glad to have found this forum.

My question is this: Is there a reference out there that would help me ensure my collection of roling stock is "time appropriate" for my railroad?

The time specifically is Fall, 1943.

For example, I wouldn't want one of those enclosed auto racks or huge Boeing reefer cars they use nowadays on my railraod. Nor would I want a Grant 1873 4-4-0.

Any thoughts?

BTW, my railraod is in it's INFANCY. That is to say that it's only images in my head at this point.

thanks

[pcarrell]

I'd get on line, or go to the library, and look up topics such as freight & passenger car histories, locomotive histories, if you are modeling a bigger RR you might even find a book or web site on that RR (such as UP for example), some historical information on the area that you are modeling, and so on. For your era you might be able to look up pictures of early desiel (Can you tell I model steam? I can't even spell those wretched things!)loco's and just look to see whats in the background. The older looking stuff in those pics will be what you are looking for. Also, since that was wartime, you might find stuff related to that.

To answer your question more directly, you should be looking at mostly steel frame cars. Boxcars will be mostly 50 footers, with a few 40's thrown in for good measure. Reefers were still plentiful I believe, but I might not be correct in that so check it out. 11,000 gal. or thereabouts tank cars would have been common, and flat cars would have been mostly around 50ft., maybe a bit bigger (57ft?). Passenger cars would be mostly heavyweights, but the name trains would be lightweights. Loco's would be superpower steam and just about any steam below that. Be careful though as some steam was still yet to come in 1943. The N&W J class comes to mind. Electrics and boxcabs were in use at that time also, so that could maybe give you some variety in your fleet. Desiel loco's would not be around, but they were experamenting with it, so you might have an excuse to scratchbuild something off the wall.

Hope that helps!

[Anonymous]

Fall'43 boxcars will be both wood sided and steel,lots of 40 footers,and 36 footers,rivited tank cars 8000/10000 gal models,flats at 40/42 50/52 feet, steel refeers were coming on(this is WW2), lots of wood sided,all iced,gons 40/42,and 50/52,woodsided and steel,hoppers 36.40,double and triple and some quad bays,stock cars still around,lot of composite sided stuff,find out what road(s) youn want to model,check out there historical society,they can help.

[jxtrrx]

There is a fairly recent book published by the fine folks who run this web site that I enjoyed called "The Model Railroader's Guide to Freight Cars" by Jeff Wilson. I think it answers all your questions. http://store.yahoo.com/kalmbachcatalog/12450.html

[dehusman]

Every car has a "BLT" (built) or "NEW" date on it. If the date is after 1943 then the car won't be appropriate. Probably 75% of kits won't be appropriate.

Dave H.

[leighant]

There is a kind of reference book.... the reference that railroads consulted to see what car would fit what shipper's needs....or to find out who in send the bill to in case another railroad's car needed an emergency repair.
The [i]Official Railroad Equipment Register[i], "ORER", came out several times a year, listed every freight car in the country approved for interchange.
I model mid-1950s and I was fortunate 20 years ago to buy an April 1954 [i]Official Railroad Equipment Register[i] for $10. I built a cardboard slip case for it to preserve it. I have consulted it hundreds and hundreds of times.

Another good reference I see occasionally at train shows. The [i]Train Shed Cyclopedia[i], a reprint of the volume bought by real railroad machanical engineers to keep up with innovations in construction of rail cars. There are some volumes covering the 1940s. They sell at 150% to 250% of original cover price ($3.95/ $4.95) and are well worth it.

You probably wanted something that has been printed recently for railroad enthusiasts. I prefer the original historical documents, or a facsimile (like the ORERs that are now available on CD-ROM.)

[doctorwayne]

Your railroad may be in its infancy, but you're off to a flying start simply by having picked a specific timeframe. And you obviously have enough knowledge to be able to rule out the improbabilities that you noted, so you'll do alright. All of the comments made so far are valid. If you're modelling a specific railroad, you might want to join the appropriate historical society and if you're modelling a specific area, the local library or historical society can often provide lots of info on all those things peripheral to the railroad, like structures, street scenes, and scenery that will enhance the setting for your railroad. And in 1943, railroads were an integral part of everyday life, so you might find information in what today would be considered unlikely places. Good luck.
Wayne

[WaxonWaxov]

Thanks to all for the informative responses.

Another question(s) on the same topic:
When did TOFC (truck on flat car... piggyback) and RDC (Rail Diesel Car) both come into play?
Would they work on my railroad? (1943)

More specifics on my railroad: It will be a proto-freelanced branch off the Pennsy mainline, servicing two or three small towns and all associated industries. I figure on having one or two locos that belong to the branchline and have a Pennsy heavy steamer come onto the branch to pick-up war emergency coal.

thanks again

[orsonroy]

QUOTE: Originally posted by WaxonWaxov

Thanks to all for the informative responses.

Another question(s) on the same topic:
When did TOFC (truck on flat car... piggyback) and RDC (Rail Diesel Car) both come into play?
Would they work on my railroad? (1943)

No to both. While railroads played with TOFC service as early as the early 1920s, it really didn't get started until arond 1952-1954. RDCs (I think) weren't built until 1958 or so.

Represent TOFC service with more 40-foot boxes and LCL boxcars, and replace RDCs with Doodlebugs.

[BR60103]

Watch out on the BLT dates. Model manufacturers don't always get them right.

[Anonymous]

Try http://espee.railfan.net/nonindex/spmw [^][:-^][dinner]glennbob

[tstage]

WaxonWaxov,

First of all: [#welcome] to the forum. Good to have you aboard! [:)]

I'm modeling the early 40's myself. As others have suggested already, for locating rolling stock for your era, use the BLT (built) or NEW date that's printed on the side of the cars. The ONLY way I buy rolling stock kits is if I can read or know those dates.

You didn't mention whether you would be going with kits or RTR (ready to run) cars. With RTR, the dates can mostly be seen through the box window. With kits, it's a little bit of an effort. Here's a couple of my favorites:

Branchline - one of the ONLY companies that produce kits that actually print the BLT (and repaint) date on the outside of the box. (Boy is THAT convenient!) Why other kit companies can't follow suit is beyond me. Branchline makes two styles of kits: Yardmaster and Blueprint. The Blueprint series kits are better quality and have more details included than the Yardmaster series. Price range will run you $10-16 Branchline specializes in boxcars and reefers.

Accurail - Nice* kits but you have to open the boxes in order to read the BLT date - unless your LHS shrink wraps them with the box open so you can see inside. (One of mine does [:)]) However, Accurail does have the BLT date informaton conveniently available on their web site. (http://www.accurail.com/accurail) Like Branchline, Accurail has limited it's production to boxcars, reefers, and hoppers. I particularly like their wood boxcars. VERY nice detailing and paint job! Accurail kits will run you $8-10. Of all the rolling stock that I have in my yard, the majority of it is Accurail.

*Note: The one downside to the Accurail kits is that their braking details underneath the frame are somewhat simplistic and sparse. Even so, they make a good product and the price is reasonable per kit. I like them much better than Athearn.

WaxonWaxov, there are also some other very good rolling stock manufacturers that make a very good product - e.g. Proto 2000, Intermountain, Tichy, to name a few. I only mentioned Branchline and Accurail because 1) they produce kits that will fit into your time era, and 2) they make verifying the BLT dates much easier than the other manufacturers.

The book references already mentioned will be a good way to double check for accuracy. Anyhow, hope that's a help...

Tom

[Anonymous]

Welcome to the forum, enjoy!
You are on the cusp of a great journey and the internet is a great resource. Obviously try the search engines like Google, MSN Search, Ask Jeeves etc. for terms like "steam era freight cars" (the biggest problem is sorting throught all of the toppics that are pulled up). The Pennsylvania Rail Road Technical and Historical society is a great reference source as well, also available on the net. Many of the manufacturers are being more helpful in the dating of their models as well, responding to our interest in specific era rolling stock and power. As you find interesting items, you can bookmark them to your "Favorites" so that you can return to them later.
Have fun and good luck in your endeavor.
Will

[Anonymous]

Watch out for accurail, they occasionaly paint cars that are incorrect, Red Caboose has some good cars for that era, as does Intermountain, but they do more rtr,than kits now, but you can still find them,. Sunshine has many steam era kits,but these are flat sided,a little more difficult to build. Athearns 40' boxcar(steam era) are correct,but they also use liberty in paint schemes, their 40' reefers and hoppers will also work.

[WaxonWaxov]

Thanks again,

Back to the doodlebugs: On Clyde Fazenbaker's railroad (mid 50's era) he had RDCs pulling a passenger car behind them. Could/did doodlebugs do this as well?

[BR60103]

Doodlebugs did pull cars; they were often bought with a short train in mind.
There's a thread on RDCs pulling cars somewhere in the Trains forum. Simply, it would void the warranty on the transmission, but it was sometimes done anyway.

[pcarrell]

WaxonWaxov,

I see that you've gotten some good questions answered but I noticed that you didn't say what scale you are in. The reason that I bring it up is because some of the model companies mentioned are not available in some scales. It might help us to help you if we knew what scale you are in so that we might taylor our answers appropriately.

P.S. - Good questions by the way!

[WaxonWaxov]

Well, most likely HO because it's the easiest to get stuff for.
I used to be into N scale, but everything in N is so danged expensive.

One thing worth noting is that is railroad is at least 3-4 years away from having anything other than stuff "on paper." Reason is that I'm currently living in a 600 sqaure foot studio. I don't have room for a couch, let alone a railraod. :)

I'm going to buy a house out of the city (currently in downtown Chicago) so then I'll know how much room I have.

So basically, I'm leaning towards HO, but it all depends on the amount of room I have. I might even go S or O given the right amount of room.

thanks,

[Anonymous]

Although the boxcar was everywhere in the 1940s, before many of today's obviously specialized cars like autoracks, TOFC, intermodals and so on, not all boxcars were created equal, so to speak.

There were boxcars for lumber with small end doors to facilitate loading dimensional lumber. Boxcars with double doors or end doors for automobiles. Boxcars with "grain doors" that were used like covered hoppers (some had loading hatches on the roof that look like reefer ice hatches, or drop floors or hopper-like contraptions underneath for unloading).

In this time period too, you would have outside brace with wood doors and/oror ends, or metal doors and/or ends. Double sheath wood cars. All steel cars from the 1930s (not many new ones produced because steel was needed for the war). You might see K-brake equipped boxcars in MOW or other non-revenue/non-interchange service. Lots of stuff that should have been scrapped was pressed into/kept in service due to the tremendous effort needed to supply the war.

Very interesting time - makes for lots of variety!

Andrew

[BRJN]

Any kit that describes the car as "USRA" or "AAR" or "War Emergency" could be used.

There was a series of Pullman troop cars (Kitchen, sleeper, &c) released this last year for a passenger train (maybe a small Army basic-training facility near one of those nondescript towns you mentioned). Or borrow the Milwaukee Road's Hiawatha equipment <g>.

There is a LOT of Pennsy stuff out there so getting enough cars to start will not be a problem.

Remember that a little paint and a decal set can make an Undecorated car into your home line's revenue equipment.

Only a few diesel engines were already in use; the War Production Board limited how many new diesels could be built and only desperate lines could have them.

There are available flatcars with canvas-covered cannons, Grant or Sherman tanks, or Jeeps on them.

A train of tank cars (full of heating oil) would be appropriate during winter. Nazi subs thought tanker ships were prime targets.

While at the library, look for a book titled something like "Railroads at War". Copy some of the advertising and post it on the walls of the railroad room for atmosphere.

Before 1943, only New Haven RR had tried TOFC. War restrictions on rubber (for tires) would put a big crimp in the truckers' style, anyway. So no TOFC trains but maybe you could put short (22'?) trailers on a flatcar or two and deliver them to a team track, once in a while. Put a heavy-duty ramp nearby so the trailers can be driven off.