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flashers vs. crossbucks

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  • Member since
    January 2019
  • 2,572 posts
flashers vs. crossbucks
Posted by John-NYBW on Saturday, February 11, 2023 10:02 AM

There has clearly been an effort to protect more and more grade crossings with flashers in the last few decades. Flashers used to be used primarily at just major crossings but now even secondary roads are getting them. For example, the Ohio Central has a branchline from Newark, OH to Mt. Vernon, OH. One train a day goes up and down the line meaning it passes each grade crossing twice. When I moved to this area over 20 years ago, only highways and busy streets in Mt. Vernon had the flashers. There was a flasher at the grade crossing on State Route 13 south of Mt. Vernon. Sycamore Road runs almost the full width of Knox County and runs perpindicular to SR13, crossing the rail line a short distance away. It is not a very busy road and until a few years ago was protected by crossbucks. Now it has flashers but Range Line Road which forms a third leg of a triangle with Sycamore and the rail line still has just crossbucks. It would not surprise me to see that one get flashers someday soon, even though only a few cars an hour cross the tracks there. The rail line passes through my little burg of Utica, OH a little south of there. There are several grade crossings within the town. They used to have just crossbucks but now they have added stop signs to them as well. 

My recollections based on car trips when I was very young is that almost all rural crossings back in the 1950s and 1960s had just crossbucks. Flashers, with or without gates, were limited to major street crossings within cities. I'm trying to figure out when a push started to get most grade crossings, even on lightly traveled country roads, protected by flashers. 

One other question. Is the decision left up to the railroad or do state and local laws come into play?

  • Member since
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  • From: Omaha, NE
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Posted by dehusman on Saturday, February 11, 2023 11:10 AM

Generally the railroad is required to put up crossbucks.  Anything more than that is paid for by whoever owns the road (Federal, state, county, city) and the railroad pays for maintenance.

The city/county/state decides on what crossings get what warning devices.

They pay for the devices and installation, the railroad maintains them.

Same with overpasses, the governmental agency decices where there should be over passes and the government pays the bulk of the cost to build and maintain the overpass.

Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com

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  • From: Southern Florida Gulf Coast
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Posted by SeeYou190 on Saturday, February 11, 2023 12:25 PM

Another question... flaggers...

In rural areas of Florida I have seen RR employees pull up to a crossing, flag the intersection when a train approaches. Then they get back in the vehicle and drive to the next crossing.

I have never seen this anywhere else.

Is this a requirement instead of installing flashers?

-Kevin

Living the dream.

  • Member since
    January 2019
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Posted by John-NYBW on Saturday, February 11, 2023 1:19 PM

I did a trip on the Saratoga and North Creek Railroad and was lucky enough to get to ride the locomotive on the way back. There was one grade crossing with a malfunctioning gate. It would come down but immediately go back up. The train had to stop short of the crossing and the conductor got out and flagged the traffic to stop so the train could cross. I had my camera but didn't think to take a picture of this interesting operation. 

  • Member since
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  • From: Bedford, MA, USA
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Posted by MisterBeasley on Saturday, February 11, 2023 1:29 PM

I used to live by the B&M tracks in Concord, MA.  One night I heard the gates go down so I glanced out the window.  Before the train passed by, some local yahoo drove through the gate, snapping it off.  I immediately notified both the police and the railroad.  They replaced the gate the next day.

It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse. 

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Posted by Overmod on Saturday, February 11, 2023 3:05 PM

Kevin, you can see 'leapfrog' crossing flagging from road vehicles in a number of contexts on YouTube, usually when there's a desire to keep the train moving that justifies an employee in a vehicle.

We had a post on the South Brooklyn Railway a few months ago that has an interesting alternative: transit-police-type vehicles that drive to block the crossing with their lightbars and strobes, then dash to the next crossing without anyone exiting to physically flag.

  • Member since
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  • From: Omaha, NE
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Posted by dehusman on Sunday, February 12, 2023 7:29 AM

SeeYou190
In rural areas of Florida I have seen RR employees pull up to a crossing, flag the intersection when a train approaches. Then they get back in the vehicle and drive to the next crossing. I have never seen this anywhere else. Is this a requirement instead of installing flashers?

Sorta, kinda, not really.

Lots of options.

If the engine is leading:

  • Crossbucks only, no stop or flagging required, headlight, whistle, bell
  • Warning devices functioning, no stop or flagging required, headlight, whistle, bell
  • Warning devices NOT functioning, have to stop and flag until traffic stops and crossing is occupied

Shoving cars (engine not leading) : 

  • Crossbucks only, have to stop and flag until traffic stops and crossing is occupied
  • Warning devices functioning, have to stop and flag until traffic stops and crossing is occupied, except if devices are seen to be working and traffic stopped, no stop or flagging required
  • Warning devices NOT functioning, have to stop and flag until traffic stops and crossing is occupied

Having a vechicle to advance the person protecting the crossing isn't "required", it's just a quick way to advance the flags without having to stop the train.  

Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com

  • Member since
    January 2019
  • From: Henrico, VA
  • 9,728 posts
Posted by Flintlock76 on Sunday, February 12, 2023 9:34 AM

Folks may find this an interesting "wrinkle" in crossing protection. This is a video shot by "Liberty Railfan" at the Plauderville (Garfield NJ) train station.  At 3:25 you'll hear a demonstration of what's called a "Robo-Crossing" announcement.  I've never seen (or heard) anything like this.  The rest of the video's a fun watch as well!  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXz51D13Sxs  

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