Crossbucks

[John-NYBW]

I just received two pair of crossing flashers that I purchased through Amazon. They were much cheaper than any I had seen in the past. I haven't installed them so I don't know yet about their quality. What struck me as odd is the crossbucks are black with white lettering. All the ones I can remember seeing have been white with black lettering. Are black with white lettering prototypical as well.

I should point out that the picture on Amazon shows them to be black so I'm not complaining. I just didn't notice that when I ordered. I saw the low price and decided to get a couple.

["JaBear"]

It required a couple of coffees research but…

 

https://www.floridamemory.com/items/show/52808

 

This one that really caught my eye!

 

https://www.frrandp.com/2021/04/billups-railroad-crossing.html

 

Cheers, the Bear.

[7j43k]

The black ones are REALLY rare, out in the world.  As in, up on a pole protecting real railroad tracks.

The closest (and only) example I could find is here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXizISk2qOs

 

The narrator guess that they are REALLY old, like maybe back to the fifties.  Yikes.  Anyway, I do agree they must go back aways.

 

Ed

[John-NYBW]

If it's from the 1950s, that works for me since my modeling year is 1956.

[7j43k]

I suspect there were "a bunch" of the black ones out there in 1956.  Under the circumstances, I suggest you adopt that view, also.

I think the railroad put these up, and they likely had standardized ones.  Of course, they can change the standard later; but they won't go around and change out all the old ones, so those will linger.

Bear's example is from the ACL in Florida.  Mine is potentially on a B&O line in Maryland.  I say potentially because there IS a chance that they were added post-railroad.  Maybe.  My intuition says that these were more prominent in the southeast.  But since there's so few samples.......

My point is that if YOUR railroad put them up, say pre-WWII, then there would likely be some around 15 years later.

They DO look kinda sharp.

 

Ed

[John-NYBW]

The vehicles in the video are modern so even though these are apparently old crossbucks, they have survived a long time. I have some white crossbucks without flashers so if I choose, It probably wouldn't be that big a deal to swap them but as long as there is a prototype for the black ones, I think I'll keep them. 

One thing I've noticed is that while black crossbucks are rare in the real world, they seem to be much more common in the model world. I've found two other companies selling black crossbucks. I'm wondering if they were more common many years ago. 

[DSchmitt]

7j43k

The black ones are REALLY rare, out in the world.  As in, up on a pole protecting real railroad tracks.

The closest (and only) example I could find is here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXizISk2qOs

 

The narrator guess that they are REALLY old, like maybe back to the fifties.  Yikes.  Anyway, I do agree they must go back aways.

 

Ed

 

Note they have cats eye reflectors (Cataopotes) which were developed by road contractor Percy Shaw from Halifax West Yorkshire England in 1933. What he devloped were rounded glass beads mounted in a rubber housing to light roadways by reflection.

In the 1940's the beads became a safety  feature on signs.

 

["JaBear"]

My search turned up examples of the black background, white lettered crossbucks for sale on the likes of eBay, where the description included the word, “vintage”. Now the general use of “vintage” IMO is often used to make any old tatt more “valuable” than it actually is, and is NOT to be used for accuracy!!

 

There was one “description” that indicted a 1930s-time frame, and as cats eye markers were invented in 1934, I guess that that decade has some plausibility for that style of crossbuck to have been introduced.

 

From my reading, unless mandated otherwise, railroads were reasonably thrifty when keeping infrastructure, if it still served a purpose, so I can see no reason why those crossbucks in Eds video link weren’t there when the line was “abandoned” in 1950. After all they’re still in service today.

 

Cheers, the Bear.  

[York1]

My friend is a retired BNSF worker.  He has one with the catseye reflectors, but his is white with black letters.  It's very difficult to tell the age of it.

[wrench567]

  Growing up outside of Cleveland, I remember the white on black crossbucks. I also remember the gates painted black and white with the lanterns hung below with red lenses. 

   Pete.

[Attuvian1]

I grew up a block away from the Michigan Central (NYC) in Jackson, MI.  I seem to recall the Wisner Street crossing of their (double) main line between Detroit and Chicago having white on black in the 50s.  A rather deadly crossing - no gates then.  Increased risk when two trains running in opposite directions vacated and arrived at the crossing in quick succession.  And it probably didn't help that Penny's Tavern was at that location.   

John

[dknelson]

wrench567

  Growing up outside of Cleveland, I remember the white on black crossbucks. I also remember the gates painted black and white with the lanterns hung below with red lenses. 

   Pete.

 

 

Same here in the Milwaukee area.  Just as there are some hold-over black crossbucks out there, I have also seen similarly aged crossbucks that are at the "old" sixty/thirty degree angle rather than today's 90 degrees.  Only in photos and movies and at RR museums have I seen the old "Look Out For The Cars" message that some eastern railroads favored.  

 

I also remember seeing and being fascinated by the crossing gates that had an iron rod at the end that would swing down as the gate lowered and the end of which, if memory serves, exactly hit a metal cup embedded in the road.  This kept the gate from going down too low I guess.   The old Lionel automatic crossing gate had that feature.

 

I also do recall that crossing gates were so carefully counterbalanced back then that there would be a fair amount of "gate bounce" going on even as the train was finally going through the crossing.  Maybe that iron rod helped control that too.  

 

As a kid my favorite crossing gate in town was on a rarely used spur, where the gates had to be swung out by the crew rather than lowered down.  They were just gates - no lights, no bell.  The thing is there was just one guy who was in charge of the gates and it was a bit of a battle as he tried to swing around one gate, and traffic would try to go around it before he could swing around the gate on the other side of the road.  It was kind of an invitation to a head on collision between drivers determined not to be stopped.  Meanwhile the locomotive would be right there, waiting.  

 

Dave Nelson

[wrench567]

  Dave.

  I do remember the leg on the gates. I don't remember the pocket in the road. There could have been. I liked the lamps that would hang under them. One day a gate was damaged and the RR replaced it with a red and white gate with the lights in the gate arm. And the signs would tell you how many tracks there were. Single track x-ings had signs that said watch out for the locomotive. I think the angle of the crossbucks was up to the railroads. The NYC mainline had the sharper angle while the PRR had the nineties. or it could have been the other way round.

      Pete.

[wrench567]

Here are some standard plans from the PRR.

http://prr.railfan.net/standards/standards.cgi?plan=78300-C

http://prr.railfan.net/standards/standards.cgi?plan=66207-H

http://prr.railfan.net/standards/standards.cgi?plan=78320-A

  I hope this works. My tablet has had issues today.

      Pete.