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Coil springs AND Leaf springs in one truck

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  • Member since
    October 2004
  • From: Allen, TX
  • 1,320 posts
Coil springs AND Leaf springs in one truck
Posted by cefinkjr on Wednesday, July 28, 2021 9:48 AM

Just noticed last night that I have one HO car with this unusual arrangement. I also remember seeing this in 1:1 scale in the late 60s or early 70s when I worked for NYC>PC although I don't recall the car type.

Any ideas of how common this was or why it might have been done?

Chuck
Allen, TX

  • Member since
    August 2003
  • From: Collinwood, Ohio, USA
  • 16,367 posts
Posted by gmpullman on Wednesday, July 28, 2021 1:42 PM

You colud spend a great deal of time studying the effects of railroad car suspension and everything that goes on between the rail head and the car bolster.

This interesting look at the basics will explain much of the theories:

https://www.wheel-rail-seminars.com/archives/2018/pc-papers/presentations/PC03.pdf

Railroads were continually looking for solutions to balance car suspensions especially considering the job the spring package needed to do given the difference in weights of a loaded car and the empty weight.

Coil (helical) springs alone could introduce too much "bounce" and lead to commodity damage, track damage and poor tracking qualities. Often there were more than one spring nested inside the visible outer coils.

Before designs of successful "snubbers" there were attempts at using leaf (or elliptical) springs in order to help dampen this bounce. The friction between the leaves of an elliptic spring provide for some dampening. 

There's only one "sweet spot" for a given weight for a spring to bear. Railroads and carbuilders were always in search of ways to economically expand this ideal spring action when designing for loaded vs. empty car performance.

There were dozens, if not hundreds of designs attempted to design a good, working snubber/spring/suspension "package" that met all of the criteria and still had to be economical, durable and easy to repair in the field.

Passenger cars and some freight cars used hydraulic snubbers similar to automobile shock absorbers. There were also many styles of bolster-to-sideframe mechanisms to attempt to dampen vertical travel using various springs, rubber pads and wedges.

Short answer, to reduce bounce and attempt to improve ride quality.

Good Luck, Ed

  • Member since
    May 2004
  • 7,500 posts
Posted by 7j43k on Wednesday, July 28, 2021 3:25 PM

Leaf springs are also non-linear.  In the normal position, they give a softer ride.  In the heavily loaded version, they are stiffer and less likely to bottom out (a VERY not-soft ride).  They are usually seen under cars carrying people, cabooses included.

But.  They also show up a lot under steam locomotive tenders.

 

Ed

  • Member since
    February 2015
  • 869 posts
Posted by NHTX on Wednesday, July 28, 2021 4:47 PM

The major user of the coil-elliptical spring arrangement that I saw most often was, the Pennsy, on its X-29 boxcars used in passenger service. 

  • Member since
    February 2012
  • From: Southington, CT
  • 106 posts
Posted by mthobbies on Thursday, July 29, 2021 8:02 AM

I remember seeing a pre-1920s Pullman passenger car (with open vestibules) at the Essex Steam Train and River Boat museum in Essex CT. It has leaf springs on one truck and blocks of wood on the other. They were 8x8 beams that spanned the whole truck. The guy at the museum said they were made that way! Now I thought that was interesting.

-Matt

  • Member since
    January 2017
  • From: Southern Florida Gulf Coast
  • 18,255 posts
Posted by SeeYou190 on Tuesday, August 3, 2021 10:00 AM

I didn't notice this when I was there, but I saw it while sorting some pictures.

The DURANGO AND SILVERTON has both leaf and coil springs on the passenger gondolas.

-Kevin

Living the dream.

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