Baldwin Sharknose Dynamic Brakes

[mvlandsw]

Did the PRR BP20 Baldwin passenger units and the sharknose freight units have dynamic brakes?

Mark Vinski

[Wolf359]

According to Wikipedia, none of these locomotives ever came equipped with dynamic brakes. But, there may be someone else out there with more knowledge of these locos that could confirm if this is true or not.

[oldline1]

I don't knowabout the BP-20s but according to this the RF-16s had them.

https://www.american-rails.com/rf16.html

oldline1

[KemacPrr]

Mark all the freight Sharks BF-15 and 16 on the PRR had dynamic brakes. The passenger sharks the BP-20's did not. Also the Centipedes did not have dynamic brakes. ----   Ken 

[OT Dean]

oldline1

I don't knowabout the BP-20s but according to this the RF-16s had them.

https://www.american-rails.com/rf16.html

oldline1

 

I recall reading somewhere that the only thing that put off a lot of potential buyers was the fact that the Sharknoses used a different transition mechanism that wouldn't MU with EMD, Alco, and F-M.  I think I later read that at least one road replaced the Baldwin transition units and replaced them with EMD units.  However, as usual, my memory often leaves much to be desired...

Deano

[Overmod]

The MU incompatibility with Sharks was far more related to their throttle controls.  Most Baldwins used an air throttle that was incompatible with 8-notch Woodward-governor relay control, and only relatively late in production did Baldwin offer an 'electric' MU option.

Transition is more of an internal function on locomotives; the concern  in MU support being for manual up and down on the trailing units, and that could have been provided relatively easily as contactor/relay control -- had the throttle issue been addressed first.

We might recall the fiasco with newly-surplus E units on PRR while the BP20s were still nearly new:  freight engineers expected automatic back transition not on passenger engines, and it wasn't too long before TrucTrains were making unscheduled stops in Flashover City...

[Overmod]

The issue of dynamics on BP20s is a bit more complicated.  As far as I know, none had them even experimentally, perhaps due in part to concern over excessive wheelslide on A-1-A trucks in that era.

But the whole splendid history of these engines on the Long Branch service would have been greatly enhanced with proper dynamics, something explicitly said to me by one of the men who loved running them.  The test conversion to 'freight' power would certainly have benefited from at least some DB capability of its own, and the same is true for the documented freight use of the B units after the A's went East.  Hopefully someone like Allen or Will is going to read this and comment.

[angelob6660]

KemacPrr

Also the Centipedes did not have dynamic brakes. 

 

[SPSOT fan]

Yes, but remember that the centipedes were originally intended for the top PRR passenger trains, until unreliability bumped them into helper service. Therefore, in their original intended purpose, dynamic breaks where not really necessary.

[rrinker]

 The way I've always understood it, from both literature (susepct of course) and accounts from those who ran them, the Baldwin air throttles incorporated an anti-slip system, so even rather rough handling wouldn't cause wheel slip - instead, maximum power was apllied to the limit of adhesion without having to feather the throttle. In a way, the Baldwin system was ahead of its time. ANd of course, different from the others so misunderstood and unloved by railroads who liked to have everything the same.

                                   --Randy

 

[dti406]

SPSOT fan

Yes, but remember that the centipedes were originally intended for the top PRR passenger trains, until unreliability bumped them into helper service. Therefore, in their original intended purpose, dynamic breaks where not really necessary.

 

I remember reading an article in Trains on the Centipedes, and the shop forces at the end of the Centipede era avoided changing the brake shoes as there were so many of them on the locomotive and they were hard to get to.

Rick Jesionowski