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Fleshing out a proto-freelance railroad?

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Fleshing out a proto-freelance railroad?
Posted by ncandstl576 on Saturday, January 12, 2019 4:34 PM

The concept of proto-freelancing is attractive to me, as it offers a happy medium between the freedoms of freelancing and the constraints of prototype modelling. The most common form of PF modelling is to create a fictitious company out of wholecloth, along with any predecessor companies, taking inspiration from prototype companies. Another form involves taking one or more prototypes and modelling living past their historical demise, or operating in areas they didn't historically operate in.

My two ideas at the moment are: 1) the Georgia, Florida & Alabama Railway between Richland, GA and Tallahassee in the 1950s; and 2) the NC&StL acquring the line from East St. Louis to Evansville in the 1950s

But, how can you take a concept for a PF line and flesh it out? How can we estimate the numbers of locos and rolling stock a line needs? How many trains would run on a line, and organize them into timetables? 

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Posted by BigDaddy on Saturday, January 12, 2019 6:20 PM

ncandstl576
How can we estimate the numbers of locos and rolling stock a line needs?

Depends on the President of the railroad's bank account.  Big Smile 

Same for running trains, how much time and help to do you have?  I watch Horseshoe Curve webcam on youtube, but I don't want nor am able to duplicate that level of activity. 

Incidentally Youtuber, James Wright said he has 1000 pieces of rolling stock.  How do you manage 1000 pieces of rolling stock?  I could go years without ever seeing or missing or even knowing what I had. 

What I am saying is that the prototype shouldn't control you.  You only have a fixed amount of time, space and money.  Fill it with what works for you.

Henry

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Posted by dehusman on Saturday, January 12, 2019 7:37 PM

ncandstl576
The most common form of PF modelling is to create a fictitious company out of wholecloth, along with any predecessor companies, taking inspiration from prototype companies.

I hate the term "proto-freelancing".  If you make up your railroad its freelancing, pure and simple.

ncandstl576
Another form involves taking one or more prototypes and modelling living past their historical demise, or operating in areas they didn't historically operate in.

In my mind proto-freelancing is only taking a prototype railroad and modeling it on an line on which they didn't operate, either invented by the modeler or a another railroad.

ncandstl576
But, how can you take a concept for a PF line and flesh it out? How can we estimate the numbers of locos and rolling stock a line needs? How many trains would run on a line, and organize them into timetables?

Don't over think it.  Its is absolutely no different than most other model railroads.  How many locos and how many cars are directly related to how big the layout is, how many staging tracks, how many industries and how many trains you want to run.  If its a 4x8 layout then you are probably only running 1 train at a time.  If its bigger then you can run more trains.  Nobody uses the prototype number of trains or the prototype schedules as is.  Every model railroad has to modify the schedules somewhat to make the model railroad work.

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Posted by ncandstl576 on Saturday, January 12, 2019 7:50 PM

dehusman

 

 
ncandstl576
The most common form of PF modelling is to create a fictitious company out of wholecloth, along with any predecessor companies, taking inspiration from prototype companies.

 

I hate the term "proto-freelancing".  If you make up your railroad its freelancing, pure and simple.

 

 
ncandstl576
Another form involves taking one or more prototypes and modelling living past their historical demise, or operating in areas they didn't historically operate in.

 

In my mind proto-freelancing is only taking a prototype railroad and modeling it on an line on which they didn't operate, either invented by the modeler or a another railroad.

 

 
ncandstl576
But, how can you take a concept for a PF line and flesh it out? How can we estimate the numbers of locos and rolling stock a line needs? How many trains would run on a line, and organize them into timetables?

 

Don't over think it.  Its is absolutely no different than most other model railroads.  How many locos and how many cars are directly related to how big the layout is, how many staging tracks, how many industries and how many trains you want to run.  If its a 4x8 layout then you are probably only running 1 train at a time.  If its bigger then you can run more trains.  Nobody uses the prototype number of trains or the prototype schedules as is.  Every model railroad has to modify the schedules somewhat to make the model railroad work.

 

I'm afraid I can't help overthinking it - I actually enjoy bookkeeping and paperwork. I don't mean the number of models the modeler purchases, but how many the railroad owns within its universe. It's all part of trying to craft a story for your railroad - now I just need to figure out how to do that.

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Posted by doctorwayne on Saturday, January 12, 2019 11:12 PM

Dave makes some good points.

There's nothing wrong with creating some background info and deciding what you're actually going to model, but the deeper you're drawn into the theoretical aspect of things, the better the chances that the actual layout building will be either delayed or simply not happen. 

Decide how much of the prototype you want to represent and how much of your freelanced road you want to include, and match that to what it will cost, in both money and time, and the space required, too.  Then just "do it".

I've seen or listened to too many "modellers" paralysed by over-planning - great, well-detailed plans, but never executed...it's almost as if they're two separate hobbies.

My layout is freelanced, but interchanges directly with four real railroads (represented only by staging yards and some examples of their equipment), and interchanges, through them, with many other North American real railroads.  I try to model mostly plausible stuff, but don't model real places, even though the place names may be real.  That allows me to do the freelancing part with the modelled portion of the layout and the equipment of my freelanced roads, but also gives connections to the "real" world through representations of real railroads' equipment. 
I don't care how many locomotives my direct interchange partners have:  I'll represent the ones I wish to model, if any, and likewise for their rolling stock.

Wayne

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Posted by ncandstl576 on Sunday, January 13, 2019 3:07 AM

doctorwayne

Dave makes some good points.

There's nothing wrong with creating some background info and deciding what you're actually going to model, but the deeper you're drawn into the theoretical aspect of things, the better the chances that the actual layout building will be either delayed or simply not happen. 

Decide how much of the prototype you want to represent and how much of your freelanced road you want to include, and match that to what it will cost, in both money and time, and the space required, too.  Then just "do it".

I've seen or listened to too many "modellers" paralysed by over-planning - great, well-detailed plans, but never executed...it's almost as if they're two separate hobbies.

My layout is freelanced, but interchanges directly with four real railroads (represented only by staging yards and some examples of their equipment), and interchanges, through them, with many other North American real railroads.  I try to model mostly plausible stuff, but don't model real places, even though the place names may be real.  That allows me to do the freelancing part with the modelled portion of the layout and the equipment of my freelanced roads, but also gives connections to the "real" world through representations of real railroads' equipment. 
I don't care how many locomotives my direct interchange partners have:  I'll represent the ones I wish to model, if any, and likewise for their rolling stock.

Wayne

 

Thank you, I agree wholeheartedly with what you, Dave, and BigDaddy have said so far. I certainly didn't want to appear ungrateful, I only wanted to clarify where I'm coming from. 

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Posted by dehusman on Sunday, January 13, 2019 7:14 AM

ncandstl576
My two ideas at the moment are: 1) the Georgia, Florida & Alabama Railway between Richland, GA and Tallahassee in the 1950s; and 2) the NC&StL acquring the line from East St. Louis to Evansville in the 1950s But, how can you take a concept for a PF line and flesh it out? How can we estimate the numbers of locos and rolling stock a line needs? How many trains would run on a line, and organize them into timetables?

ncandstl576
I don't mean the number of models the modeler purchases, but how many the railroad owns within its universe. It's all part of trying to craft a story for your railroad - now I just need to figure out how to do that.

A railroad doesn't separate cars by "routes", it buys them for a service or the entire system.  Same to a certain extent with engines.

If you are modeling an existing line then it would be what the actual railroad that operated that line ran.  If you are modeling the line from ESTL to Evansville, then what did the real railroad operate on that line, how many trains with how many cars with how many engines?  Then translate that into the types of engines the NC&STL owned. 

Since the customer base would more or less be the same regardless of who owned the line.  It would be the same mix of cars.  Unless there was some unique industry that required a special type of car, adding just one subdivision isn't going to materially increase the number of cars a railroad is going to own.  It certainly isn't going to change the composition of the national fleet and since cars other than the home road will be 50-75% of the fleet on the layout there is no change there. 

Plus the mix of cars on a subdivison doesn't really have anything to do with the mix of cars the railroad owns.  It has to do with the routes and the customers on those routes.  The classic example is the MP/UP in Ft Worth, Texas.  At Tower 55 an E-W MP/UP line crosses a N-S MP/UP line.  Same railroad but if you just looked at the mix of cars on each line, you couldn't tell they were the same railroad.  Two completely different mixes of cars.  You could model the "UP" but depending on which line you picked, you would need two completely different rosters for a model railroad.

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Sunday, January 13, 2019 8:33 AM

ncandstl576
But, how can you take a concept for a PF line and flesh it out?

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I have been fleshing out the STRATTON AND GILLETTE since 1983.

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It went through so many changes in its "Proto-Freelance" periods. It interchanged with the Seaboard System, Santa Fe, New York Central, Northern Pacific, and others at various times of development. I had huge histories I had written. It has been an N scale double track mainline in 1968, and a small HO ISL in 1954.

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I finally realized that the real world has no place on my fantasy world, and I dropped the "Proto", and now I just freelance.

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I am so much happier now.

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-Kevin

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Happily modeling the STRATTON & GILLETTE RAILROAD located in a world of plausible nonsense set in August, 1954.

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Posted by NHTX on Sunday, January 13, 2019 11:18 PM

    NC&StL576, creating the backstory for your railroad can easily become a hobby unto itself but to answer your questions, how many locomotives did your combined prototypes roster in the era you are modeling?  Let the prototype be the guide for your THEORETICAL fleet.  As stated, your layout size, area modeled and real finances will dictate your model roster.

     The number of trains would probably reflect the prototype's level of service on the route that interests you.  An employee's timetable may list through and local freights in addition to passenger service.  Even when freelancing, most of us have a prototype that we wish to emulate to some degree, which in most cases is sound guidance.

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Posted by ncandstl576 on Monday, January 14, 2019 6:55 AM

NHTX

    NC&StL576, creating the backstory for your railroad can easily become a hobby unto itself but to answer your questions, how many locomotives did your combined prototypes roster in the era you are modeling?  Let the prototype be the guide for your THEORETICAL fleet.  As stated, your layout size, area modeled and real finances will dictate your model roster.

     The number of trains would probably reflect the prototype's level of service on the route that interests you.  An employee's timetable may list through and local freights in addition to passenger service.  Even when freelancing, most of us have a prototype that we wish to emulate to some degree, which in most cases is sound guidance.

 

For the NC&StL idea, I only have Prince's book on L&N steam at the moment, and while he mentions some of the classes that worked on the division, he doesn't mention how many engines worked there. 

For the GF&A, they had 24 engines at the time of the SAL takeover.

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Posted by mbinsewi on Monday, January 14, 2019 7:23 AM

My thoughts on proto freelance, I think the proto part has only to do with making your models fit the time period.

Rolling stock detailed to what rolling stock of the time period was.  Locomotives the same, along with street vehicles.  Buildings can be timeless, as look at all the old buildings in towns and cities of all sizes around the country. Industries that may have been part of the time period, and how important rail service might have been.

I think that as is far as the proto part goes.

I always called my little freelanced short line a proto freelanced because of detailing rolling stock and locomotives from the 90's to mid 2000's.

But it is strictly freelance.  My little shortline never excisted, but trains from other roads did, so I try to make them prototypical (there's that word again) to the time period.

I get the part about the "backstory" of a freelanced road, but we've seen before in here how it can get overwhelming and stop the progess of actually building the railroad.

Mike.

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Posted by dehusman on Monday, January 14, 2019 12:20 PM

ncandstl576
For the GF&A, they had 24 engines at the time of the SAL takeover.

Pretty much any railroad would have more engines than would be on the layout.  So if you are freelancing a class 1 railroad it really doesn't matter how many engines the parent company has, you can make it up. 

What counts is how many engines you need on your layout and that depends on how much you are modeling.  I model a shortline that became a branch line of a class 1.  Even though the shortline had about 35 engines when it was independent and the class 1 had hundreds of engines, I only need about 5 switch engines and about 6-8 road engines to operate the layout. In reality, the RDG had in my era had up to 4-5 switch engines a shift in both Wilmington and Coatesville.  Cool, but that really has no bearing on may layout since I don't have the space to accomodate 4 or 5 switch engines operating per shift at either Wilmington or Coatesville.

What is more important is what type and the mix of engines.  Are you using 2-8-0's or 2-8-2's?  Do passenger trains have 4-6-0's or 4-6-2's or 4-8-2's?  Does your railroad use GP's or F units, Alco's or EMD's or Baldwins?  For example on my layout, the switch engines will all be 0-4-0 and 0-6-0 types, with maybe an 0-8-0.  The road power will 4-4-0, 4-6-0 and 2-8-0 engines.  The RDG had many other types of engiens, but they rarely, if ever, operated on the branch.  So it doesn't matter that the RDG had 4-2-2, 2-4-2, 4-4-4 and other odd duck engines, they wouldn't have operated on the division I'm modeling.

 

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Monday, January 14, 2019 6:42 PM

mbinsewi
My little shortline never excisted, but trains from other roads did, so I try to make them prototypical

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I found the solution to that!

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Wink

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-Kevin

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Monday, January 14, 2019 8:10 PM

I describe my layout as freelanced prototypical. The freelance part is easy, and I stretch that fairly often; otherwise, why freelance? The prototypical part is a little more difficult to explain, and I often stretch that as well. And it's entirely possible prototypical doesn't mean what I think it means, or at least I don't think it means what some others understand it to mean.

When I say prototypical, what I mean is realistic, plausible, recognizable. I like things to look and act like they do in the 1:1 world. I like buildings to look like buildings and structures to look like structures. The trains already look like trains, and I rely on Atlas and Athearn and Kato and Intermountain and BLI et al to see to that. I make no attempt to mimic real-life trains or historical railroads in miniature. My layout is not set in stone to some specific date or some specific era or some specific locale, and I do not operate by well-known timetables, schedules, or rules. The layout is generally modern era, but I have no compunction against stretching that timeframe as well. So, no, maybe prototypical is not the right word, and I might follow Kevin and drop it entirely.

As an example of realistic and plausible . . . my layout has a deep-water port, and docked at the longshore berths are a very large container ship (Albatros), laden with thousands of containers (presumably from Asia) and an automobile carrier (Ming-na Maru) loaded with autos (also presumably from from Asia). Their presence along the dockside together with onshore facilities means that I can have a 40-car double stack unit train and a 15-car string of autoracks travel hither and yon all over the layout without ever having to explain how they got there (trains, docks, ships) or where they're going (trains, ships) or where they've been. Plausible, probable, self-evident. Wherever they are located on the layout and no matter which direction they travel, loaded well cars are headed to Talleyrand Intermodal, and empties are headed back to North Shore Yard. Same story with coal porters: loads travel from Mystic Mining and Materials to Plant Yeager (coal-fired electric generating plant), and empties travel vice-versa the other way around. Same for the steel mill; same for the chemical plant and the paper mill; same for the grain and sugar processing facilities. Loads in, empties out. Raw materials in, finished products out. Simple.

I have a fondness for passenger trains, and several make the round trip from the big downtown passenger station to the far-flung small town depot and back. My passenger trains do, admittedly, stretch the time frame a little. I have a set of heavyweight cars pulled by a Pennsy M1B; a streamlined Broadway Limited painted a terrific shade of Tuscan Red and pulled by an A-A brace of E8/9s; a silver CB&Q California Zephyr; an Amtrak consist of Phase III and IV Superliners; and a Japan Railways N700A Shinkansen Nozomi; the last being the only one I apologize for or even explain. And like the passenger trains, the previously-mentioned freight trains carry livery from all over: UP, BNSF, BN, SF, CSX, ACL, SCL, NS, CB&Q, CNW, PRR . . . you name it.

There is a pretty detailed layout narrative on my blog (and published elsewhere) that tells a moderately cohesive story how such a disparate array of stuff can come together as a whole. I'm not sure how things are turning out, and I'm not entirely sure they ever will, but in the meantime I try not to get too bogged down with details.

Robert

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Thursday, January 17, 2019 5:41 AM

ROBERT PETRICK
I might follow Kevin and drop it entirely.

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Be careful where you tread Robert, this rabbit hole leads to all kinds of crazy places! (but they are all fun)

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-Kevin

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Posted by ncandstl576 on Saturday, January 19, 2019 9:16 AM

One common feature of freelance layouts is fictitious towns. This is a very common sight - the Virginian & Ohio, the Maumee Route, and the Allegheny Midland most notably - but I'm wondering how realistic this is. 

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Posted by doctorwayne on Saturday, January 19, 2019 12:56 PM

ncandstl576

One common feature of freelance layouts is fictitious towns. This is a very common sight - the Virginian & Ohio, the Maumee Route, and the Allegheny Midland most notably - but I'm wondering how realistic this is. 


How much would realism suffer if the towns were representing real ones served by a fictitious railroad? 
I used real placenames for all of my towns, but made little-to-no-effort to replicate their actual appearance.  Their use was a combination of personal connections and just liking the emotions evoked by my memories of them.  Had I modelled them realistically, I would have had almost no industries for my railroad to serve.

In addition to that, many of my industries are named for real ones, but only a couple might bear any resemblance to their prototype.  The ones not based on any particular prototype are usually named either for friends or fictitious characters and industries.
 
My freelanced railroads, all four of them, have some representation on the layout, but interchange at any of the five staging yards is with real railroads which existed in the same late '30s-era as my layout.  Some of the cars are stand-ins, but many are fairly accurate representations of their prototypes, as are the locomotives of those which are direct interchange partners. 

Most of us are constrained by the space available for our layouts, so we resort to selective compression, editing out those things which are perhaps unattractive, or non-railroad related.  It would be tough to model most small towns in their entirety, as much of them will have little-to-no direct connection with the railroad - they're simply background scenery at best.

My layout, in an oddly shaped room of about 560sq.ft., is partially double-decked, affording roughly 500sq.ft. of layout area.  I could have used it all to model a very small portion of the steel plant where I worked.  Instead, I opted for a semi-rural layout, with towns too close together, and grades which tax locomotives to their limits.
 
I have no regrets for the layout choices I've made...they accommodate my imagination just as I had hoped they would, affording lots of opportunities for creativity.
Wayne
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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Saturday, January 19, 2019 1:15 PM

My little layout town is fictitious, but I hope it looks like a nice little town/city. And it is prototypical in its own fashion.

There are buildings and shops from all over the country; an Art Deco department store from Florida next door to a restaurant from Wyoming, a theatre in Kentucky two blocks away from a theatre in Atlanta, a bridge in Florida at the mouth of the Port of Los Angeles, a skyscraper from Chicago next to a skyscraper from New York, and a teriffic dinky little residence from the middle-of-nowhere Pennsylvania tossed in just for fun. All prototypical, all realistic, all wrong.

Robert

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Posted by mbinsewi on Saturday, January 19, 2019 2:37 PM

If your worried about fictitious towns, then maybe you better go strictly prototype modeling.  Model everything just the way it is, or was, including your railroad.  That way you won't have to worry so much about mixing prototypical, and freelanced.

You won't have to come up with a back story for your railroad, or the towns, or insustries, because they all really excisted.

I have "fictitious" towns, Merton, named after my father, Rock Springs, named that just because I wanted to.  And if you really, really look close at the court house in my city scene, which is Rock Springs, you'll faintly make out "Des Moines County"  OMG!

But I love it.

Mike.

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Saturday, January 19, 2019 7:51 PM

There are six towns in my planned operating scheme.

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Two will be modeled on the layout. For the time being, they are named "Centerville" and "Port Annabel".

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From Centerville trains can go off layout North to "Springfield", South to "Shelbyville", or West to "Manchester". From Centerville they can also stay on the layout and go East to Port Annabel.

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From Port Annabel, Trains can go off layout North to "Great Divide", or back to Centerville.

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So as you can see, I used recognizable fictional names for all my cites.

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Centerville - The Twilight Zone

Springfield and Shelbyville - The Simpsons

Port Annabel and Great Divide - John Allen

Manchester - George Sellios

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-Kevin

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Happily modeling the STRATTON & GILLETTE RAILROAD located in a world of plausible nonsense set in August, 1954.

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Posted by riogrande5761 on Sunday, January 20, 2019 7:49 AM

dehusman

I  hate the term "proto-freelancing".  If you make up your railroad its freelancing, pure and simple.

Then maybe the term was misused but proto-freelancing, or proto lancing does describe some layout types.  Why hate the term?

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Posted by dehusman on Sunday, January 20, 2019 8:42 AM

riogrande5761
Then maybe the term was misused but proto-freelancing, or proto lancing does describe some layout types. Why hate the term?

It is used by some people to indicate a "specific" type of modeling, but it is so vaguely defined that it pretty much could include everything between 100% prototype and 100% fantasy, which means the term could be applied to about 99% of model railroads.  It really doesn't add any clarity to the conversation, its just a buzzword.

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Sunday, January 20, 2019 8:51 PM

dehusman
but it is so vaguely defined that it pretty much could include everything between 100% prototype and 100% fantasy,

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The STRATTON AND GILLETTE is 100% nonsense (fantasy), and I would become deeply offended if anyone used the prefix "proto" to describe anything on it!

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-Kevin

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Posted by FRRYKid on Tuesday, January 22, 2019 11:57 PM

I use the term "protolancing" to describe my layouts - at least the last two. The first one was abandoned due my parents moving into town and off the ranch. The new one is composed of what was to have been an expansion and one section that was saved from that old layout.

The idea behind it is after BN merger they decided to discontinue operating to old NP lines. That led to the creation of a Class II short line similar to the MRL. (My avatar is the logo for that railroad.) As for the locos,  what would need to be done is for them to be consistent in manufacturer to make it easier on the shop people to maintain them. (I have eight GP20s - two in passenger livery, an SW1000 which was purchased new, an ex-NP GP7 and an F7 also for passenger service, and couple of SW7s all in forms of my road's scheme. All EMD.)

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Posted by Erie1951 on Wednesday, January 23, 2019 7:50 AM

I like that term "protolancing". For the "proto" part of my new layout, I'm setting it in the early '50s and as a real railroad, the Erie, in a real city, Paterson, NJ. I knew them both well way back. The "lancing" part is the location of a fictional Erie transfer yard between the Erie and the DL&W. That's located in a real open area at the end of Mill Street in Paterson and will have a fictional freight connection with the former DL&W's Boonton Branch. I'm also including industries that are reminiscent of the city, such as one of the textile mills that made the city known as the "Silk City" because of the many mills there. So, it will have the (new abstract term here) "flavor" of both the Erie and of the city.

Russ

Modeling the early '50s Erie in Paterson, NJ.  Here's the link to my railroad postcard collection: https://railroadpostcards.blogspot.com/

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Posted by NHTX on Wednesday, January 23, 2019 11:22 AM

    This entire discussion should not lose sight of one fact--it is MODEL railroading.  A model is a reasonable facsimile of a real object.  Whether it is painted Santa Fe or Wobble, Bobble and Stop, compromises have been made to miniaturize it.

     Our locomotives run on electricity from a wall outlet, not diesel fuel from their tiny "fuel tanks".  Our freight cars haul mostly air, not corn, scrap steel or sulphuric acid.  Passenger cars are populated with styrene figurines, not little flesh and blood customers.  Think about this.  In HO, 12 actual inches equals 87 HO feet.  A prototype passing siding stretches one and a half to two miles in length.  On our HO railroads we would need 90 to 120 feet of real space to accurately model ONE passing track.  Never mind towns, industries, yards etc.  The answer is compromise, selective compression and omission.  How realistic is that?  Our little ten or 12 foot "passing" tracks all of a sudden become acceptable as "realistic".

     My point is we start out in this hobby accepting the fact that compromises are what makes it all possible.  The OP knows going in that he will NEVER be able to accurately model every town along the line he is interested in.  If he models anything at all, it will be important to accomplishing a reasonable representation of what drew him to the NC&StL in the first place.

     I too, chase realism--in those things important to fulfilling my visions of miniaturization.  I accept the compromises I cannot ignore and pursue those things that are achieveable.  Long ago I realized I could never fully model Dime Box, Texas in its entirety and am quite happy with what I do have, no matter what I call it.  It is still all about having fun, isn't it?

  • Member since
    December, 2008
  • From: In the heart of Georgia
  • 3,046 posts
Posted by Doughless on Wednesday, January 23, 2019 11:25 AM

If you're going to model the ESTL to Eville line of the L&N as if it was taken over by the NCandSTL, why not just research what L&N locos tended to run on that line and say the new railroad acquired the locos too.  You can simply patch the locos with the NC&STL emblem and paint over the L&N logo.  L&N tends to be a fairly common road name for model locos, at least more so than NC & STL.  If you can't find a model of a particular L&N loco, then say that loco was pulled from service (the L& N slipped you a junker) and replace it with a suitable NC&STL loco.

It sounds like it will be easier and maybe more fun to just research what actually ran on the L&N than it will be for you to come up with a suitable back story that's independent of reality.

Including a previous discussion, I think that East/West L&N line from Eville to STL may have had its main interchange with the C&EI at Mt Vernon IN and not so much at Eville.

- Douglas

  • Member since
    October, 2018
  • 51 posts
Posted by ncandstl576 on Wednesday, January 23, 2019 12:29 PM

Doughless

If you're going to model the ESTL to Eville line of the L&N as if it was taken over by the NCandSTL, why not just research what L&N locos tended to run on that line and say the new railroad acquired the locos too.  You can simply patch the locos with the NC&STL emblem and paint over the L&N logo.  L&N tends to be a fairly common road name for model locos, at least more so than NC & STL.  If you can't find a model of a particular L&N loco, then say that loco was pulled from service (the L& N slipped you a junker) and replace it with a suitable NC&STL loco.

It sounds like it will be easier and maybe more fun to just research what actually ran on the L&N than it will be for you to come up with a suitable back story that's independent of reality.

Including a previous discussion, I think that East/West L&N line from Eville to STL may have had its main interchange with the C&EI at Mt Vernon IN and not so much at Eville.

 

The history of my layout would start to diverge witht the purchase of the St. Louis and Southeastern in 1880. This scenario supposes the L&N didn't manage to swipe it from the NC&StL.  

Thanks for the info on the C&EI, IUIC the MoPac was in Mt. Vernon as well.

  • Member since
    May, 2012
  • 1,619 posts
Posted by angelob6660 on Wednesday, January 23, 2019 5:12 PM

I have a several proto-freelance railroads. One that stands out is the Georgia, North Carolina, and Ohio Railway that runs on Norfolk and Western and Southern Ry trackage rights. Including Norfolk Southern as well. It's a Class 2 railroad with over 1,000 miles traveling north to south in Atlanta, GA- Charlotte, NC- Bluefield, WV- Columbus, OH.

Locomotives in eras of modeling 

?- 1938-1946

179 diesels w/o b units: 1946-1965

293 diesels: 1966-1990

345 diesels: 1990-2007

*estimates on locomotives since majority might be wrecked in service. Some locomotives were retired within these years.*

Freight Cars are a little confusing but still on the math. 

Boxcar/reefer/insulted/auto parts- 1000 

Hopper/bethgon- 300-500 

Flatcars- 100

Covered Hoppers/ 2-3 bay - 450

Tank cars- 25 

Gondolas- 300

Caboose- 150

 

On my layout it will be at least 6 boxcars and covered hoppers, 2 to 4 gondolas, 16 hoppers, 1 or 2 flatcars.

 

I hope this helps your fictional railroad situation.

Modeling the G.N.O. Railway, The Diamond Route.

Amtrak America, 1971-Present.

  • Member since
    October, 2018
  • 51 posts
Posted by ncandstl576 on Monday, January 28, 2019 1:58 PM

In cases where a route is completely fictitious, is it a good idea to use modern day highway and interstate routes to help with plotting the course of your railroad?

When I was considering a coal hauler - the Richmond & Ohio - it started off at the port of Norfolk, swung north to Richmond, and paralleled I-64 to Staunton. From here, I could swing north to meet the Western Maryland at Durbin or Webster Springs, or provide a more direct route to Charleston via Marlinton-Richwood-Summersville-Deepwater.

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