I'm trying to start a new layout of the B&O. I was wondering if anyone knows what locomotives ran on the B&O in the years of 1940 to 1950. its a freelance based on prototype. i cant seem to find any real lists on the internet. can some one help.
This will be good for the diesels.
http://www.northeast.railfan.net/bo.html
Richard
Gidday, You may well be familiar with this site which while not a definitive roster has some good information if you're prepared to do some home work...................
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/locoList.aspx?id=BO&Page=1
Cheers, the Bear.
"One difference between pessimists and optimists is that while pessimists are more often right, optimists have far more fun."
Another source of photos is: www.rr-fallenflags.org
Scroll down to the Baltimore & Ohio section.
http://borail.net/
http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/Baltimore_and_Ohio/
http://www.borail.org/
Three good resources
Sean
HO Scale CSX Modeler
bomodeler I'm trying to start a new layout of the B&O. I was wondering if anyone knows what locomotives ran on the B&O in the years of 1940 to 1950. its a freelance based on prototype. i cant seem to find any real lists on the internet. can some one help.
Don Ball's book "America's Colorful Railroads" deals with the steam-to-diesel transition period you're dealing with. There are several photos of the B&O in the book, which can be had for bargain prices via the internet. Web sites tend to showcase a selection of photos, most of which would not cover the period 1940-1950.
"Blue Diesels and Black Diamonds" by John Henderson shows earlier photos of F7's and GP's in action.
What service are you looking to model, road freight, passenger, switching, or a combination? Road freight was dominated by EMD F and GP7/9 units, with smaller numbers of Alco FAs and Baldwin RF16s. There were small numbers of FM roadswitchers.
Switchers included early EMD, Alco, and Baldwin units. Passenger units included early EMD E units; B&O EA 51 is part of the B&O collection in Baltimore.
Many units were passed along from partner C&O, including Alco RS1 and RSD12 and Baldwin AS616. Not sure if these came along in the period you're looking to model.
Good luck, Bob
The era you listed is mostly steam with new diesels being introduced. I believe you are looking for early diesels and the B&O used the early E units for passenger before 1950. If you want to run later F units, your era should include up to 1952 or 53. The steam used was mostly USRA Pacific and Mikes, with EM1 an exception to mostly USRA light locos.
Freight units were F3 sets starting in 1948 and F7 sets in late 1950 to 1952
Thanks to Unofficial EMD listings for order numbers.
cz
.
E6 units
With research being one of the keys to a quality layout, remember that the internet is not the only source and your local library can often acquire items on interlibrary loan if cost is a big concern.
The "classic" reference is likely B & O Power: Steam, Diesel and Electric Power of the Baltimore and Ohio Railroad 1829-1964 by Lawrence W. Sagle. Copyright 1964 by Alvin Staufer. Roster date in this volume includes that of railroads that were incorporated into the B&O. This book achieved rather wide distribution, and it often turns up at train shows at very low prices.
Also of note would be B&O Steam Finale Volume 1 and B&O Steam Finale Volume 2 by Deane Mellander and Bob Kaplan. Vol. 1 came out in 1986 and Vol. 2 in 1988. The color photos in these volumes provide multiple ideas about weathering, and the backgrounds are engaging as well.
Bill
The steam used was mostly USRA Pacific and Mikes, with EM1 an exception to mostly USRA light locos.
While the B&O did have sizable fleets of USRA light Mikes and light Pacifics, neither of those locos represented a majority of those wheel arrangements on the B&O.
And in fact most B&O Pacifics and Mikes where built to designs unique to the B&O. The B&O had more than 10 different classes of Mikes, for a total of 710 locos. Only 100 of those were of the USRA Light design. Along with the 100 USRA locos, the B&O Q4 Mikes, 135 locos built from 1920 to 1923 by Baldwin, were the mainstay of the freight power. The Q4 was not a USRA design or clone, but was similar in specs to a USRA heavy.
And they had ten classes of Pacifics, for a total of 243 locos, only 30 of which were their class P5, the USRA light design.
130 locos out of nearly 1000 is hardly "most".
The B&O built and rebuilt many of its own locos into various classes and sub classes. The famous "President" Class P7 Pacifics were built in 1927, to a design similar to, but not exactly the same as the earlier USRA HEAVY 4-6-2. The P7's were continually rebuilt and modernized and used until the end of steam.
Other noteable B&O locos include the 125 class S1 and S1a, 2-10-2, built between 1923 and 1926 - not a USRA design.
And their own home built 4-8-2's, Class T3. These locos performed so well the B&O never bought, or built any Northerns or Berkshire locos.
They also had over 100 2-8-8-0's in several classes.
Just a start,
Sheldon
Some more about B&O steam:
The other 2-8-2 of note on the B&O was the Q1, built between 1911 and 1913 by Baldwin, long before the USRA designs, originally 320 locos, some where used in varoius rebuilding projects into other types of locos, but many lasted well into the late 1940's
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/bo/bo-s4012vaa.jpg
The B&O also had numerious classes of 2-8-0's totaling well over 1000 locos, with a history to complex to explain here. But as an example here are few photos:
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/bo/bo-s2747gga.jpg
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/bo/bo-s2556gga.jpg
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/bo/bo-s2904gga.jpg
Hope this helps,
The classic Mantua metal 4-6-2, the one they kept in the catalog from 1950 or so for many decades, including in Tyco train sets as RTR and from Mantua as a fairly easy to build kit, is for the most part a model of a B&O prototype. At one time someone offered aftermarket spoked drivers but I do not know if those are still around.
For a time AHM/Rivarossi offered the 2-10-2 "Big Six" and of course they also offered both the Dockside and tender versions of the 0-4-0 which was B&O prototype. Many other outfits offerered the Dockside which however was not a system-wide engine.
I recall that at least one class of B&O 2-8-0 was actually Pennsy in origin (due to some corporate control if memory serves).
In brass it seemed Westside was the firm that had the biggest commitment to B&O prototypes that I can recall.
So between USRA prototypes and other sources you could assemble a pretty accurate roster.
Dave Nelson
Beach BillThe "classic" reference is likely B & O Power: Steam, Diesel and Electric Power of the Baltimore and Ohio Railroad 1829-1964 by Lawrence W. Sagle. Copyright 1964 by Alvin Staufer. Roster date in this volume includes that of railroads that were incorporated into the B&O. This book achieved rather wide distribution, and it often turns up at train shows at very low prices.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B0007EHA2U/ref=dp_olp_used?ie=UTF8&condition=used
I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it.
I don't have a leg to stand on.
There's some really good prototype resources so far, and; here is one more at American Rails' Fallen Flags section for the Baltimore & Ohio with a thorough history, too, including locomotive rosters.
Conemaugh Road & Traction circa 1956
Last Month I visited theBaltimore Railroad Museum and picked up an amazing book published by the museum itself. It is called "Scale Modelling and the B&O Railroad.
It covers the model railroads built by the B&O for publicity purposes, most of which were in the transition period from steam to diesel. The book has 77 pages, the first 29 iluustrating the B&O's model railroads, in O and HO gauges. The second half of the book contains reproductions of modeller's drawings and photographs of locomotives of the B&O during the transition period. These include the P-1 and P-7 Pacifics (the latter in original and post war condition), the EM-1 2-8-8-4, the EA and E8 passenger diesels, many other types down to the dockside tank and the "grasshopper" Atlantic. There are drawings of streamlined and heavyweight passenger cars and freight cars including the wagon top caboose. The drawings are reproduced to 1/8 inch to the foot., the originals being 1/4 inch to the foot.
The book is very large page size (twice quarto), landscape format with spiral binding so that drawings can be photocopied to modelling scales without distortion. It has heavy card covers.
When I picked up the book, I looked at the price tag, and took it to the counter and asked if it was correct.
It was correct. It cost $9-00 (that's nine dollars...)
I'd think that the museum would be happy to mail a copy, although the shipping cost might be relatively high compared to the purchase cost. If you are in Baltimore, you can get into the shop without paying to go into the museum....
For someone modelling the B&O transition period, at that price can you afford NOT to buy it?
M636C
Wow that sounds like quite a bargain. Interesting, since the B&O display layouts are often crediting with being among the real pioneering motivators for people to get into scale model railroading. If memory serves, back in those early days two popular authors, Larry Sagle, and Mel Thornburgh, both worked for the B&O so the early days MR project articles and drawing had lots of B&O.
If you happen to find the 1944 Model Railroader Cyclopedia at a swap meet, buy it for the wealth of prototype drawings and data. And the B&O is well represented: 0-4-0, 2-8-0, two 4-6-0s, 4-6-2, coach, combine, wagon top box car, 50 ton box car, crane, and color position light signals. I think I got my copy for $25 at a swap meet and consider it money well spent.
When you say you want to freelance this thing, you really open up a can of worms; and "1940-50" means cutting out anything built after 1950. If you mean the 1950's, then you'll have a much different roster. Location and date determine just about everything. For freight in the '40's, B&O introduced FT's during WWII for through service Philadelphia-Willard, OH. F3's in 2-unit sets worked through to St. Louis, but there weren't enough to displace steam entirely till about 1957. Two unit F5 sets were assigned to the BR&P, spliced with F7B's after about 1950. B&O generally used articulated engines in the mountains, but articulated pushers were replaced with 4-unit F-7 sets in 1949, and the older Mallets were generally out of a job; the EM-1's worked in the mountains until about 1952 when most of them went west to handle long coal trains headed for Lake Erie. 2-10-2's worked between Brunswick, MD and Chicago (plus Toledo-Cincinnati); and Q-1, Q-4, and Q-7 Mikados could be found everywhere else. Q-3 USRA Mikes tended to stay west of the mountains, but not always. The branches tended to see a lot of E-24 (PRR origin; Lambert and Sunset produced HO models) and E-27 (PFM) Consolidations. A lot of odd Consolidation classes from absorbed roads lingered here and there until about 1950 or so when the diesels started coming in earnest. Then the smaller, older, nonstandard engines began to disappear and mainline Mikados got bumped down to more secondary roles as the diesels displaced them from the mainline. Older articulated engines were replaced by diesels on the mountain grades and steam tended to be concentrated in the flatlands west of New Castle, PA. The older Q-1 and Q-7 engines were retired before the newer Q-3-s and Q-4's. The dual-service 4-8-2's were used for some passenger service, mostly in the mountains; but they were most commonly seen in fast freight service between New Castle, PA and Chicago, with some use on other lines such as Toledo-Cincinnati. There were exceptions to this, but it's a GENERALLY correct outline.
Passenger service was mostly diesel, with 4-6-2's and sometimes 4-8-2's on secondary trains. The President class was usually kept east of the mountains (an exception was the Cincinnatian); P-5 (USRA) and P-6 (USRA copies) were generally kept in the west; and P-1's were generally used in the mountains. By the mid 1950's most or all steam passenger power, including the Presidents, was used west of the mountains.
The last steam run was in 1958; but for the most part, steam died on the B&O in 1957. By the way, the B&O roster endured a major renumbering at the beginning of 1957 (or the end of 1956 if you prefer). Most steamers used 4-digit numbers before the renumbering (exceptions were a few switchers), and the diesels used 3 digits. This was reversed at the renumbering.
Lawrence Sagle's Picture history of B&O Locomotives is pretty good if you can find it at a reasonable price. Stauffer's B&O Power is not the "Bible" it's purported to be, but it's a worthwhile book to have. Baltimore & Ohio Trackside with Willis McCaleb is pretty good, as is Baltimore & Ohio Steam in Color by David Mainey.