H1b Hudson

[Anonymous]

Hello
I'm planning on modelling a 4-6-4 Hudson after CP's Royal Hudson (2816) which is a class H1b. I'm trying to find some prototype info about it but I'm having a bit of difficulty. I've got the Steam Locomotives Cyclopedia and they start at the J class. Is the H1b very similar to some of the other classes, and which model released resembles it the closest? I'm leaning toward the latest BLI releases, because of the sound and quality etc, but do you think this is my best bet? Detailing would not be a problem but I need some more info. Anything would be appreciated.
Thanks

[nfmisso]

See:
http://www.steamlocomotive.com/hudson/cpr.html
http://www.forecyte.com/rlsteam3/cpr.htm
http://www8.cpr.ca/cms/English/General+Public/Steam+Train/default.htm
http://www.forecyte.com/nyccollection/ba617.htm
http://www.steamlocomotive.com/hudson/nyc.html

The CPR Hudsons were built by MLW, which had close ties to Alco, who built most of the NYC Hudsons.... The biggest difference seems to be driver diameter, and even that is not too much..... I would use a BLI model for a starting point too.

[CP5415]

The H1b 2816 is not is not a Royal Hudson. She's a sister to the H1c 2860 that sits out in BC.
The big difference being the Royal Hudsons are semi-streamlined while H1b's are not.
A freind pointed out to me that the Canadian Steam locomotives tended to be smaller than the American counter parts so using an American locomotive would not be prototypical if this is what you are going for.

Gordon

[nfmisso]

QUOTE: Originally posted by CP5415

A freind pointed out to me that the Canadian Steam locomotives tended to be smaller than the American counter parts so using an American locomotive would not be prototypical if this is what you are going for.

Gordon;

Check out the specs, the CPR H1 Hudsons are very close in size and weight to the NYC J1 Hudsons.

[Anonymous]

Well, the H1b has been done in brass more than a couple of times. Your best bet would to be to track down one. Van Hobbies did a run recently, but they're $1150CDN.

Basic specs are: http://www.rrsites.com/royalhudson/specs.htm

From the specs, The BLI J1e's are too big (5' too long, cylinders too big, drivers too big) and the boiler is significantly different. You could get away with running a TH&B Hudson if you model CP in southern ontario (TH&B had ex-NYC Hudson's and was owned by CP & NYC during the steam era)

Neither of the MR Cyclopedias has much info on Canadian prototypes. I'd look at finding a book on Canadian Pacific Steam, there are several on the market.

[CP5415]

Thanks Nigel, I guess I'm going to go re-check my info

Gordon

[Anonymous]

CP5415: all of CP's 4-6-4's were known as Royal Hudsons, not all were streamlined.

[M636C]

Higssy,

When you've got the correct dimensional data, look for a Mantua Pacific, which was sometimes available with a four wheel trailing truck as a Hudson. It would be about the right size and shape for a CPR H1b, but check the dimensions and see. Some Mantua pacifics had boxpok wheels, but I think some had spoked wheels.

Out of left field, the English company "Tri-ang" used to make a CPR pacific, a G3 (I think) based on their LMS "Princess" chassis. The locomotive shell and tender might be able to be used with a more modern chassis, and would look a lot like the H1b to start with. You may find a second hand Tri-ang available, a lot were built.

Peter

[Dayliner]

QUOTE: CP5415: all of CP's 4-6-4's were known as Royal Hudsons, not all were streamlined.

Actually, CP5415 is correct. There were five subclasses of class H1, a through e, and it was the latter three subclasses that were semi-streamlined and officially designated Royal Hudson after H1d 2850 pulled the Royal Train across Canada in 1939 (celebrity endorsement, 1930s-style). The standard Hudsons were never called Royal Hudsons.

The H1b does indeed compare with the NYC J1a: smaller drivers (75 inches vs. the J1a's 79); higher boiler pressure (275 psi vs. 225); somewhat heavier overall (369,000 lbs vs. 343,000); and slightly higher tractive effort (45,00 lbs without booster vs. 42,360 lbs for the J1a).

The August 1969 issue of Trains had a very comprehensive article on the CPR Hudsons, well worth reading if you can get hold of it.

[CP5415]

Thanks Mike!

I knew only the 2850 -> 2860 Hudson's were Royal's

Gordon

[Anonymous]

Higssy -

If you are in the Montreal - Toronto corridor, #2816 leaves Montreal tomorrow (June 11) at 7am local time to go to Toronto. It will be at Smiths Falls from approximately 11:30 am to 12:30 pm before contiuing to Toronto.

Andrew

[CP5415]

She's due in Toronto yard by 6pm.

Gordon

[Anonymous]

She's also due to stop in Port Hope at 4 pm. We're heading down there to take some pictures. Also going for a ride on the GO train coaches pulled by 2816 on June 12th from Union Station to Milton. Can't wait.

[CP5415]

Ok, ok!
I had the best view of 2816 today. In Toronto Yard.
Through a friend at work, who has a relative who works for CPR, I was able to greet 2816 as she strolled into the yard as she completed her trip from Montreal today.
I must say, a live steam locomotive without the crowds is an amazing sight & sound.
WOW!
I have pictures & some video of her being posted in my yahoo chat site.

Gordon

[Anonymous]

The reason they are called Royal Hudsons is because the British royal family granted CPR permission for the locomotives to carry a large embossed royal seal/crest on the side of their frames (running plates i think they are called???). Otherwise any other class of the CPR H1 series is "just" a Hudson.