Degrees for inclines?

[Anonymous]

What are rules of thumb for how much incline an HO layout can handle? I suppose it has something to do with the weight/power of the engine, but are there any general rules that can handle a 'typical' engine?

Sorry if this is a pretty basic question, but I am just getting back into model railroading after about a 15 year layoff (dog died, kids graduated).

[Anonymous]

What are rules of thumb for how much incline an HO layout can handle? I suppose it has something to do with the weight/power of the engine, but are there any general rules that can handle a 'typical' engine?

Sorry if this is a pretty basic question, but I am just getting back into model railroading after about a 15 year layoff (dog died, kids graduated).

[Anonymous]

Depends on length of consist, helper locos, wheel friction, loco weight and traction. A small layout with short trains tolerates grades better. Grade percent (rather than degrees of incline) is the term usually used - 1% means 1 unit rise for every 100 units travelled horizontally, so a 100% grade is a 45 degree incline.

Rules of thumb are 4% absolute max, although have gotten away with 5% when only a loco and maybe 1-2 cars is run, such as on a short reversing track. Some locos will not even get themselves alone up 5.5% without traction tires. 3% is better and usually works for 10-12 car consists. 2% even better if you have the space. If your dream and space is 100 car consists, stick with 0% or maybe 1% at the most.

[Anonymous]

Depends on length of consist, helper locos, wheel friction, loco weight and traction. A small layout with short trains tolerates grades better. Grade percent (rather than degrees of incline) is the term usually used - 1% means 1 unit rise for every 100 units travelled horizontally, so a 100% grade is a 45 degree incline.

Rules of thumb are 4% absolute max, although have gotten away with 5% when only a loco and maybe 1-2 cars is run, such as on a short reversing track. Some locos will not even get themselves alone up 5.5% without traction tires. 3% is better and usually works for 10-12 car consists. 2% even better if you have the space. If your dream and space is 100 car consists, stick with 0% or maybe 1% at the most.

[Anonymous]

Thanks. So if I wanted to raise 4 inches on a 3% grade, I'd need 133 inches of lateral space to clear the 4 inches?

[Anonymous]

Thanks. So if I wanted to raise 4 inches on a 3% grade, I'd need 133 inches of lateral space to clear the 4 inches?

[Anonymous]

133 is correct, but before you do it make a trial track and make sure your locos can do it. Also watch curves as they increase rolling resistance and can cause the center of long trains to derail to the inside. You are warned to avoid curves near or in grades, esp 3% ones.

[Anonymous]

133 is correct, but before you do it make a trial track and make sure your locos can do it. Also watch curves as they increase rolling resistance and can cause the center of long trains to derail to the inside. You are warned to avoid curves near or in grades, esp 3% ones.

[Anonymous]

Correct me if I'm way off, but grades in model railroading translate roughly to the following:
1% = 1/8 inch rise per foot
2% = 1/4 inch rise per foot
3% = 4/15 inch rise per foot
4% = 1/2 inch rise per foot

[Anonymous]

Correct me if I'm way off, but grades in model railroading translate roughly to the following:
1% = 1/8 inch rise per foot
2% = 1/4 inch rise per foot
3% = 4/15 inch rise per foot
4% = 1/2 inch rise per foot

[Anonymous]

ok this is weird.......a mate and i did this, we had no idea on what we were doing lol. he has two trains with 6 cars. the hill we built was actually an 8% grade and the trains would go up it no prob. the incline was about 3ft. plus we did a "nuts and bolts" test with all 6 cars loaded to the hilt. it made it up too lol..... :), and for those who don't believe me i got it all on camera too so if anyone wants to see it leave a msg.
now we know the correct way to do it....the board is getting redone lol :)

[Anonymous]

ok this is weird.......a mate and i did this, we had no idea on what we were doing lol. he has two trains with 6 cars. the hill we built was actually an 8% grade and the trains would go up it no prob. the incline was about 3ft. plus we did a "nuts and bolts" test with all 6 cars loaded to the hilt. it made it up too lol..... :), and for those who don't believe me i got it all on camera too so if anyone wants to see it leave a msg.
now we know the correct way to do it....the board is getting redone lol :)

[Anonymous]

to jamerson001

i believe you, i have locos that will do 12% with 3 cars.

the danger is someday you will buy a new loco that cannot do it. By sticking to the rules of thumb most every future loco will handle the pike.

Of course, if you want secondary track passable only by certain stock, go for it! But best stay on the side of caution for mainlines.

[Anonymous]

to jamerson001

i believe you, i have locos that will do 12% with 3 cars.

the danger is someday you will buy a new loco that cannot do it. By sticking to the rules of thumb most every future loco will handle the pike.

Of course, if you want secondary track passable only by certain stock, go for it! But best stay on the side of caution for mainlines.

[Anonymous]

The 2% rule was a guideline the NMRA recomended to allow old low powered 1950's and 60's technology locos to run. It was also prototypical as most real roads used less than 2%. But we compress distance all the time, so why not grade? If I had a finished layout with an 8% grade and it worked for the trains I used there is no way I would let the gospel as posted here make me change it. Today's locos have tons more tractive power, why not use it if you want? Only thing about 8% i want to know is how did you transition it and were you using kadee couples? I have trouble with kadee's coming uncoupled on little humps in the track less than 1/16 of an inch high from a misaligned module or keeping over 40 cars coupled on less than 1/2 % grades?

[Anonymous]

The 2% rule was a guideline the NMRA recomended to allow old low powered 1950's and 60's technology locos to run. It was also prototypical as most real roads used less than 2%. But we compress distance all the time, so why not grade? If I had a finished layout with an 8% grade and it worked for the trains I used there is no way I would let the gospel as posted here make me change it. Today's locos have tons more tractive power, why not use it if you want? Only thing about 8% i want to know is how did you transition it and were you using kadee couples? I have trouble with kadee's coming uncoupled on little humps in the track less than 1/16 of an inch high from a misaligned module or keeping over 40 cars coupled on less than 1/2 % grades?

[Anonymous]

hi flee307 :)
umm...this is a lil hard for me to answer since i am new to this. im on a 6x4 sheet of ply so im pretty restricted by space and really i don't see any prob with going over 3%, my trains can handle it :). my mate uses bachmann trains and he has the kadee couplers. he had a lil trouble with my track cause i had turnouts near the start of the hill. we put little pieces of wood under the start of it to make the raise not so steep. im now getting a 6x4 piece of foam 40mm think so i can brink down the top of my hill to about 50mm then with the lower track i can carve about 10mm out of th foam, so its all good now :) *thinks he can do alot with a 6x4 lol

[Anonymous]

hi flee307 :)
umm...this is a lil hard for me to answer since i am new to this. im on a 6x4 sheet of ply so im pretty restricted by space and really i don't see any prob with going over 3%, my trains can handle it :). my mate uses bachmann trains and he has the kadee couplers. he had a lil trouble with my track cause i had turnouts near the start of the hill. we put little pieces of wood under the start of it to make the raise not so steep. im now getting a 6x4 piece of foam 40mm think so i can brink down the top of my hill to about 50mm then with the lower track i can carve about 10mm out of th foam, so its all good now :) *thinks he can do alot with a 6x4 lol

[Anonymous]

flee307, we use about 10 cars that use nuckle couplers then the locos have kaydee, one of my locos has lifelike couplers ;-), like i said most of the trouble was over the points but we have worked that out and now it goes around full speed with no probs, it did full speed for about 2 hrs the other night with no probs, up and down the hills and and on the flat track if you want i can send you my track, ive almost finalised them

[Anonymous]

flee307, we use about 10 cars that use nuckle couplers then the locos have kaydee, one of my locos has lifelike couplers ;-), like i said most of the trouble was over the points but we have worked that out and now it goes around full speed with no probs, it did full speed for about 2 hrs the other night with no probs, up and down the hills and and on the flat track if you want i can send you my track, ive almost finalised them