Working "jill poke" ?

[jrbarney]

Loggers,
Were "jill pokes" ever used on logging railroads in eastern coastal states/provinces ? And, has anyone built a successful animated "jill poke", possibly using a choke control or switch machine/bell crank combination ? I've already used the Index of Magazines at this site but didn't get any hits using the term "jill poke", so any citations would be helpful. Thanks.
Bob

[jrbarney]

Loggers,
Were "jill pokes" ever used on logging railroads in eastern coastal states/provinces ? And, has anyone built a successful animated "jill poke", possibly using a choke control or switch machine/bell crank combination ? I've already used the Index of Magazines at this site but didn't get any hits using the term "jill poke", so any citations would be helpful. Thanks.
Bob

[Anonymous]

Uhh - from the "Glossary of Logging, Forest Engineering and Associated Forestry Terms" at http://web.cocc.edu/logging/dk.html#J

"Jill-poke-A supported straight log, pole, sapling, or bar that strikes an object at an angle, either penetrating the object or pushing it a side. Cat skinners and skidder operators must be especially careful of jill-pokes while skidding. ROPS and FOPS are designed to protect the operator from jill-pokes, among other hazards."

If I read this right, it's kinda like a stick-in-the-mud on steroids.

[Anonymous]

Uhh - from the "Glossary of Logging, Forest Engineering and Associated Forestry Terms" at http://web.cocc.edu/logging/dk.html#J

"Jill-poke-A supported straight log, pole, sapling, or bar that strikes an object at an angle, either penetrating the object or pushing it a side. Cat skinners and skidder operators must be especially careful of jill-pokes while skidding. ROPS and FOPS are designed to protect the operator from jill-pokes, among other hazards."

If I read this right, it's kinda like a stick-in-the-mud on steroids.

[jrbarney]

Bill,
Um - thanks for the definition. It also is or was a model kit offered by Keystone Locomotive Works that basically is a pivoted pry bar on steroids placed next tracks near a log pond and used to dump logs into the pond. The kit has a string and weight used for actuating from the edge of your layout. I believe in the K.I.S.S. principle, but was looking for a little more finesse. Also, the instructions give no insight as to the locales where it was used or the time frame.
Bob

[jrbarney]

Bill,
Um - thanks for the definition. It also is or was a model kit offered by Keystone Locomotive Works that basically is a pivoted pry bar on steroids placed next tracks near a log pond and used to dump logs into the pond. The kit has a string and weight used for actuating from the edge of your layout. I believe in the K.I.S.S. principle, but was looking for a little more finesse. Also, the instructions give no insight as to the locales where it was used or the time frame.
Bob

[Anonymous]

Hi Bob,
I posed your question to the 4L logging group on Yahoo, and the three replies I got were that jill pokes were not a prominent feature on the east coast. However, pictures and information on all logging operations don't exist, so it could have been. When modeling logging operations, almost anything goes. The men made use of what they had, often in ingenius ways. So, the final word would be, if your crew wants a jill poke, and can build a jill poke, you should have one on your layout. There is a prototype for anything.
Rick [:)]

[Anonymous]

Hi Bob,
I posed your question to the 4L logging group on Yahoo, and the three replies I got were that jill pokes were not a prominent feature on the east coast. However, pictures and information on all logging operations don't exist, so it could have been. When modeling logging operations, almost anything goes. The men made use of what they had, often in ingenius ways. So, the final word would be, if your crew wants a jill poke, and can build a jill poke, you should have one on your layout. There is a prototype for anything.
Rick [:)]

[jrbarney]

Hi Rick,
Many thanks for the posting to the Yahoo 4L group and the consolidation of their answers. Think I will use the choke rod approach and super elevate the track as shown in the instructions. That may take a little fine tuning to make sure the logs don't roll off the cars before they are given a push. It's another bit of detail to make things interesting. How many other people get to add "jill poke" to their vocabulary without someone assuming it is a pejorative term ?
Bob

[jrbarney]

Hi Rick,
Many thanks for the posting to the Yahoo 4L group and the consolidation of their answers. Think I will use the choke rod approach and super elevate the track as shown in the instructions. That may take a little fine tuning to make sure the logs don't roll off the cars before they are given a push. It's another bit of detail to make things interesting. How many other people get to add "jill poke" to their vocabulary without someone assuming it is a pejorative term ?
Bob

[Anonymous]

Bob,
More info came forward from one of the group that has written books and researched logging in all states. Here is what he had to say:

"Much of the Eastern logging involved smaller logs and often used dry yarding areas for the logs and jill pokes might have been unecessary. In all my research I found no photos of jill pokes used anywhere except the West, and even there they were only on some, but not all of the sawmill operations."

This was mainly due to safety concerns, as the western mills dealt with 6ft and more diameter logs, and the jill poke was a more controlled way of off loading without endangering workers.

I'll advise if further info is available. By the way, on my new logging module, I am using an angled beam across the tracks.

Rick

[Anonymous]

Bob,
More info came forward from one of the group that has written books and researched logging in all states. Here is what he had to say:

"Much of the Eastern logging involved smaller logs and often used dry yarding areas for the logs and jill pokes might have been unecessary. In all my research I found no photos of jill pokes used anywhere except the West, and even there they were only on some, but not all of the sawmill operations."

This was mainly due to safety concerns, as the western mills dealt with 6ft and more diameter logs, and the jill poke was a more controlled way of off loading without endangering workers.

I'll advise if further info is available. By the way, on my new logging module, I am using an angled beam across the tracks.

Rick

[jrbarney]

Rick,
Thanks for all the help. Please give your author friend my sincere thanks. Perhaps I'll still use it and, as a "cover" story, just assume that it was never photographed or documented. I have seen photos of the angled beam you plan to use on your new module. Guess that beam could be a jill poke for someone not paying attention to what's happening.
Bob

[jrbarney]

Rick,
Thanks for all the help. Please give your author friend my sincere thanks. Perhaps I'll still use it and, as a "cover" story, just assume that it was never photographed or documented. I have seen photos of the angled beam you plan to use on your new module. Guess that beam could be a jill poke for someone not paying attention to what's happening.
Bob