DCC vs. DC

[Anonymous]

Hey Guys.
I'm building my first layout that I designed. In the future I'd like to build something bigger than the 4x8 I'm building currently. Right now I'm faced with the choice of buying a basic DC pack or buying a entry level DCC system (MRC Prodigy or Digitrax Zephyr). I like the MRC's handheld walk around, but I was wondering if it had as many expansion options and features as the Digitrax. I am also curious about what you can do with hooking up a computer to operate your layout.
Thanks for any info,
mtb2005

[kenkal]

Check out NCE's new Power Cab due out at the end of September. It is a complete DCC system with a current capacity of 1.2 Amps. It is a starter system that will allow 2 or 3 HO size trains or 3 or 4 N scale sized trains.

It will have all the capabilities of the Pro-Cab (programming, momentum, recall, etc)with the only limitation of the Amperage. A Smart Boster will be available in October to increase the Power Cab's Amperage output by another 3 Amps if you need it and don't want to go the full system route.

If you upgrade later to a full system, you can use the throttle with no changes required on that system as a Pro-Cab.

You can use the unit now or after an upgrade to program decoders at your workbench rather than being tied to the layout programming track!

A radio option is supposedly going to be available.

The system is listed for $179. Tony's is like $40 less. About the cost of a hand held DCC Pro-Cab throttle!

Ken

[SpaceMouse]

I'm new to this game and built my first layout about 5 months ago. I got a decent DC unit and switched to DCC about a month ago. What can I say, it is just plain more fun to wok with. You have sound, multiple trains that you control, (as opposed to controlling the track) You can optimize your loco's performance. You can adjusts engines in MUs to pull at the same speed. It is just plain a superior system. for what its worth, I got the Zephyr.

[howmus]

While I am personally using a Digitrax System, I would answer that most of the DCC systems out there are good. Do a lot of reading about each system you might be interested in and make the choice based on which system will fit your needs best. I would look at items such as initial cost, upgradability, your comfort with the throttle, ease of programing as well as what are your friends using and why. No particular system is always the best for every hobbyist. I know you will find that DCC is fantastic. Sooooo much better than DC ever was. Have fun!

[selector]

As of today, the word is that only the Zephyr is capable of interfacing with your PC...in starter sets. As stated above , that will change due to market demand. More companies are jumping into the manufacture of decoders and sound decoders, and they are permitting the use of computers.

So, you will have to figure out your requirements based on the nth degree of future usage (how many sound-equipped locos are you going to run at one time? Be liberal with your estimate; if you go short, you will have to buy more boosters to run the extra locos). Then do the research. Hint- newest/cheapest/most intiutive to run is not always the best.

[knewsom]

All of the starter sets are good. I based my decision on the throttle that I liked the best. For me it was the Prodigy Advance. If you are worried about expandibility in things such as programming via PC and infrared or radio control, I would not go with the Prodigy Advance though. The NCE Power Cab and the Zephyr would be a better option. For the Zephyr you will need to get a Locobuffer II ($65), Locobuffer, or MS100 to connect to your PC. NCE announced that they will eventually have a USB connector for the PowerCab but no price is mentioned.

[MisterBeasley]

And I'm very happy with my Lenz 100. The good news is, they are all pretty good. There are different features with each. The basic rule to remember is that the decoders that go in the engines and can run switch machines and turntables are all compatable with any DCC system. The controllers and base units are generally NOT compatable between manufacturers.

And, as Spacemouse pointed out, they are really a lot more fun. I can't imagine going back to DC, and I've only been running DCC for a month. Since you're building a new layout, going to DCC now would allow you to eliminate all the tedious block wiring that you need with DC. If you choose to go to DCC control for your turnouts, that's another wiring simplification (although it's a significant cost if you have a lot of turnouts.)

So, my advice is go for it, sooner rather than later. Check out the hand-helds, and see which ones you like best, because that's what you'll be dealing with the most. But one warning - expect a slowdown on layout construction. It's just so much fun to run trains that you won't have time for anything else.

[BRVRR]

mtb2005,
Since you are just starting a new layout, go DCC. Easier wiring and more versatile operation. As will be obvious from the remainder of this post I have a Digitrax Zephyr and I am very happy with it. One thing unique to the Zephyr is the 'jump ports. Just attach a 'train set' power pack and you have another independent throttle. I generally run from 2-3 trains at a time on the BRVRR. Two sound equipped steamers and an A-B-A set of F7s. Only one with sound but all powered. Occasionally I will run a fourth short train with a GP-20 or another F7. No sound in the loco, but I have a diesel sound decoder mounted under the table that I MU with the non-sound equipped diesels. I have never had a power problem. I did add a DT-400 throttle to give my throttles portability. Not really a big issue with a 4x10' layout, but convenient.
Here is, I think, the best advice I was given when shopping for a DCC system. Check them all out, see what modelers in your area use and then choose the one that meets your needs and desires.
Incidentally, there are pictures of my system on my website. Once on site pu***he Layout Button. Link is in my signature.
Good luck!

[Anonymous]

First of all, [#welcome] mtb2005!

I agree with knewsome about the Prodigy Advance throttle. I went with the PA system for that very reason, not to mention the number of desirable features for a reasonable price. I like the throttle, the 128 speed step capability, the four digit addressing capability, 20 (!) functions (even though you can only really use 12 of them, due to industry standards), the programming capability, the routing ability, fast time clock, etc. My biggest complaint with the unit is that it is advertised as a 3.5A unit, when in reality it comes as a 2.5A unit that will support a 3.5A power supply if purchased seperately.

Almost all of the starter sets available are a good value, so my advice would be to decide what features you (a) need, (b) want or (c) don't want or need. Get the system that best meets your needs that is within your budget.

If you know approximately how many trains (locomotives) you will be running, you can determine the current rating you will need. A general rule of thumb is .5A per locomotive for N scale, .75A per locomotive for HO. This can vary greatly depending upon the types of locomotives you are running (e.g. old Athearn HO units consume considerably more current than the newer ones).

When you choose your DCC system, get one that has all the features you need, meets your current requirements and has the most of the features that you want for a price you can afford. (Did that make sense?)

I hope all the info from this thread is helpful to you in making your decision. I know this forum was useful to me when I made my choice. Most of all, have fun.

[Anonymous]

I would go DCC and get your feet wet. As far as money goes, if you look around you can find some great deals. I purchased a Lenz 100 set new with warranty from a dealer on ebay for $215. With the optional $15 5amp supply I am able to run about whatever I want, or as many as I can keep straight. I think you would be money ahead to buy a "good" system from the get. The starter systems are usually just that. When you consider what you have paid for the starter system that money would go a long way on a pro set up.

[Anonymous]

I'm brand new to DCC, and back into model railroading after more than twenty years. I got the Zephyr, and love every minute of it. I think compared to NCE's starter set, the Zephyr is the only one of those two that has the ability for a computer interface, if you ever think of running your layout with software. Don't rule it out. I didn't think i'd ever want a computer running my layout, but after more and more reading, I decided to buy a set that had that ability. Besides, it sounds like the Zephyr is less expensive than NCE. I got mine for 149. It also sounds to me like the Zephyr can do more. It'll do more than I'll ever need it to.

QUOTE: Originally posted by mtb2005

Hey Guys.
I'm building my first layout that I designed. In the future I'd like to build something bigger than the 4x8 I'm building currently. Right now I'm faced with the choice of buying a basic DC pack or buying a entry level DCC system (MRC Prodigy or Digitrax Zephyr). I like the MRC's handheld walk around, but I was wondering if it had as many expansion options and features as the Digitrax. I am also curious about what you can do with hooking up a computer to operate your layout.
Thanks for any info,
mtb2005

[Anonymous]

I also have a Zephyr, and the computer interface is one reason I liked it. Not for running the track with the computer, but for using DecoderPro to program decoders with the computer -- much, much easier than trying to do it through the keypad of the Zephyr or one of the other Digitrax throttles.

The lack of a hand-held throttle isn't much of a big deal, especially if you use eBay. I picked up a slightly used DT-300 throttle for around $35 on eBay (a club was selling a bunch off), and it works fine with the Zephyr. The new UT4 is pretty decent, too, and can be had for around $65 from Tony's Trains and others.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for all the info. I'll be thinking about DCC more now.
mtb2005

[Anonymous]

I have used DC, and I wish for DCC. The only thing is, is that it is a very large investment, considering the fact that you have to buy the DCC controls, and then also the DCC decoders for each engine. Do you guys think that is worth the money for DCC, or it is a luxury that is very nice, but you could live with out it?

That, I think, is the real desicision between DC and DCC.

[ClinchValleySD40]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Saturn6

I have used DC, and I wish for DCC. The only thing is, is that it is a very large investment, considering the fact that you have to buy the DCC controls, and then also the DCC decoders for each engine. Do you guys think that is worth the money for DCC, or it is a luxury that is very nice, but you could live with out it?

That, I think, is the real desicision between DC and DCC.

It's worth every penny. Best investment in model railroading I've ever made.

[Anonymous]

Y ou say you are planning another layout, so I assume you are in the hobby to stay. This being the case I would highly recommend DCC. It is the best thing to happen in the hobby in the last 35 years in my opinion.

[Anonymous]

Agreed; my first layout a decade ago was all DC, but when I decided to tear it down and build a new one about a year ago, the decision to go with DCC was a no-brainer. Sure, it's a bit more of an investment, but there's no law that says you have to convert all your existing locos all at once. Just do one or two at a time (though many places, like Tony's Train Exchange, give you bulk discounts on 4 or more decoders bought at once), and eventually you'll have them all done. And you don't have to get the top-of-the-line Digitrax decoders either; NCE and TCS both make very good decoders that are about 2/3 the price of the Digitrax, especially for older locos. About the only Digitrax decoder I buy these days is the one for the P2K locos (the DH163LO), and that's because it's the only drop-in decoder for them that doesn't require extra resistors to run the lights.

[Anonymous]

Can you convert older locos to DCC or do you have to have a socket? My dad has some working locos I want to possibly use that he bought when he was a kid.

[Anonymous]

Most older engines will require some soldering to install a decoder, but they are not hard to install. Make sure the motor brushes are isolated from the frame. the decoder installs between the wheel pickups and the motor. The wires are color coded-
Black-left rail pickup
Red-right rail pickup
Gray-negative side motor brush
Orange- positive side motor brush
Even this is hard to mess up because if the loco doesn't run the direction you like for forward, you can change the direction in the programming.

[Anonymous]

If they run decent as DC, they will run great as DCC. The DCC decoders have programming to make the motors run better and quieter. It's like some say though, if it don't run too good now, it may not be worth the trouble. The way I see it, since you can get a decoder sometimes under ten bucks, why not try it and see?

QUOTE: Originally posted by mtb2005

Can you convert older locos to DCC or do you have to have a socket? My dad has some working locos I want to possibly use that he bought when he was a kid.