Hi everyone!
I am building a new kit. Easy on the building side but requiring a lot of patience and precision on the painting.
Now I am on the decal side. This kit comprise dry decals. First time I use them since I was a little boy. I would like to know if I can use Micro-Sol on top of my dry decals or if Micro-Sol is only to be used when using wet decals (or any other name I don't know).
Thanks for your help!
Stef
Hi Stef,
I can't answer your question based on personal experience, but I think that the answer is 'No'. I believe that dry transfer 'decals' are made using wax (I could be totally wrong!). If that is the case, decal softening solutions are unlikely to have any effect.
My suggestion would be to use a finer tool tip to push the transfer into the grooves on the siding. A very slightly dull pencil might do the job. Of course you will still have to keep the transfer backing paper in place over the decal.
If you have any spare dry transfers and siding, you could experiment to see if the decal solutions have any effect, but again, I doubt that they will.
Cheers!!
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
A waterslide decal needs water to remove it from its backing paper. Once it loosens from its backing paper, you can slide it into place on your model. If necessary, add a little water (finger tips are good for this) so that it can be moved into the exact place where you want it.
Unless the decal is really old and fragile, you should be able to re-wet it numerous times if it needs to be re-aligned or if you decide to move it to another location altogether. Once you add even a mild setting solution, you'll likely have little success trying to move it again.
I've never heard of dry decals, unless you're referring to dry transfers. I'm a longtime user of dry transfers, but their quality can vary widely and their "shelf-life" can be very short if stored improperly. Unlike decals, once you rub a dry transfer in place, it will be impossible to move it intact. If you need to remove it, some masking tape usually works quite well.
I usually use a cut-to-suit length of masking tape to ensure that words composed of individual letters are as straight as possible and properly spaced - for the latter, look-up "kerning".Another option is to apply the dry transfer to a piece of clear decal paper. After the lettering is in place, use the backing paper that came with the dry transfer to "burnish" it in place, in the same manner you would use if applying it directly to a structure. You can then apply it as you would an ordinary decal, soaking it in water.
If you put dry transfer lettering or pictures on a model, once you've burnished it in place, you can use decal setting solution to further adhere it to the surface.
This car, and many more like it, was lettered using dry transfer sets with the lettering already done by the manufacturer....
...while this one, and probably 70 or 80 more, was done with dry transfer alphabet sets...letter-by letter...
If you're planning to use a setting solution for a decal, the best place to apply it is at the edges of the decal - this allows the setting solution to get between the item and the decal, eliminating the air that's often trapped there, creating a visible "blush". This will often negate the need to pin-*** or slice the decal to get rid of that silvering effect.
Subsequent applications can then be made to really "settle" the decal into place.
hon30critter I believe that dry transfer 'decals' are made using wax (I could be totally wrong!). If that is the case, decal softening solutions are unlikely to have any effect.
As I mentioned above, decal setting solution, especially Solvaset, does a very nice job of settling dry transfers over irregularities, such as rivets and joints in panels.
I've lettered literally hundreds of freight cars, passenger cars, and locomotives structures too, using dry transfers...
Wayne
Stef,
I suggest you try it out yourself. You certainly have some of these that you aren't planning on using (I do apologize if you were planning on using ALL of yours--it's just that usually there's plenty of "leftovers"). Press them on and add various decal solvents.
I tend to believe that they won't interact, as do apparently the others who have commented.
Let us know your results. I am certainly interested.
Ed
Thanks everyone for your help and tips.
doctorwayne I've never heard of dry decals, unless you're referring to dry transfers. Wayne
I've never heard of dry decals, unless you're referring to dry transfers.
Yes exactly, I checked on the instructions and they call them dry transfer decals.
I find them a lot easier to apply than the wet decals (what's their name)?
ModelTrainI find them a lot easier to apply than the wet decals (what's their name)?
Most other hobbiests call them "water slide decals", but among Model Railroaders, we just call them "decals" as a default term.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
I grew up with model cars, and so became familiar early with what we called DEE-cals. In those bygone days, these were always waterslide, with backside adhesive on soakable paper. Occasionally you'd get one printed in reverse, to be applied to the backside of a clear piece like reverse painting on glass, but it went on the same way.
My first experience with dry-transfer products was Letraset lettering for print production. These were symbols printed on the back side of a plastic sheet, with the exposed side made adhesive when pressure was applied: you carefully burnished the front of the sheet, taking care not to deform the plastic, and the printed symbol would detach from the plastic and -- for a while, anyway -- stick where positioned. I didn't consider these, or the early version of dry-transfer lettering that is applied the same way, to be "decals".
I now see that the OED definition of 'decalcomania' involves the basic idea of an image designed to be easily transferred to a surface -- waterslide having adhesive on the back side; transfers on their front side. I can accept that as a working definition, but I still consider 'decals' to be waterslide, and just call 'dry transfers' dry transfers.
I don't know offhand of a product that 'snuggles' dry transfers against a surface once applied, as I don't know of a dry-transfer product that inherently has any kind of adhesive other than pressure-sensitive. Even if you softened the film you'd still have to burnish it down, which implies release from a face sheet if the film is thin and you don't want to tear or distort it. So I think the advice already given, which is to polish dry transfers down carefully using a face sheet of some kind, is the 'best' advice available -- the question then being whether the products applied over dry transfers ought to be different from those used on the kinds of waterslide film.
ModelTrain ...I would like to know if I can use Micro-Sol on top of my dry decals or if Micro-Sol is only to be used when using wet decals (or any other name I don't know). Thanks for your help!
...I would like to know if I can use Micro-Sol on top of my dry decals or if Micro-Sol is only to be used when using wet decals (or any other name I don't know).
I can't say if Micro-Sol will work on dry transfers, as I've never used it. I do know that Solvaset will work on dry transfers, but you should do the burnishing step first, if possible.
The photo below is of a custom-made dry transfer (probably around 10 years old, which explains why some of it didn't transfer) applied to a mill file. I didn't bother burnishing it, as it's purpose is to show the effects of Solvaset. As you can see, there gaps under some areas...
Here's the lettering after a couple applications of Solvaset...
I'm trying to recall on what I first tried this, as it would have been when the dry transfers were new and easy to apply. It's not something that's usually required, but it did solve an issue that couldn't be addressed by burnishing, which works on details in relief, such as rivets. The Solvaset worked for a detail in counter-relief...in other words, a depressed detail.
Looking at Wayne's most excellent photos, it appears to me that applying Solvaset degraded the decal. I cannot see anywhere where applying it improved things.
Maybe a different solvent would produce different results.
As I said earlier, the OP should do these experiments, and report back.
I am surprised that the Solvaset had any effect.
But that's what experiments are about.
I grew up building model airplanes, and they also had wet transfer stickers. They were sometimes tricky if I let them stay in the water too long. Those early experiences provided many lessons learned:
- use a flat container for the decals
- keep close track of how long the stickers stay in the water
- use a paper towel or rag to dry the stickers once applied
For dry transfer stickers, I use white glue. That is very forgiving. The decal background doesn't bother me when on the structure b/c it has a clean look.
Sometimes you can bring old dry transfers back to life if you microwave the sheet first. I prefer the dry transfers as they are easier to get profesional results if you know what you are doing with them, number one is being carefull to get the full transfer done before trying to remove the carrier sheet.
It is not often that I use dry transfers, but this works for me.
I use a stiff rubber tipped clay shaper like this one to rub the dry transfers onto a model.
The top end is good for transferring, then the other end can be used on the transfer, pushing it straight down, to conform the transfer to the surface.
If you're bored with nothing to do, try doing a railroad name on the side of an "outside braced" boxcar with a dry transfer alphabet set.
Like "PENNSYLVANIA".
7j43k If you're bored with nothing to do, try doing a railroad name on the side of an "outside braced" boxcar with a dry transfer alphabet set. Like "PENNSYLVANIA". Ed
On cars like these, once the dry transfers were burnished in place, Solvaset could be applied and left to dry overnight...
...the next day, using a new #11 blade in my X-Acto, I slit the dry transfer lettering wherever it spanned a space between the "boards", then added more Solvaset, again leaving it to dry.Not all of the slit lettering conformed into the gaps between the boards, but the process could be repeated, until most areas did.Once that process was finished, the cars got an airbrushed overspray of clear flat finish, then some airbrush-applied weathering.
If you run a sharp blade through dry transfers that have been properly burnished, there's still a very good chance that the blade will drag some portion of the lettering along, whereas the Sovaset draws the transfer into the grooves, and once dry, there's much less chance of that occurring.