LastspikemikeCombined with the other controversial area of double decking a layout the difficulty with dedicated staging becomes more clear for me. The idea of hidden tracks doesn't make any sense.
There is nothing controversial about staging. People build the layout that will make them happy.
ATLANTIC CENTRALEverybody has different goals for this hobby.
That is it in a nutshell. If your goal requires staging, and you have limited room, a helix could be the soultion.
This world doesn't move to the beat of just one drum. What might be right for you might not be right for some.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
Lastspikemike...Ideal height for staging is a lot lower than ideal height for viewing. Putting staging at viewing height just uses up very valuable scenicked layout space. Why do that to yourself?...
As has been mentioned several times, staging is "elsewhere" and its purpose is to be the "elsewhere " from-which, or to-which trains come or go.While I can run part of my layout as a continuous loop around the room for the entertainment of visitors, it's been built as a point-to-point operation, with five origin/destination points. To model those points with structures and scenery defeats their purpose, as I want easy access to manually move rolling stock on or off the layout.Locomotives stay on the layout unless they require service, and I have three areas on-layout where they can be turned, as needed, so no need to handle them manually. As for viewing height, it's whatever height I might choose for viewing, whether on my knees or on a rolling office chair here...
...or standing on the floor or on a step-stool here...
...or here...
Even my youngest grandchild, at 5, knows that staging is where the trains originate and terminate, and everywhere else is where it's fun to watch them running.
Wayne
Yep. My railroad for my enjoyment. My staging is hidden at mainline height on some adjacent shelving. I have eight lanes of assembled trains to run through my layout. Various passenger trains and I like the look of unit trains like tanker cars, containers, auto haulers etc. There are no auto plants, big passenger stations, mines or other space eaters on the layout. Just smaller stations and industry. I enjoy the trains running through the scenery on their way to someplace else. I can change eras just by swapping out automobiles on the layout as all the buildings are pretty cross generational. A true tourist railroad. I can provide a little different look everytime visitors come by.
One good reason to have staging either out of sight or at least physically somewhat apart from the main part of the layout (not necessarily at a separate level by the way) is to allow the staging yard yardmaster to get his work done in a timely way so operators don't get bored. Otherwise staging yards tend to be like the kitchen at Thanksgiving - for some reason everyone seems to gather where the busiest person is and that interferes with the cook.
Another reason is that the staging yard, since it is not a "model" of anything is typically not scenicked, track is not ballasted, switch motors might be top mounted. Track might be Code 100 when the rest of the layout is Code 70 or 83. It is purely functional, or can be.
Third reason is that a trusted staging yard yardmaster might be permitted to touch the trains but the rest of the operators may be instructed never to do that. Easier to maintain that discipline (in this era of expensive freight cars) when the lonely exception to the rule is out of sight/out of mind.
Dave Nelson
dknelson . . . be like the kitchen at Thanksgiving - for some reason everyone seems to gather where the busiest person is and that interferes with the cook.
. . . be like the kitchen at Thanksgiving - for some reason everyone seems to gather where the busiest person is and that interferes with the cook.
Well . . . yeah. It's a lot easier to badger and harass the cook to get "a little teeny slice of nut bread and a cup of coffee to hold me over until dinner is ready" if you're actually in the kitchen.
Otherwise Dave, all of your other advice and observations are exactly spot on.
Robert
LINK to SNSR Blog
dknelson One good reason to have staging either out of sight or at least physically somewhat apart from the main part of the layout (not necessarily at a separate level by the way) is to allow the staging yard yardmaster to get his work done in a timely way so operators don't get bored. Otherwise staging yards tend to be like the kitchen at Thanksgiving - for some reason everyone seems to gather where the busiest person is and that interferes with the cook. Another reason is that the staging yard, since it is not a "model" of anything is typically not scenicked, track is not ballasted, switch motors might be top mounted. Track might be Code 100 when the rest of the layout is Code 70 or 83. It is purely functional, or can be. Third reason is that a trusted staging yard yardmaster might be permitted to touch the trains but the rest of the operators may be instructed never to do that. Easier to maintain that discipline (in this era of expensive freight cars) when the lonely exception to the rule is out of sight/out of mind. Dave Nelson
While I underestand the idea of "active" staging yards, and agree with your thoughts on the subject. Most of my operating session experiance has been on layouts without an active staging yardmaster.
I guess the operative questions are:
How big is the layout?
How many operators?
How long is an operating session?
How many trains will be "handled"
How many trains can be "pre-staged"?
Is there an active visible yard breaking up and making up trains?
With staging for thirty trains, and a fair sized visible yard working, I don't see much need for active staging on my new layout.
Sheldon
ATLANTIC CENTRALWith staging for thirty trains, and a fair sized visible yard working, I don't see much need for active staging on my new layout.
Yeah, I think that most of us who use some form of staging have their own method of using it. I'm normally the sole operator of my layout (although some of my grandkids are allowed to run trains if they're so-inclined). If I wish to service any of the staging areas, it's a matter of taking cars off the staging tracks and putting them back in their respective boxes, and then re-stocking those tracks with different cars. I don't have enough on-layout space for all my rolling stock, but this is a good way to see that everything gets used...eventually.When I'm running trains, it may take only a couple hours to reach another staging yard, and perhaps end the operating session. Other times, It might take days or even weeks of intermittent operation for the train to complete its run...sometimes other tasks are more pressing, or sometimes I need a break to work on projects that are still outstanding...either way, it's good entertainment.
doctorwayne ATLANTIC CENTRAL With staging for thirty trains, and a fair sized visible yard working, I don't see much need for active staging on my new layout. Yeah, I think that most of us who use some form of staging have their own method of using it. I'm normally the sole operator of my layout (although some of my grandkids are allowed to run trains if they're so-inclined). If I wish to service any of the staging areas, it's a matter of taking cars off the staging tracks and putting them back in their respective boxes, and then re-stocking those tracks with different cars. I don't have enough on-layout space for all my rolling stock, but this is a good way to see that everything gets used...eventually.When I'm running trains, it may take only a couple hours to reach another staging yard, and perhaps end the operating session. Other times, It might take days or even weeks of intermittent operation for the train to complete its run...sometimes other tasks are more pressing, or sometimes I need a break to work on projects that are still outstanding...either way, it's good entertainment. Wayne
ATLANTIC CENTRAL With staging for thirty trains, and a fair sized visible yard working, I don't see much need for active staging on my new layout.
Agreed, I don't see anything wrong with any form of active staging, and clearly some rolling stock comes and goes from any layout.
As stated earlier, one of my goals is to handle rolling stock and locos as little as possible.
So I plan to bring trains out to the main yard when they need to be "reworked" or "reset" for the next ops session, or for simple display running, an option specificly built into my track plan.
I considered larger more complex staging schemes, but decided that was a bad idea, really bad idea......
I worked hard to keep the layout as simple as possible for the stated goals.
dehusman If you have ever been to an actual theater, there is a "backstage". The area behind and to the sides of the stage where actors go when they are no performing, where sets and props not being used in the current scene are stored and where actors go when they exit the current scene. Its the origin of the phrase, "waiting in the wings".
I think the term/idea of "staging" originated with John Armstrong - although Frank Ellison worked much of his life in and around the theater, so I suppose it could have been him. Anyway, I know Armstrong designed a layout that he described as being like a theater stage. The scenicked part would be built along one wall of a basement, with "wings" off each side representing the rest of the railroad. Trains came from say east staging, did their work on the scenicked part of the layout, and then either returned to the east or exited to the west. Kinda like how in a Shakespeare play a character will go offstage to go to a battle, and then come back on stage later to report the result.
He didn't necessarily call it "staging" but the idea was there - he included what he referred to as hidden "layover" tracks in many designs in his book(s).
Chris van der Heide
My Algoma Central Railway Modeling Blog