So another thread from me, about I thught I had to fit a layout somewhere, while not taking up too much room, but having it all.
Has anyone made a "Stackable" layout? What I mean by this, is a layout that is mostly assembled, that could be broken down and stuck on a shelf.
I'm thinking i would have it break down into 4 parts, center sections where all the action will happen, then the outer curves. I was aiming for 8ft centers, but i think 6ft might be more managable. unless i Can figure out a way to split the 8ft ones into 4ft sections (i've attached 2 different ideas for the 8ft and 6ft)
The corner sections I want to run at least 18", so that would keep the width of those down to 4.5ft. I fiugred the curves wouldn't need too much, if any, scenery, so I could just stand those up vertically. I went with 18s in my plans, but would probably go with 22s.
6ft sections with the 18s
8ft sections
Opinions?
You wouldn't necessarily make the sections directly stackable. Our club modular is carried on rolling racks we built, depending on the sections, the racks hold up to 6 sections with space underneath the bottom one in a tray to carry associated bits. One part is a long coal yard that is made of 4 sections, that is more or less stackable - there are two end plates with casters, and the sections fit together into these end plates using the same holes that attach them to each other when set up. The whole 4 unit piece is less than 2 feet high, since it's a completely flat yard. But taller section still fit on racks that top out a little below 6 feet tall and can be rolled around, mainly this is to make it easy to get sections on and off the transport trailers, and by grouping sections that connect together, it makes setup go very fast - each group is rolled to where it will go so there is minimal handling of individual modules to build the layout.
So you could maybe so something similar, store the layout on a moveable rack that you cna push out of the way when the layout is not being used, then easily unload and connect it together. Really all you need are 4 sections, each 2x8 feet, to make an 8x12 donut layout that gives you a lot more room for broader curves - my 8x12 had 30" radius curves. With 2 more sections - that could be 8x20 feet assembled, with six sections, each 2x8. Fold up or detachable legs makes it compact, and ifyou use foam, a 2x8 section is fairly light weight, and easily moved through any ordinary door. My previous layout was removed from its third floor location in 2x8 sections, which required 2 hard turns at each staircase, and the 8 foot length was no problem. 1x4 and 1x3 construction with foam tops made it easy enough for one person to carry a section. I ended up tossing the whole thing since I had no plans to reuse that layout as built in my new house, so making it sectional was of dubious value, but the foam sheets came in 2x8 pieces anyway.
Even if you make the sections 2x6 - that would make a 6 section layout 6x16, or 10x12. 30" curves may be a bit large for the 6x16 configuration, but 24 or 26" would esily fit that, look better, and allow larger equipment to run than 18" radius curves.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
Why do you want stackability? Will you be storing the layout part of the time and set up to run at other times?
Take a look at the ntrak standards for modules (similar ones for HO) for tips on building with modules. see: http://www.ntrak.org/
David Barrow had a series of articles on "domino layouts" which were a series of modules. There are construction plans in the MR archive.
HTH a little...
greg - Philadelphia & Reading / Reading
The NORFOLK STRATTON N Scale layout I built for Scale Rails of Southwest Florida fit into a special 8 foot box that fit into the bed of a full size pickup.
A rented U-haul pickup and two guys could set this layout up in 30 minutes for any train exhibition. Boy did we put some miles on this layout.
It measured 8 foot by 13 feet when assembled.
There is no way it would store on a shelf.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
rrinker You wouldn't necessarily make the sections directly stackable. Our club modular is carried on rolling racks we built, depending on the sections, the racks hold up to 6 sections with space underneath the bottom one in a tray to carry associated bits. One part is a long coal yard that is made of 4 sections, that is more or less stackable - there are two end plates with casters, and the sections fit together into these end plates using the same holes that attach them to each other when set up. The whole 4 unit piece is less than 2 feet high, since it's a completely flat yard. But taller section still fit on racks that top out a little below 6 feet tall and can be rolled around, mainly this is to make it easy to get sections on and off the transport trailers, and by grouping sections that connect together, it makes setup go very fast - each group is rolled to where it will go so there is minimal handling of individual modules to build the layout. So you could maybe so something similar, store the layout on a moveable rack that you cna push out of the way when the layout is not being used, then easily unload and connect it together. Really all you need are 4 sections, each 2x8 feet, to make an 8x12 donut layout that gives you a lot more room for broader curves - my 8x12 had 30" radius curves. With 2 more sections - that could be 8x20 feet assembled, with six sections, each 2x8. Fold up or detachable legs makes it compact, and ifyou use foam, a 2x8 section is fairly light weight, and easily moved through any ordinary door. My previous layout was removed from its third floor location in 2x8 sections, which required 2 hard turns at each staircase, and the 8 foot length was no problem. 1x4 and 1x3 construction with foam tops made it easy enough for one person to carry a section. I ended up tossing the whole thing since I had no plans to reuse that layout as built in my new house, so making it sectional was of dubious value, but the foam sheets came in 2x8 pieces anyway. Even if you make the sections 2x6 - that would make a 6 section layout 6x16, or 10x12. 30" curves may be a bit large for the 6x16 configuration, but 24 or 26" would esily fit that, look better, and allow larger equipment to run than 18" radius curves. --Randy
I'd prefer the 8ft sections. If I could do the 4 2x8 sections, that would work for me. On a 2x8, how big would the turns be? I would probably have to get more flex track, but that would work.
I would just need to stack them or something, to put them up out of the way when not in use. It is a compromise I'm making to have a layout in the garage. It would mostly be put up in the winter when I will be parking my car inside. Or when I need to work on something
So build the 4 sections that are 2x8 from plywood (1/2"?) and 1x4 framing, and add fold down legs in each section. Then build a rolling rack/shelf thing for each section to slide into.
I would think very hard before making a section bigger than 2' by 4'. a 2' by 8' will be heavy and awkward for one person to stack and unstack. Unless you will always have a helper when you do this.
Only if you make it from 2x4's and cover it with 3/4" plywood. My extruded foam 2x8 sections were not hard to handle for one person, at least ones the legs were unbolted.
You don;t want to make is in 2x8 sections and then lay them all out in a string - you'd be left with less than 10" radius curves. The idea with 4 sections that are 2x8 is to arrange it in a square donut, either 10x10 or 8x12 depending on how you overlap the ends. At that size you cna make the end curves nearly any size - mine were 30" radius and still had some stright track between the curves on the shorter (8') side. My previous layout, also in 2x8 sections, was around the perimeter of a spare room and actually had sharper curves as I was modeling a branch line. The room was like 13x20 or something. Not every section was 2x8, some were narrower and some were shorter to fill in the gaps since the room obviously wasn;t evenly divisible into 8' sections.
rrinker Only if you make it from 2x4's and cover it with 3/4" plywood. My extruded foam 2x8 sections were not hard to handle for one person, at least ones the legs were unbolted. You don;t want to make is in 2x8 sections and then lay them all out in a string - you'd be left with less than 10" radius curves. The idea with 4 sections that are 2x8 is to arrange it in a square donut, either 10x10 or 8x12 depending on how you overlap the ends. At that size you cna make the end curves nearly any size - mine were 30" radius and still had some stright track between the curves on the shorter (8') side. My previous layout, also in 2x8 sections, was around the perimeter of a spare room and actually had sharper curves as I was modeling a branch line. The room was like 13x20 or something. Not every section was 2x8, some were narrower and some were shorter to fill in the gaps since the room obviously wasn;t evenly divisible into 8' sections. --Randy
I would go for the 8x12, as I have the center 2x8s center sections already designed. I have 22" sectional curves I could use, but I would probably want to use flex for it and use as much of the 2x8 for the curves as possible.
Would where they align up at matter? For instance instead if squaring up.the outsides, I would just align the main on the sections to the curve. That would probably make it a bit harder to align up, and need flex track for sure on the curves though, as the sections I made.up might not have the main that leads off in the same spot.
Table connections
I was thinking for power I'll use a jumper. Since it's it just one main line, I can wire it up as DC and DCC at the same time. I'll use a connector mounted inside the frame in the corners for power and just have a jumper hook in between them.
For physical connection, the C clamp is a good idea, but I was thinking nut and bolt, 2 per connection. Thay should keep it squared up
Legs
instead of installing a pair of folding legs on each 2x8, especially with using 2 bolts to hold the centers to the outers, could I get away with just legs on the outer sections? Maybe one in the middle of each center section? I'm calling the outer sections what would be the sections with the curves, the centers would be the track area I have drawn up
shelf stacking system (see attached picture)
I would make 2 of these out of 2x4s, then put 2x6s across to connect them together, one on each end and one in the middle, 2 ft in length, so it is supported on the end and in the middle. The opening would need to be 8ft of course, so where the module would sit would be 2x8. I would cover the sides and back with some cheap wood paneling, so it wouldn't slide out. I'd figure something put for the front as well so they are held in place for the most part. Id also see about getting a plastic sheet that I can roll up and down, to help keep dirt and dust off of it when stored.
If I go 18" height for each slot, plus the 4" for the base 2x8, would that be enough clearance for buildings?
My thought/inspiration with this is a pizza pan rack. My first real job was a pizza delivery driver, so I think something like that, but much wider and more supportive since the width is now 8ft, would work. I linked to a pizza pan rack there for reference to what I'm talking about.
I like what Greg posted. That looks very doable. I guess your pizza pan rack would be about the same.
Mike.
My You Tube
mbinsewi I like what Greg posted. That looks very doable. I guess your pizza pan rack would be about the same. Mike.
yea, kind of the same. I could actually make the top of the rack one of the sections as well, I think, and have the 3 other sections pull out and set up. so i would be utalizing the rack as well. Not sure how that would work out for the extra for the width needed to build it though. I could just set it on top however, and have that overhang also hold up part of the outer section.
I'm thinking though I might go 4x12, cut the 8ft sections down to 4ft. I know that cuts down the curves, but I can do 18s and 22s. I came up with a double main line idea. The 2 2x4 sections can slide into the same slot on the rack was my thought behind that.
If you have toe room, don't skimp on the width and thus the curves. There's no reason a reasonable size rack couldn;t hold 4 on their own shelves instead of 3 with a pair crammed on one shelf - there IS the top, too. The thickness of the section, roadbed and track included, would be around 6" with 2" foam totally on top, or if the foam is inset by using 1x3 crossbemembers with 1x4 side rails, only about 5 inches thick. Let's be generous and allow 8" thick, plus a 2x4 rail for each one to slide on. Total rack height, less than 4 foot is it just sits on the floor, or if you put it on wheels, slightly taller, still 5' or less.
The trick with our racks at the club are in many cases, the module is held on the rack with bolts through holes drilled in to the rack which match the holes in the module used to connect them together.
Yes, 2 bolts per connection to link them together. Anderson PowerPole connectors to plug and unplug the wires between sections. Another 'trick' on our modules - under the ends there is a hook screwed in, the wiring harness gets looped up on that when disconnected so it doesn't hang down when sliding the modules in the rack.
Another advantage of the donut shape is you cna work from the inside as well as the outside, and with 2' wide sections, never have more than a 2' reach.
If you go all out, you can make the track arrangment along the lines of the MR Beer Line, in that you could put the sections together in different ways, a donut for continuous run loops, or a more or less linear sort of thing for point to point switching, although this will usually lead to some tracks that are unconnected and unused in one configuration or the other. Spare sidings that allow end to end connections could be interchanges in the alternate setup, thus increasing the operational possibilities.
rrinker If you have toe room, don't skimp on the width and thus the curves. There's no reason a reasonable size rack couldn;t hold 4 on their own shelves instead of 3 with a pair crammed on one shelf - there IS the top, too. The thickness of the section, roadbed and track included, would be around 6" with 2" foam totally on top, or if the foam is inset by using 1x3 crossbemembers with 1x4 side rails, only about 5 inches thick. Let's be generous and allow 8" thick, plus a 2x4 rail for each one to slide on. Total rack height, less than 4 foot is it just sits on the floor, or if you put it on wheels, slightly taller, still 5' or less. The trick with our racks at the club are in many cases, the module is held on the rack with bolts through holes drilled in to the rack which match the holes in the module used to connect them together. Yes, 2 bolts per connection to link them together. Anderson PowerPole connectors to plug and unplug the wires between sections. Another 'trick' on our modules - under the ends there is a hook screwed in, the wiring harness gets looped up on that when disconnected so it doesn't hang down when sliding the modules in the rack. Another advantage of the donut shape is you cna work from the inside as well as the outside, and with 2' wide sections, never have more than a 2' reach. If you go all out, you can make the track arrangment along the lines of the MR Beer Line, in that you could put the sections together in different ways, a donut for continuous run loops, or a more or less linear sort of thing for point to point switching, although this will usually lead to some tracks that are unconnected and unused in one configuration or the other. Spare sidings that allow end to end connections could be interchanges in the alternate setup, thus increasing the operational possibilities. --Randy
I think for the ease of building, 4 2x8 sections is what I'll do. I can also ad an industry on the 8ft side. I'll still use 18 and 22" radius curves so I have the extra length on those 8ft sections.
I would like to be able to leave my buildings and scenery up. What would be a good gap to have for them?
I figured I would use 1x3s with 1/2" plywood, that gives a 3" tall wood section. kind of like the base wood with cork roadbed feel, as that is what my grandma did and would bring me back to that nostalgic time. Paint it brown or green and maybe use some grass dust to make it look like not like just wood. Plop some trees and some industries and I'd be a very happy boy.
I'm not sure what Industries I want or currently have, it might all just be houses. I was thinking I'd leave 12" for buildings. So a slot from top of rail to bottom of the rail would be 15". Might as well go 18" ease of measuring (18" being 1.5ft)
With 1.5" for 2x4 thickness (because they really aren't 2") , that makes each slot 19.5". Call it 20 and add in the half to the height for the slot.. I would need 3 slots, so 60" so 5ft tall. That's also using the top as a section itself, so that would add on another 3" on top to make that.
Also.with doing the top as a 2x8, which way would be better to make the slots, so they slide in 8ft or the 2ft? The width of the cart has to be wider than at least 1 dimension for the sections to fit.
Sliding the 8ft in could give extra width to the top, going with the 2ft section would mean I would need 2 filler sections on the opposite 8ft side, or have the side sections set on top of the shelf edges.
Edit because I would just like to say my math may be wrong, I am super tired and just got home from my 8hr essential job. Which I went into tired to begin with
A 2'x8' section of a model railroad, complete with scenery in place, might get a little awkward to handle. It might be somewhat easier to have the sections slide in the 2' direction. If it were mine, I would do 2'x4'.
As far as how much height for each section, it depends on how high your buildings and scenery features are. Pretty simple.
I still don't see how your going to have any continuous running with 2' wide sections, unless, somehow, you put 2 of them together width wise, to make a 4' wide section.
All of this seems to be a ways down the road yet, and when you actually start to build something, you'll probably think this out all over again.
It is nice to gather some possible designs, in the mean time.
I think all jobs are essential. I'm essentially retired
Have to think of it more like I mentione,d not a linear thing. 4 sections 2x8 go together to form a 8x12 donut, plenty of room for a loop. Or a 10x10, is you offset the ends. Or a 4x16 island, or a 2x32 linear.
To be portable, taller structures have to come off. It's not practical to have tall structures and try to stack things up.
My 2x8 sections were easy to handle - but they did only have the most basic of scenery at that stage, basic ground cover and ballast. Nothing that prevented them from being stood on end for easy carrying. The club modules are slid into their racks with 2 people handling them, not one person.
Another option is to make them smaller. 18"x4', or 2x4. If you either follow an existing modular standard, or make something up and stick to it, you can build a minumum now and add more sections later to make it bigger. 5 sections, 2x4 would get you an 8x8 donut. If you use the same spacing from the edge for the tracks, you cna add additional sections in pairs to extend it in any direction.
They don;t all have to be the same size - even 12" wide is enough for multiple tracks, so just the corner sections would have to be bigger to fit the curves. Nor do all sections have to be the same, for sections where just the main passes through, that module can be 12" wide, byt the next one can be deeper to allow more buildings. They key is having the connection at the benchwork level and the track position to be standardized so you can attach any two sections together and the track lines up. And like is done in many truly modular layouts, a given scene can span multiple modules - the in between track can be however you want, just the outside pieces have to have tracks in the standard positon to link in witht he rest.
If there are any modular clubs in your area, consider joining - then you can build something you can set up at home but also make part of a huge layout when on display.
A fully scenicked 2 by 8 ft. segment or module cannot be handled by a single person alone, without damaging it.
Happy times!
Ulrich (aka The Tin Man)
"You´re never too old for a happy childhood!"
Here is the layout I was thinking to do for the 4 2x8 sections, for a 12x8 donut
Tinplate Toddler A fully scenicked 2 by 8 ft. segment or module cannot be handled by a single person alone, without damaging it.
I'm only going to make the wood look like grass, via paint and some grass dust, put some trees on it, and some buildings. No fancy mountains or anything I would have to custom build.
Also it will be set up more than tore down. It won't be an all the time thing. and if each section has legs, I think could do it, at least right now, maybe not in 40 years or so, but hopefully by then I'll have some property for a pond and a pole barn, and have a much bigger, permenant layout.
rrinker Have to think of it more like I mentione,d not a linear thing. 4 sections 2x8 go together to form a 8x12 donut, plenty of room for a loop. Or a 10x10, is you offset the ends. Or a 4x16 island, or a 2x32 linear. To be portable, taller structures have to come off. It's not practical to have tall structures and try to stack things up. My 2x8 sections were easy to handle - but they did only have the most basic of scenery at that stage, basic ground cover and ballast. Nothing that prevented them from being stood on end for easy carrying. The club modules are slid into their racks with 2 people handling them, not one person. Another option is to make them smaller. 18"x4', or 2x4. If you either follow an existing modular standard, or make something up and stick to it, you can build a minumum now and add more sections later to make it bigger. 5 sections, 2x4 would get you an 8x8 donut. If you use the same spacing from the edge for the tracks, you cna add additional sections in pairs to extend it in any direction. They don;t all have to be the same size - even 12" wide is enough for multiple tracks, so just the corner sections would have to be bigger to fit the curves. Nor do all sections have to be the same, for sections where just the main passes through, that module can be 12" wide, byt the next one can be deeper to allow more buildings. They key is having the connection at the benchwork level and the track position to be standardized so you can attach any two sections together and the track lines up. And like is done in many truly modular layouts, a given scene can span multiple modules - the in between track can be however you want, just the outside pieces have to have tracks in the standard positon to link in witht he rest. If there are any modular clubs in your area, consider joining - then you can build something you can set up at home but also make part of a huge layout when on display. --Randy
I would go 2x4 if I could split my layout that i like up somehow. not sure
I was hoping to keep the buildings on the layout though so I didn't have to worry about where to put them when stacked up. I'm not planning on too many buildings, or too much scenery. I'd have to look around to find something like I am wanting, but I am not doing super fancy details or anything like that.
The section that will be the top of the shelf, so it wouldn't be benig moved other than the entire rack on wheels, wouldn't have to have any buildings removed as well. the opposite side is the yard, i'm not sure what buildings I would put on that, sbut I guess they wouldn't be too big. That leaves 3 spurs on the side sections, which I can do some smaller buildings there too. so any big building on the rack top section that stays in place
I have no idea about any module clubs around me. I would be interested in finding one, I'm in Owosso Michigan, between Flint and Lansing. If anyone knows of any, or knows where i could look?
With the thought of keeping buildings on the layout, would going with 2x6 sections?
The 2x6 sections would give me a 10x6 area. I wouldnt worry about having the cart as the permanent top, just use it as a leg section. I could make the rack hold the 2x6 side by side, so it would be 12ft wide and 2ft deep (plus the framing lumber of course)
EDIT: Actually, what if I did 2 of the 2x6s and 2 2x4s. that could be pulled out of the rack, and set up? one of the issues I'm having is trying to fit the curves on the sides, but I could make those a seperate section altogether. The 2x4s would have small industries, while one 2x6 would be a yard, and the other a few big industries. On the rack I would stick a 2x6 and a 2x4 on the same level, so I can make it as high as I need since it would only be a 2 shelf deal. The curved sections that will be seperate won't need any hieght for clearance of scenery, so I can just have mini-slots underneath the shelfs to fit them all.
Hi woodge 0912
Probably a lot smaller than you want being HOn30 but it works and fits in a storage and transport box and is pretty versitile.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6Pc9MZREp8
Somewhere on you tube is how he designed it but I can't find it
regards John
I think I'm gonna go for 2 2x8 sections. One will be a yard and one will have some industries (aiming for 3 if possible)
The one with industries will be detailed, and will be the top of the rack. The yard will have some detailing to it, but not much, and should be able to slide underneath.
For a double main line, I will have the inner most rail (the inside of the donut) cross over with a wider turn, becoming the outside rail of the connecting sections. They will be painted and grass dusted, same with the rest, but they wont have any trees or buildings. They will slot into their own slots, and shouldnt take up.too much height. Those can be mutliple peices, being just the crossover section and half a curve, so I will need 4 of those.
Hi all
Found it and its the in English vesion.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pq77uPuRAhA
might be usfull to some one.
From being in an HOn3 modular group - started off as HOn3 Free-mo - I have learned the following:
- 4ft (2ft wide) is as long a module as one person can pick up and set down on the legs or into a storage rack. 3ft or 40" length is better. It's always better to have 2 people, but 1 person can usually manage 4ft or less.
- have a free-standing leg frame, and use leg pockets on the module. That way you simply pick up the module and set it down on the leg assembly. Both the limited length and the leg frame work together to protect rail to the module ends and delicate scenery. The module never needs to be turned vertical or on stood or tilted on end.
- C-clamps work well for a one or two track module interface, but require a lot of adjustment when you have more than 2 tracks crossing the interface. Some kind of bolt or pin mechanism to perform the alignment is highly desirable with 2 tracks or more across the interface. The tighter the tolerances on the alignment device, the better for repeatability.
- If you are not putting the modules in the same place and in the same order when setting up, top adjustable legs really speed setup when using C-clamps. Or a very rigid alignment device and modules can suffice if you are willing to leave fixed length legs hanging. Floors are never perfectly flat.
- Put handholds in the end of your modules to make picking up a cinch. This is the reason for 4ft or less length modules/sections. Handholds on the side means you are reaching across the module and may or may not have them located at the balance point.
- Wear short sleeves when setting up/taking down the layout.
Fred W