Trains.com

Subscriber & Member Login

Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more!

Fiber optics for lighting in industrial area

5239 views
10 replies
1 rating 2 rating 3 rating 4 rating 5 rating
PED
  • Member since
    April 2016
  • 571 posts
Fiber optics for lighting in industrial area
Posted by PED on Sunday, September 23, 2018 8:25 PM

I have never used fiber optics but I recently saw a module at a train show that used fiber optics to add life to a scene with a grass fire. Sparked my interest in how I might use fiber optins in my own layout.

My first step was to start researching on how it was done. Turns out that it is actually a simple concept even though implementing it may be a challange. My first attempt will be to add exterior lighting to an industrial area such as a refinery. If you have ever seen one at night, they have a mirad of external lights scattered around the structure. I model in N scale so decided a long time ago that LED's would not give me the effect I wanted. However, the tiny lights that fiber optics can produce should give me the effects I want.

I am looking for guidance. I have already ordered a sample kit from The Fiber Optic Store so I will have some fiber to experiement with. In the meantime, I would like any comments on the following that you can offer.

1) Who has done something similar by adding lights to the exterior of an industrial structure? Pictures?

2) What fiber size would be prefered for external light in N scale?

3) Suggestions on how to route the fiber through an open structure? Lots of my structures have external open frameworks such as catwalks, towers, piping, etc with no hidden structure to easily conceal fiber.

4) Suggestions on how to terminate a fiber to get it it shine like a light bulb? Don't need it to light the scene but I want it to look like an exterior light bulb as seen from a distance.

5) Any good source (book, web site, etc) with "how to" info?

Paul D

N scale Washita and Santa Fe Railroad
Southern Oklahoma circa late 70's

  • Member since
    May 2004
  • 7,500 posts
Posted by 7j43k on Sunday, September 23, 2018 8:39 PM

PED

 

4) Suggestions on how to terminate a fiber to get it it shine like a light bulb? Don't need it to light the scene but I want it to look like an exterior light bulb as seen from a distance.

 

I suggest sanding the end of the fiber with fine sandpaper.  Not just the end itself, but also the last fraction of an inch.  Cheap experiment.  I predict that fraction of an inch will glow like a bulb.

Now, this will make an awfully long lightbulb (but maybe a great fluorescent tube?). To make the glowing part lightbulb size, you need to paint or cover the rest of the fiber, which you were probably planning on anyway.

Fiber doesn't do sharp corners well, so "concealing" it in the open is going to be a challenge.

Still, this sounds like a very interesting idea.  I look forward to hearing of your progress!

 

Ed

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: Bradford, Ontario
  • 15,581 posts
Posted by hon30critter on Sunday, September 23, 2018 11:39 PM

PED
4) Suggestions on how to terminate a fiber to get it it shine like a light bulb? Don't need it to light the scene but I want it to look like an exterior light bulb as seen from a distance.

The easiest way to get fiber optic cable to look like a light bulb is to apply a bit of heat to the end of the fiber with a lighter or a hot soldering iron. Don't touch the fiber. Just hold the heat source close. The plastic will form a small mushroom shaped 'blob' (for lack of a better word). You can make it bigger or smaller depending on how much heat you apply. In your case I think that you want minimum flare.

Actually for N scale, I don't think you need to do anything to the visible tip of the cable. Cut it with a sharp blade and that's it. You will get plenty of light. Nobody will be able to see the shape.

The other end of the fiber will end up in a bundle. How many fibers you can fit into a bundle varies, but basically you want every fiber pointing directly at the light source. I glue the bundles together with epoxy and then cut them off square. I then use epoxy to glue the light source to the bundle, and then cover the joint with heat shrink tubing. Note that I use LEDs so I'm not worried about life expectancy. If you are using incandescent bulbs I would not glue them to the bundle. That will make replacement a PITA.

PED
3) Suggestions on how to route the fiber through an open structure? Lots of my structures have external open frameworks such as catwalks, towers, piping, etc with no hidden structure to easily conceal fiber.

That will be a challenge. The finer the fiber optic cable you use the easier it will be to bend it, but you will never get a sharp bend. I used fiber optic cable with a very small flare in this HO cab to illuminate the roof lights. The LED is in the chassis. The head lights and signal lights are also fiber optic cable that has been flared as I suggested above. The photo doesn't really show how bright the roof lights are:

 

Personally I wouldn't worry about having the fibers visible. There is lots of conduit attached to that sort of structure in real life. Disguise the fibers as conduit by painting them. Getting the fibers to lay perfectly straight might be the biggest challenge. If you install support bars every so often like the real stuff has, you should be able to attach it at one end and then pull the fiber straight and hold it while you glue it in place. However, before using CA to glue the fibers, I would do a little test to make sure it doesn't damage the fiber.

Dave

 

I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!

  • Member since
    January 2009
  • From: Bakersfield, CA 93308
  • 6,526 posts
Posted by RR_Mel on Monday, September 24, 2018 8:09 AM

I’ve been using fiber optics for years and all of the above info is right on.  As for size it will depend on the size of the light you want.  I model in HO and I keep a good stock of fiber from .02”/.005mm to .12”/3mm.
 
You can drive the fiber with any color LED at up to max current 20ma, I limit all my LEDs to 15ma or lower with resistors.  I bundle them and use heat shrink (go easy with the heat so as not to ding the fiber) to keep them together then as mentioned using a super sharp blade whack them off clean cut.  Use fresh CA to attach the bundle to the LED.
 
You can also use side emitting fiber for fluorescent tubes.  The side emitting fiber doesn’t emit as much light as end emitting fiber so you might need to drive the LEDs at max current to get the right effect.
 
Don’t kink the fiber, a kink will greatly reduce the light at the end as well as emit light at the kink.
 
Dave is spot on with using heat to form a bulb.  For HO vehicle tail lights I touch the end to my soldering iron to make a flat surface for better light dispersion.  If you need to add color to the end of the fiber Crafters Acrylic Glass Stain works great.
 
 
 
Mel
 
 
My Model Railroad   
 
Bakersfield, California
 
I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.
 
PED
  • Member since
    April 2016
  • 571 posts
Posted by PED on Monday, September 24, 2018 9:25 AM

Great info.

- I am suprised at the suggestion to use CA. All the web info I have seen so far indicates that the CA will damage the plastic fiber. Typically suggests a glue that is plastic safe.

- I think the suggestion to disguise the fiber as painted conduit in open structure is a great idea.

- I realize that the bending limits of the fiber will be a tough challange but I think I can work within the limits.

- The Fiber Optics store sells individual strands of fiber as well as bundles. I think they sell a 32 strand bundle. That should allow me to use a single white LED on one end then distribute the 32 strands throughout a structure to add a lot of pinpoint lights.

- Will need to experiment with the finish effect on the ends. Some ends will be viewed from the side while others from the end. Different views may require a different end treatment.

More comments?

Paul D

N scale Washita and Santa Fe Railroad
Southern Oklahoma circa late 70's

  • Member since
    December 2015
  • From: Shenandoah Valley
  • 9,094 posts
Posted by BigDaddy on Monday, September 24, 2018 9:51 AM

Usually if Mel says it works, it works.  The concerns I see on the webs are making the fibers brittle and melting.  Mel is using it at the end on the LED.  A little melting wouldn't be terrible and there shouldn't be a lot of flexing going on at the point anyway.

I use the same silicon caulk for track, where I have an LED and a light pipe serving as a loco headlight. 

 

Henry

COB Potomac & Northern

Shenandoah Valley

  • Member since
    May 2004
  • 7,500 posts
Posted by 7j43k on Monday, September 24, 2018 10:16 AM

Epoxy will work nicely for glueing fiber.

 

Ed

  • Member since
    January 2009
  • From: Bakersfield, CA 93308
  • 6,526 posts
Posted by RR_Mel on Monday, September 24, 2018 11:07 AM

Many years ago I took a training course on fiber communications and learned how to correctly bond fiber optic cable for minimum light loss.  We were taught to use CA (Clear Epoxy or Super Glue back then) to fuse the fibers to the light source and receivers.  The CA does slightly melt the fiber but that helps keep the light loss to a minimum.
 
When I’m only working with a few .02” to .04” diameter fibers I make an light driver from Evergreen Styrene tubing about ¾” long with the same ID as the LED OD.  The LED goes in one end and the fibers in the other end.
 
Check for maximum brightness before gluing in the fiber connection to the light source.  Looking at the illuminating end of the fiber move the fibers in the Styrene tube (light source end) around touching the LED lens and “tune for maximum light”.  That is where you want to glue the fibers.
 
I use a drop of CA to glue the LED in the end of the tube then put a couple of drops of CA in the open end and stuff in the fibers. 
 
Any plastic type adhesive on the side of the fibers will create light loss so be very careful to not get any CA on the sides of the fiber.  Use a non plastic water based glue for routing/anchoring the fiber in place to prevent light loss.
 
Once I’m happy with the light driver I paint it black using Acrylic paint.  Make sure there are no cracks or places for the paint to get to the  LED lens or the fiber connection or you will be making a LED second driver, that’s first hand info!!!!
 
This is an HO scale Rolls Royce with a Mel Styrene light driver for the fiber taillights.  In all of my HO vehicles I use 1mm 1½ volt micro bulbs for headlights and taillights.  The fiber lighting fundamentals are the same for the micro bulbs as for LEDs.  To me the incandescent bulbs look more realistic in my vehicles.
 
 
 
 
 
 
Mel
 
 
My Model Railroad   
 
Bakersfield, California
 
I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.
 
PED
  • Member since
    April 2016
  • 571 posts
Posted by PED on Friday, September 28, 2018 8:11 PM

Received my sample pack of fiber and it included 2 samples of multi fiber cable. How do I remove some of the outer cover without damage to the internal fiber strands? I have a coax cable stripper as well as a Cat5 cable cover stripper. I know they can be used to remove the cover on the fiber bundle but I am concerned that it would damage the internal fibes that are close to the outer cover.

These bundles look like a great way to add many points of light to a structure so I expect to be using some of this in lieu of trying to build a bundle from individual strands.

Paul D

N scale Washita and Santa Fe Railroad
Southern Oklahoma circa late 70's

  • Member since
    May 2004
  • 7,500 posts
Posted by 7j43k on Friday, September 28, 2018 11:02 PM

PED

Received my sample pack of fiber and it included 2 samples of multi fiber cable. How do I remove some of the outer cover without damage to the internal fiber strands? I have a coax cable stripper as well as a Cat5 cable cover stripper. I know they can be used to remove the cover on the fiber bundle but I am concerned that it would damage the internal fibes that are close to the outer cover.

These bundles look like a great way to add many points of light to a structure so I expect to be using some of this in lieu of trying to build a bundle from individual strands.

 

 

If you want to use cables like this, I suggest you strip back the outer sheath with any tool you care to us (such as your coax cable stripper).  After that's done, any fibers that are (significantly) damaged will not conduct light.  Just fold them back, or cut them off, and don't use them.

There should be plenty of usable fibers left.

 

Ed

PED
  • Member since
    April 2016
  • 571 posts
Posted by PED on Saturday, September 29, 2018 9:19 AM

Ed - That is where I was headed but I wanted to see if there was a way to do it with no damaged fibers. The bundle has more strands per bundle than I would ever use in a single application.

Paul D

N scale Washita and Santa Fe Railroad
Southern Oklahoma circa late 70's

Subscriber & Member Login

Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more!

Users Online

Search the Community

ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT
Model Railroader Newsletter See all
Sign up for our FREE e-newsletter and get model railroad news in your inbox!