Is there a secret to paving smooth city streets and country roads. If there is I haven't found it. I've tried a wide variety of paving materials from various plasters, Durham's Water Putty, and lately I've been using dry joint compound mixed with water because it has a longer working time than the other materials. I start by framing the street or road with either styrene strips or foam roadbed. I mix the material to the consistency of pancake batter and then pour it into the form. I then spread it around and scree it. This is where things start to go wrong. Inevitable the material sticks to the scree which causes voids in the road. A recent article which I think was by Pelle Sorberg suggested dipping the scree in water to prevent that but that was only moderately helpful. After getting the road as smooth as I can, I wait for it to start to set up, then brush over it with a wet foam brush to try to level out the uneven spots but this leaves streaks and doesn't completely smooth out the road. The last step is to sand the road which smooths it out some but I still end up with subtle dips and swales. What am I doing wrong?Should I mix the paving material thinner so it becomes self leveling? If I do will it be strong enough? And what should I do if the paved surface is sloped? Any advice would be appreciated.
I know in the real world roads aren't perfectly smooth but rare is the road that is as lumpy as mine turn out.
I dont worry about the first coat being smooth. After it dries for about 24 hours i slightly wet it and apply the second coat. this one I try to get as smooth as possible. After the second coat dries I very lightly sand with 220 then 400. Wth the 220 I only use the weight of the sanding block just to get rid of the high ridges. I paint with apple barrel type acrylic and a foam brush. Ive tried several materals but my favorite is still smooth-it. Durhams was too hard for me when it came to hetting a smooth hard finish.
I use dry wall mud, but I mix it to the consistancy of mud, or low slump concrete (stiff), apply it, with out forms, and finish it with my trusty margin trowel (looks like a small spatchula, with a square end).
As it sets, I do whatever extra trowling I need to do, to get the results I want. If it does develop any fine cracks, it makes it look even more prototypical. I then add the gravel shoulder.
I don't worry about the "crowning" in a road, but it's easy enough to do, as I trowel it.
I color it with washes, to get what I'm looking for. It works for making concrete roads, and blacktop.
Remember the soupier you make it, the more it will shrink. And for your method, keep the screed wet. And mix it REALLY good, as any tiny lumps will show up, while your screeding.
Back to the margin trowel, I'm a retired cement finisher, and a cement finisher is NOT ready for the day until his margin trowel is in his back pocket, and don't EVER ask to use it, or try to grap it out of a cement finishers pocket . Laborers, go get you own!
Mike.
My You Tube
I was unaware that such streets were smooth at all.
ROARING
The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.
Here there be cats. LIONS with CAMERAS
How about drywall/plaster topped with sand and Portland cement... might look like asphalt or concrete not sure...
Steve
If everything seems under control, you're not going fast enough!
I have had really good results using 2mm craft foam. Cut it to the desired width and paint it. I use a base coat of Rustoleum gray primer that I then weather with acrylics. It's easy to scribe the joints and cracks in it.
Jeff White
Alma, IL
As JWhite suggested, I prefer to use 2mm craft foam for my road surfaces applied over a .040" styrene sheet roadbed. The styrene base allows me to create realistic grades and drainage crowns while the craft foam gives me a surface that resembles scale appropriate asphalt/concrete road textures. I is indeed easy to scribe joints and cracks and the foam takes paint well. I like to use Woodland Scenics Foam Putty to fill in joints between the craft foam sheet. Another forum member suggested disguising such joints as large cracks by overlapping the edges of the craft foam, then cutting a crooked lined through both layers of foam. Discard the cut-off ends and the two crooked edges should fit like puzzle pieces.
I start by laying out the roadway using pieces of cardstock. Once I have the roadway drawn and cut out of the cardstock, I use these as patterns to transfer the road shape onto the sheet styrene. Once the styrene pieces are cut out, I use them as patterns to cut out matching pieces of craft foam. I generally adhere the styrene roadbed to the layout using adhesive caulk. I adhere the craft foam to the styrene using 3M Super 77 (or similar) spray adhesive. I have been very happy with my results and my roads often receive positive comments from others. Best of all, there is no mixing (other than paint), pouring, waiting for things to dry, and no sanding/vacuuming.
Hornblower
hornblower As JWhite suggested, I prefer to use 2mm craft foam for my road surfaces applied over a .040" styrene sheet roadbed. The styrene base allows me to create realistic grades and drainage crowns while the craft foam gives me a surface that resembles scale appropriate asphalt/concrete road textures. I is indeed easy to scribe joints and cracks and the foam takes paint well. I like to use Woodland Scenics Foam Putty to fill in joints between the craft foam sheet. Another forum member suggested disguising such joints as large cracks by overlapping the edges of the craft foam, then cutting a crooked lined through both layers of foam. Discard the cut-off ends and the two crooked edges should fit like puzzle pieces. I start by laying out the roadway using pieces of cardstock. Once I have the roadway drawn and cut out of the cardstock, I use these as patterns to transfer the road shape onto the sheet styrene. Once the styrene pieces are cut out, I use them as patterns to cut out matching pieces of craft foam. I generally adhere the styrene roadbed to the layout using adhesive caulk. I adhere the craft foam to the styrene using 3M Super 77 (or similar) spray adhesive. I have been very happy with my results and my roads often receive positive comments from others. Best of all, there is no mixing (other than paint), pouring, waiting for things to dry, and no sanding/vacuuming.
The problem with using craft foam or stryene for road surfaces is that it can get quite expensive if you are building a lot of roadways. I am currently about halfway through paving the streets in a town on a peninsula that is about 4x6 feet. There are three streets in each direction. From there I will be building a curving highway that I am guessing will be roughly 15 feet in length. I really need to do this with some sort of paving material such as the dry joint compound mix I am currently using. Except for my difficulty with getting a wavy surface, it fills my needs and is very economical. I can't remember what I paid for it but I bought a large bag of it about five years ago and still have enough left to finish the remaining roads. I just need to find a way to smooth it out some.
RR_Mel I haven’t made any paved roads in many years but when I did I used Arizona Rock and Mineral Asphalt power. I made a sub base then poured the power on the base material then added a Elmer white glue 1:8 mix (8 water 1 white glue). Using a dropper nozzle squeeze bottle I worked it to a almost runny mix then worked it with taping blades to a smooth road type surface. I use a 1½” and 3½” taping blades to form the road. When it has fully dried it has a 150 grit sandpaper look. Thanks to my lovely wife I have a pair of Sears Craftsman 3D (disk) contour sanders and using 80 grit disks I sand the road until it looks like an asphalt road. I’ve had really good luck using that method. The pictures above were taken shortly after painting the yellow strip on one of my asphalt roads. Mel Modeling the early to mid 1950s SP in HO scale since 1951 My Model Railroad http://melvineperry.blogspot.com/ Bakersfield, California I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.
This method sounds promising. If I'm understanding you, it sounds like you apply it similar to the method for applying ballast in that you lay it down dry then soak it and apply the adhesive. Am I correct so far.
I have a palm sander for smoothing and I have used it on country roads but it is a little too narrow for my city streets. I use styrene strips to frame the streets and that styrene becomes the base for the sidewalks. The sander won't fit between the strips.
Yes I have, make a mix of plaster of paris and white glue. Works fantastic, takes paint well and can be carved with lines for cement (more common in my era) after it dries. Also you can sand away any mistakes.
I don't particularly like to show photos of work in progress, but since we're all dedicated modelers here, and since this might be a little helpful in this thread, I'll post a few (warts and all).
They show the four-lane highway that runs down the center of the middle peninsula and the surface street that leads to the intermodal yard and the chemical-plant-pulp-mill-complex. I used 1/4" hardboard masonite to form the base of the roads. Having raised roadways means the surfaces are up to the same level as the top of rail, and therefore no sudden humps at the grade crossing that in 1:1 would cause tractor-trailers to high center (I've witnessed a pretty spectacular crash because of this). But it also means I have to construct the sloped shoulders, in this case using lightweight sheetrock mud. The intermodal yard in the upper right portion of the first photo was constructed from the same materials, using the same technique. Like I said, warts and all.
Later on, I'll explain how I finish the surface.
Robert
LINK to SNSR Blog
i have had pretty good luck with using joint compound but i get a lightweight type normaly it has a purple or blue lid , ill usualy do 2 coats but for the second coat mix in some water and make it really soupy you can also add some acrilic paint in this coat if you want to get a base color in if you want too , then when it dries totaly you can use a fine drwall sanding screen (not regular sandpaper) and sand it to as smoth as you want it, then paint and detail it
Good luck
NYBW-JohnThe problem with using craft foam or stryene for road surfaces is that it can get quite expensive if you are building a lot of roadways.
If you are buying packages of Evergreen or Plastruct sheet styrene pieces, it can indeed get expensive. If, however, you buy your sheet styrene in 4' by 8" sheets from a local plastic supply house, it is significantly cheaper. I buy my styrene sheet from a place called Industrial Plastic Supply in Anaheim, California. Last time I bought some, it was $22 for a full 4' by 8' sheet of .040 white styrene. Black was a few bucks more. If you don't have physical access to such a business, you can order the styrene on-line. Most places will cut the full sheet into smaller pieces on request. The biggest advantage of making roadways from large styrene sheets is the ability to make the entire road from a single piece of styrene. If you want to use the styrene as the finished road surface just sand it with fine sandpaper in multiple random directions to get some paving texture, scribe a few expansion joints for concrete roads and cracks for either concrete or asphalt roads, then paint.
Michaels craft stores stock 12" by 18" sheets of 2mm craft foam in several colors for $1 each. Even if your roadway is 6" wide, you can do 3' of road for a $1 -- 6' if your road is only 3" wide. I originally tried a road surface technique suggested by another forum member where you apply a thin coat of plaster on top of the craft foam, then press down on the dried plaster to creat realistic crack patterns. After several unsuccessful attempts at duplicating this method, I decided to skip the plaster and just scribe cracks in the craft foam. A little painting/weathering and my craft foam roads looked extremely convincing (at least to me). The attached picture is a little dated as I've added a lot to this scene. I guess I need to take a few more current photos.
I can understand preferring to use a material you already have on hand (I have done that a lot myself). However, always defer to the forum when considering the use of new materials and/or techiques because other members may have already found more economical and/or efficient ways to do things. Not every idea will fit with what you want to do, but you just might discover a material or technique you never considered before. Just one of the many reasons I enjoy this forum. Good luck with your roads, however you create them!
NYBW-John hornblower As JWhite suggested, I prefer to use 2mm craft foam for my road surfaces applied over a .040" styrene sheet roadbed. The styrene base allows me to create realistic grades and drainage crowns while the craft foam gives me a surface that resembles scale appropriate asphalt/concrete road textures. I is indeed easy to scribe joints and cracks and the foam takes paint well. I like to use Woodland Scenics Foam Putty to fill in joints between the craft foam sheet. Another forum member suggested disguising such joints as large cracks by overlapping the edges of the craft foam, then cutting a crooked lined through both layers of foam. Discard the cut-off ends and the two crooked edges should fit like puzzle pieces. I start by laying out the roadway using pieces of cardstock. Once I have the roadway drawn and cut out of the cardstock, I use these as patterns to transfer the road shape onto the sheet styrene. Once the styrene pieces are cut out, I use them as patterns to cut out matching pieces of craft foam. I generally adhere the styrene roadbed to the layout using adhesive caulk. I adhere the craft foam to the styrene using 3M Super 77 (or similar) spray adhesive. I have been very happy with my results and my roads often receive positive comments from others. Best of all, there is no mixing (other than paint), pouring, waiting for things to dry, and no sanding/vacuuming. The problem with using craft foam or stryene for road surfaces is that it can get quite expensive if you are building a lot of roadways. I am currently about halfway through paving the streets in a town on a peninsula that is about 4x6 feet. There are three streets in each direction. From there I will be building a curving highway that I am guessing will be roughly 15 feet in length. I really need to do this with some sort of paving material such as the dry joint compound mix I am currently using. Except for my difficulty with getting a wavy surface, it fills my needs and is very economical. I can't remember what I paid for it but I bought a large bag of it about five years ago and still have enough left to finish the remaining roads. I just need to find a way to smooth it out some.
$10 on Amazon will buy enough of the craft foam to do a lot of roads. I just checked 9"x12" 2mm black foam 10 sheets to a package is selling for $5.86 a pack. If you're a prime member shipping is free. It's not as expensive as you think, but if you've already got the joint compound mix I can understand wanting to use it.
I switched to the craft foam after being unable to get good results with joint compound.
I'll stick with the mud. It's all how you use it, and work with it.
hornblower NYBW-John The problem with using craft foam or stryene for road surfaces is that it can get quite expensive if you are building a lot of roadways. If you are buying packages of Evergreen or Plastruct sheet styrene pieces, it can indeed get expensive. If, however, you buy your sheet styrene in 4' by 8" sheets from a local plastic supply house, it is significantly cheaper. I buy my styrene sheet from a place called Industrial Plastic Supply in Anaheim, California. Last time I bought some, it was $22 for a full 4' by 8' sheet of .040 white styrene. Black was a few bucks more. If you don't have physical access to such a business, you can order the styrene on-line. Most places will cut the full sheet into smaller pieces on request. The biggest advantage of making roadways from large styrene sheets is the ability to make the entire road from a single piece of styrene. If you want to use the styrene as the finished road surface just sand it with fine sandpaper in multiple random directions to get some paving texture, scribe a few expansion joints for concrete roads and cracks for either concrete or asphalt roads, then paint.
NYBW-John The problem with using craft foam or stryene for road surfaces is that it can get quite expensive if you are building a lot of roadways.
I've been busy all week and am just now getting back to this thread. About ten years ago I did buy .060mm styrene in 4x8 sheets and made extensive use of it including for roadways, parking lots, etc. I still have a few scraps of it which I use here and there but not enough for the current project. I'm nearing the finish line and I don't think I have a need for even one more 4x8 sheet. I've used styrene for straight city streets in the past but using it for curving country roads is a little trickier as it would require making curved parallel cuts while maintaining the proper width. It's also much harder to shape the curves to fit the space. I find it much easier to frame the roadway with foam roadbed turned upside down to create a beveled edge. I can just free form the one side and then lay the other parallel to it using a scrap piece of styrene to maintain the proper width as I glue the second side down.
I hadn't thought of using the craft foam for my city streets and it might have been a good option but I am too far along now and I don't want to tear up what I have already done and start over.
I did have a couple luck accidents with the joint compound street. I was sanding a portion if it and apparently there was a clump that hadn't mixed completely with the water and it popped out leaving a perfect pothole. It was a simple matter to create a black patch to fill in that pothole. Another section I must have been applying a litte too much pressure and a large chunk about four inches long broke loose in severate pieces. At first I was going to throw them out and patch in a new section but I saw I could glue the pieces back in place and it left some very realistic looking stress fractures. I had to create a few black patches there also but I like the way it turned out.
Styrene painted with a mix of craft paints.
IMO the secret to a realistic road or street is in the weathering which I make no effort to do . Bob
IMO the secret to a realistic road or street is in the weathering which I make no effort to do .
Bob
Don't Ever Give Up
Lion
True but that might be because we both have NYC roots. Growing up you knew when you entered the city by the potholes in the road.
Joe Staten Island West
I use the back of an asphalt shingle,aready black,and just a little texure.Paint to taste. If you use the top side, and add a thin layer of drywall mud, looks kinda like cobble stone
UNCLEBUTCHI use the back of an asphalt shingle,aready black,and just a little texure.Paint to taste. If you use the top side, and add a thin layer of drywall mud, looks kinda like cobble stone
Now that's a different method. Who'd a thunck!
Cobblestones, or maybe exposed aggregate concrete.