I am getting ready to attempt building wyes and turn-outs in HO. Plan to use Fast-Trax templates. I have an article from a June 1983 MR magazine by Laurence Ballou on "Building Turnouts at the Workbench." Are there other good resources on scratch building turn-outs other than the Fast-Trax videos which I have already watched.
Any other tips would be greatly appreciated as you all really helped me on hand laying my first siding with your tips and suggestions.
Jim
i found Tony Koester's article, Build a turnout from scratch, encouraging and full of info. He builds them on the layout for a custom fit.
the book, Trackwork and Lineside Detail contains several articles on turnouts
greg - Philadelphia & Reading / Reading
The current issue of MR magazine.
Rich
Alton Junction
If you want the best possible turnout, build it on-site - and use full length (36 inch or 1 meter) stock rails if electrical gapping allows.
I hand-lay turnouts with a method that is Definitely not patented - and if you enter that in the search block and go to 2007 entries you'll find all the details. I work with two three point gauges on the rails and an NMRA flat gauge in the hand that isn't holding the spiking pliers.
There is a learning curve to hand laying turnouts, but the old carpenter's maxim, "Measure twice, cut once," is a good place to start. Once you master the techniques you'll be able to tackle anything, even a station throat full of double slip switches. The cost is nice, too...
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - with hand-laid specialwork)
Chuck, your reply interests me because I remain fascinated with hand laid turnouts although I have never done one.
I understand that there is a learning curve, and it has to be tremendously satisfying to complete a flawless turnout.
But, what about cost? You mention that "the cost is nice". Is it really less expensive to build your own after taking into account materials, jigs, and templates? There must be a breakpoint between building a few and building many.
Rich, my jig cost is ZERO. My template is made by bending flex track and running a pencil along the tie ends. I estimate that my hand laid turnouts cost about as much per each as a single length of cheap flex track. If you use an electrical switch as a manual throw mechanism you will have change from $10.00, total cost.
The fact that the rail geometry is what YOU want, not what you can buy in a bubble pack or box, is even better.
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)
richhotrainBut, what about cost? You mention that "the cost is nice". Is it really less expensive to build your own after taking into account materials, jigs, and templates? There must be a breakpoint between building a few and building many.
You really don't need the jig. Back in the '90s I tried my hand at scratchbuilding a turnout, three-way turnout, dual-gauge turnout, and double slip switch with nothing more than reference drawings.
If you're going to be mass producing dozens of them, then the jig would probably be worth the cost. If you're doing a small layout than it's probably not worth it. Add up the cost of all the jigs you'll need and divide that by the number of turnouts. That's the additional cost you'll need to add on to each turnout.
The nice thing about not using a jig is that you're not limited to certain sizes. You can custom fit a turnout to a particular spot.
Steve S
Steven S The nice thing about not using a jig is that you're not limited to certain sizes. You can custom fit a turnout to a particular spot.
I first tried building a turnout on a scrap piece of homasote without ties using rails from an old piece of flex track.
On my layout, I followed Tony Koester's steps, building it in place without a jig. It turned out well enough and encouraged me to build all my turnouts.
Rich, a jig is handy, especially to help learn and to keep the rails in place while you fumble your way through the first couple of constructions. After that, though, your more educated eye, some gauges, and a well-prepared roadbed are all that you need, plus the files and rail stock and some soldering gear if using PCB ties with copper cladding (they really help with electrical continuity along the turnout).
There came a time, maybe after building five #8's and a couple of double-slip turnouts using jigs that I understood how building custom handlaid turnouts could be done if one used the gauges often and properly. Since then, I have built a number of odd turnouts that had to fit specific and unique requirements, and they work well. One, my latest, looks horrible, frankly, because I had to fiddle with it a bit, but I can tell you in all honesty that I can smoke a BLI Niagara and a long set of smooth-side and heavyweight passenger cars through it in either direction at a scale 100 mph. I was puckered up down there the first time I gathered the courage to give it a determined try, but when the Niagara got through, I knew I was away to the races. If your track geometry is anything near a #6 or higher and you have your gauge and clearances set to the standard, or better, your trains will like what they get from you.
At the risk of being a "naysayer" - I much prefer "devil's advocate" - may I say.....
It takes a well skilled and knowledgeable person to hand build a turnout (or even to hand lay track). Those that do it and write articles about the process are certainly in that category.
I am familiar with "fast tracks" templates and they are a help, but the cost and time (add in learning curve) is hard to justify that pathway.
For those with the skills and the time and the need for "special fit turnouts", I say "go for it". But for the rest of us, it is an exercise in frustration and patience.
Just for grins, I wonder how many of the good folks on this forum have built their own turnout(s) and the result was a keeper that stood the test of time.
Good Morning!
ENJOY !
Mobilman44
Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central
I know a guy who spent a few hundred dollars on the fast tracks jigs and materials. He got one keeper, one reliable turnout. It took many tries, lots of scrap, and stretched his patience. He then sold the fast tracks jigs. The thing is, he could have bought a commercial turnout and saved $175 bucks in the process. Without the jigs, he would have been all but incapable of building even so-so turnouts.
mobilman44 At the risk of being a "naysayer" - I much prefer "devil's advocate" - may I say..... It takes a well skilled and knowledgeable person to hand build a turnout (or even to hand lay track). Those that do it and write articles about the process are certainly in that category.
Anyone who can lay Shinohara flex to a consistent curve can build hand-laid specialwork. For this stiff-fingered arthritic old coot it's simply a matter of cutting, bending and filing rail and keeping everything in gauge and securely anchored while applying soldering tool and solder. Filing points is a skill easily and quickly learned, even points with a non-standard form that work with notchless stock rails.
Much as I admire the product, I agree. Back when I was a newbie there were no jigs, and if you didn't hand-lay you didn't have any specialwork.
The best part of hand laying - even better than the price - is the ability to set your own track geometry. If you can bend flex to each route and run a train over it, you can build it. Hence three way switches with two routes curving left, turnouts connecting two curves where the 'straight' route is a spiral easement, puzzle palaces of double slips...
Back in 1980 I built a terminal station roughly based on the trackage I had seen at a colliery at Shime, Fukuoka-ken, Japan. Every millimeter of track (including numerous turnouts, most non-standard) was hand laid. The only pre-fab track product used was a shortened length of straight snap track - it rotates around a nail in its center track nail hole and served (and still serves) as a 'foobie' turntable. Total size, 15 by 96 inches. It has been part of six different layouts and is destined to be installed as the highest level trackage on my present garage filler. Even though it is operated regularly (trains arrive and depart via cassette) the above-grade trackwork has never given me any problems. I have had to rework below-grade throw mechanisms due to wear and changing environmental conditions, but the trackwork is bulletproof.
All of the specialwork on my double garage filler is hand-laid, I've been operating for close to ten years and there have only been two incidents of problems with turnouts. One was a rolling stock problem (underweight cars put into service uninspected couldn't spring the point of a spring switch) and one was the result of inadequate cleanup (droplet of solder on the railhead on the outside of a curve.) I don't count the pileup caused by backing a train into points set for the opposing route, which was pure operator error (Moi.) The auto-stop DID stop the loco - five cars too late.
My suggestion? Try hand-laying a turnout. The first one will probably be seriously ugly - but it will probably be at least as reliable as one bought in a bubble pack. (So use it where the sun won't shine.)
Chuck (Handlaid specialwork guru modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)
I have already built about fifty turnouts for my 10' by 19' double deck layout (still about 10 to go). All have been keepers. The only problem I have had is the occaisional point rail popping loose from the throw bar (easily re-soldered). I have only purchased PC ties and a #6 frog/point rail filing jig from Fast Tracks. I also use a flat mill file, a soldering iron and a single NMRA track gauge. I made my own jig by gluing a copy of the Fast Tracks #6 Turnout Template (from the catalog they sent with the PC ties and filing jig) to a piece of plywood, then using a thin plywood blade in a table saw to cut grooves across the jig where the PC ties were to be located. The template includes both left and right hand #6 turnouts so one jig serves both types of turnouts. I glued short pieces of PC ties into the grooves as stops to make locating the various PC ties a little faster. I also found that stripping the rails out of lengths of flex track is cheaper than buying individual rail stock. This also gives me plenty of extra ties to use filling in gaps under the track joiners.
Yes, it takes a little practice and patience, but my very first turnout is fully operational and on my layout. Best of all, I figured out after making a few regular #6 turnouts that I could make virtually any turnout I need using the same skills and tools used for the #6 turnouts. I have built curved turnouts, constant radius diverging route turnouts, and constant radius wye turnouts for use in special locations. For turnout angles other than #6, I find that the #6 frog/point rail filing jig quickly gets me close to the desired turnout angle that can then be filed by hand to achieve the final angle. Virtually anything is possible now.
How do they operate? Very nicely if I do say so myself. Locos and cars glide through the turnouts with little noise and almost no derailments. Far better performance thay I ever got on my previous layouts using Atlas turnouts. Most of the few derailments I've had have been caused by out of gauge wheelsets and not the turnouts.
Hornblower
How many of mine have stood the test of time? All of them. Even the scratched one I had to build in place because it was unique. It's a long curved #10 or so. I lifted it out of my last layout and inserted it on my latest build. Works like a hot damn. As Chuck would know, and stated in his post higher, my first couple were nothing to brag about, but they worked, and they're still together.
A Jig really doesn't do any good if you need a specal type of turnout to fit a tight area on the layout.
Real hand laying of a turnout is the only way.
I had to have 2 double curved turnouts one inside the other (almost like a curved 3 way) on my layout - built it back in 2003 - still works fine.
I use the PC board ties to hold everything together.
My last hand laid trackwork was a crossing - one side was straight but the other was an 18" radius curve - that one was interesting to build. This was in an industrial area.
BOB H - Clarion, PA
mobilman44 I am familiar with "fast tracks" templates and they are a help, but the cost and time (add in learning curve) is hard to justify that pathway. For those with the skills and the time and the need for "special fit turnouts", I say "go for it". But for the rest of us, it is an exercise in frustration and patience. Just for grins, I wonder how many of the good folks on this forum have built their own turnout(s) and the result was a keeper that stood the test of time.
Count me as another hand layer whose first (and subsequent) turnouts lasted the lifetime of the layout they were laid on - 9 years. These were laid on Celotex - a material a little softer than Homasote.
The only failure I have ever had was an Atlas kit turnout - yes, they made turnout kits in the '50s - that I bought second hand. The turnout didn't really fail, but the cork roadbed it was spiked into dried out and crumbled. I don't always learn from my first mistake. In the '90s, I bought some more cork roadbed for use on a 3 rail tinplate layout. Less than 5 years later, the cork had crumbled in the box it was shipped in.
In my opinion and experience, a handlaid turnout spiked into Homasote will outlast any commercial turnout.
I first tried hand laying in 1975 because I was a newly wed on active duty bringing home less than $500 a month (and paying $200/month rent). Even Atlas products were out of my reach. So armed with Jack Work's Turnouts for the Better (April 1963 MR), I started hand laying. I was surprised at how easy it was, and how well it worked.
As TT has explained, Fast Track jigs are unnecessary for even a ham-fisted baboon like me. The Fast Track jigs, materials, and instructions are great for giving the fearful confidence to hand lay. If you can successfully assemble a plastic kit with more than 4 parts, you can hand lay a turnout. If you don't believe me, just try spiking a piece of straight track on a piece of redwood or cedar for a display (or hand lay a spur on your layout with some code 55 or 70 rail).
just my experiences
Fred W
So let's say that I want to try to hand lay a turnout, no jigs, no templates.
What do I buy?
Rail?
Ties?
Spikes?
Frog?
What else?
printed circuit board (PC) ties are very helpful
I know you can buy frogs, but they are not hard to make
you probably need a tie jig, which you can also make
gregc printed circuit board (PC) ties are very helpful I know you can buy frogs, but they are not hard to make you probably need a tie jig, which you can also make
Frogs are not hard to make? Hmmm.
A tie jig which you can also make? Hmmm.
I am really tempted to try my hand at hand laying a turnout, but this all sounds difficult for a complete novice.
Hello James.
Unlike many of the above posters I have not been blessed with the micro-engineering skills required for hand laying turnouts. Subsequently I invested in two FastTrack jigs to build all the turnouts for my current layout. I will admit the first was a dud. But I took the lessons from that experience and built all remaining turnouts required for my current layout. In the end I was making a complete turnout in about 45 minutes. All turnouts are very smooth and reliable. Even my most tempermental locomotives negotiate the turnouts without issue.
Talking to another MRR'er in a hobby shop one afternoon I shared my experience with him. He has since borrowed by FT tools to construct several turnouts for his own use. He reciprocates by assisting me with elements of the hobby I struggle with - like scenery. For me the FT tools have been a win-win and then win.
Finally, the article in the current MR mag is a great summary of the lessons I collected those years ago.
Just my opinion and experience.Dwayne A
Even if I'm modeling in Nscale I use Fastrack jigs from a while. Today I have build for me and friends nearly 250 turnouts, both curved and straight.
Like the others the two of three first one I build, were like a scale down damaged turnout.
Whith all these turnouts I am ablle to build in place turnout full handlay whitout jig.
Anyway I want to thanks Tim Warris the maker of these fabulous Fastrack jigs.
Just a suggestion if You are ready to start whith Fastrack jig and buy them.
For straight turnout buy the crossover jig of the frog number you are asking for; why? because whith this same jig you are able to build by example a #6 turnout but also a #6 crossover.
In the tools offer of fastrack there are only two I recommend, the point form tool but buy the one for number #12, whith this one you are able to build point for turnout from number #4 to a number #12. The stockaid tool will help you to file accurate stockrail, but sure you can obtain these shape of rails whith a good file.
Don't use the tie stick offer by fastrack, they are quiet expensive but put wood ties under the turnout.
These are a few Nscale Fastrack turnouts
This is how I put them in place How to put wood ties under the turnout Don't forget I am modeling in Nscale, by the way, it's a tiny scale so the use of Fastrack jig is extremly helpful to build accurate turnout and the tools mentionned are a must in Nscale. One of the greatest asset of these turnouts in Nscale is to see a car rolling through and he didn't move on any side like he is on a straight track.
This is how I put them in place
How to put wood ties under the turnout Don't forget I am modeling in Nscale, by the way, it's a tiny scale so the use of Fastrack jig is extremly helpful to build accurate turnout and the tools mentionned are a must in Nscale. One of the greatest asset of these turnouts in Nscale is to see a car rolling through and he didn't move on any side like he is on a straight track.
How to put wood ties under the turnout
Don't forget I am modeling in Nscale, by the way, it's a tiny scale so the use of Fastrack jig is extremly helpful to build accurate turnout and the tools mentionned are a must in Nscale. One of the greatest asset of these turnouts in Nscale is to see a car rolling through and he didn't move on any side like he is on a straight track.
Don't forget I am modeling in Nscale, by the way, it's a tiny scale so the use of Fastrack jig is extremly helpful to build accurate turnout and the tools mentionned are a must in Nscale.
One of the greatest asset of these turnouts in Nscale is to see a car rolling through and he didn't move on any side like he is on a straight track.
Making some progress on the wye. I have the roadbed nailed down and joint compounded awaiting sanding and painting in the morning and then on the the fun part, hand laying the track and switches. The two curves are 26 radius. Building in HO with code 83 track.
I was taught to handlay track back about 1977 by Paul Jensen at the Schuylkill Valley Model Railroad Club. Code 100 and Code 83 with no jigs. The last time i was back there about 8 years ago some of those switches are still in use.
Since then I have built them in place, I have built them on the bench, I have built them on PC board ties, I have built them on paper templates. I have use hinged points, continuous points, solid throwbars, hingedthrow bars, insulated frogs, non-insulated frogs. I have laid code 100, code 83, and code 70 (I will have some code 55 on the new layout). I have done N scale, HO and HOn3.
Guess what, every method worked.
Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com
The most important ingredient for handlaying track is finding it fun.
I've done it. I'd rather be stewed in my own juices. For me it's nothing but misery.
Disclaimer: This post may contain humor, sarcasm, and/or flatulence.
Michael Mornard
Bringing the North Woods to South Dakota!
I have been working on the first turnout the last couple of days. Thanks to Charlie Comstock's excellent U-tube video on hand laying turnouts with homemade jigs, I finally got started. I built the jig shown in the video and it works just as shown. It took longer for the glue to dry than it took to actually build the jig. Picture of the jig and the first no. 6 frog follow. Started spiking track for this switch this afternoon.
Fast track is great if you want to sit at a workbench and build turnouts. I got a fast track jig with acc. for $50 on e-bay but haven't used it as I was able to buy Shinohara turnouts, NIB for $5 a peice as I was running out, bought all they had for future projects. If you need a turnout that is not normal, you can modify a factory one, learned how to do that buy trying to use a changable curved Shinohara turnout and applied it to regular turnouts (needed a couple of those for a tight lead into a car float area).