In-street trackage?

[Jetrock]

I am having some frustration in building up streets around my tracks--as I have mentioned before, my layout is based on a belt line that ran in the middle of city streets. I have been using the cardboard & styrene method, using cardstock on the outside of the rail and styrene inside. The styrene inside the rail is no problem but the cardstock on the outside constantly scoots upward onto the rail itself, causing derailments and stalling of my locomotives. Any suggestions on how to either tack down the cardstock more securely, or a substitute that won't cause such problems? My curves are 12" radius and I use Peco turnouts so the Walthers street-track system is not suitable for this application...

[BNSFNUT]

I have used styrene between the rails and on the outside of the rails. I have no problems with it shifting. I have used card stock for streets before and have never had very good luck with it as it very unstable. I now use styrene for all my paved streets and roads. I have some street trackage that has been in use for a while and have had no problems. Styrene is more costly but worth the cost for the troubles it saves.

Jerry

[Sperandeo]

We've covered this several times in MODEL RAILROADER, most recently in the March installment of Iain Rice's Roque Bluffs series. I'd also recommend two installments of John Pryke's Union Freight RR series, October 2000 MR, page 64, and November 2000 MR, page 78. Back issues can be ordered from the shopping section of this Web site or by e-mail to [e-mail].

So long,

Andy

[ndbprr]

I've had pretty good luck with plaster. I mix it very thin and it shrinks a little after drying which takes it slightly below rail head level. It can then be carved like brick or painted for asphalt or concrete.

[bsteel4065]

I use Artex. I don't know what it's called in the States but in the UK it's the stuff you use to plaster ceilings and walls, especially for a textured patterned effect. It's flexible, crack resistant and doesn't shrink like plaster.

[Anonymous]

I would think the best method is to use the same material both inside and outside the rails. Plastic seems the easiest material to work and finish. In any event if you haven't yet made a template for the curves you might want to make one. Will certainly save time in the long run and result in a more even result.

If you decide to go with a pourable material I am a big fan of "tape and joint compound".
TIme consuming and messy to work with but yields great results.

Good Luck

Randy

[Jetrock]

I think I'll give styrene a try--in fact, since the photos I have of the prototype mostly show a distinctly different type of concrete in the middle of the street (from a track upgrade in the mid-forties) it wouldn't be too far off the mark to cut out some of the already-laid cardstock and put styrene in its place. The cardstock is pretty good material for streets without tracks in 'em.

I was hoping to avoid the expense of so many sheets of styrene but I figure in the long run it will be more stable...thanks for the tips!

Haven't picked up the March MR yet--but now I'll be sure to grab it.

[EMDSD40]

try out asphalt roofing shingles. can be cut to any size or shape, nailed down easily with HO track nails. looks like black asphalt, lines can be drawn with grease pencil or painted on. parking lots no problem. let it collect a little dust and it looks great. turn it over and you can paint it with flat gray- black or whatever. naturally curves up to grade crossing height if you use cork roadbed. comes in various shades and textures. it's alot of roadway for the buck. i used one "square" on my layout and it's been down for years the possibilities are endless..GOOD LUCK

[Jetrock]

The only problem is that I'm not doing grade crossings per se--the tracks on my layout run in the middle of city streets, which were at the time primarily poured concrete. It was originally an interurban electric line--only a small percentage of the track on my layout features visible ties.

[jrbarney]

Jetrock,
Arizona Rock & Mineral Co. lists a #1290 Concrete Paving Material at their site, noting that it is a dry color powder. They also list an Asphalt Paving Material. I don't know if either item is a proprietary product, or just repackaging of one of the materials suggested by others. I have not used or seen them. Having noted all my caveats, you still might want to visit their site at:
http://rrscenery.com
and determine if there is a Stocking Dealer near you.
Bob
NMRA Life 0543

[Anonymous]

To fix the cardboard that has riser (presumably because the paint made it cockle) you could push a track pin through the cardboard and sleepers (use a drill maybe) to hold the cardboard down. Then paint the top of the pin and a patch of the cardboard around it up to the rail black or very dark grey.

Then it will look like an asphalt patch that they had to put on a lot because the rail moved in the heat and under trains and cracked the concrete so the used ashpalt, which is flexible, to patch the holes.

I hope that helps.
Neil

BTW this was from John Prykes' book or urban scenery.[:D]

[Anonymous]

On possible solution would be to fix L-section brass to the ties inside the running rails - this would form the flangeways. Push string between the rail and the brass to stop plaster from getting into the flangeway and then pour plaster around to create the surface. After you're satisfied with the colour and depth of the plaster, and have smoothed it off, pull the string out Saw this idea recently in a magazine - might have been Model Rail. Not tried it myself, but as I've recently bought a Bachmann trolley car I'll probably have to soon!

[bcammack]

"For Sale" signs from Wal-Mart are a pretty cheap source of sheet styrene if you don't mind having to paint whatever you make from them.

[Jetrock]

I actually already tried the track-nail/concrete patch to nail down some of the cardstock--the problem is that it is buckling and expanding in many places, rather than just a few spots. I've started cutting out some of the cardstock near the track (leaving a few bits of more cooperative card) in preparation for the plastic.

I really, really don't want to pour plaster all over my track. For starters, I want to be able to replace track and switch machines without having to crack into plaster or other cast material. For all its faults, cardstock is fairly forgiving and easy to rip up--which I had to do today, as it turns out that my trackpin fix (menitoned above) inadvertently pulled out a feeder wire. I was able to do some street excavation with an X-Acto knife, solder the feeder wire back into place, and stick a small patch of .020" styrene over the hole with minimal fuss. If that feeder had been buried under plaster, I can envision nightmari***hings...

Incidentally, I did stumble across a Walthers in-street track kit for considerably less than retail at a train show this weekend, so I picked it up (along with a concrete "street system" for $2, and "Ma's Place" for a quarter!!) and tried it out. Sure enough, the curves are not sharp enough and the switch pieces, intended for Atlas switch machines, don't fit my Peco switches--but they do provide ideas for how to fabricate my own, and the straight sections are usable. The fact that they're made for Code 83 track is fine with me, even though I use Code 100 track--it provides just a touch more margin of error for easy track cleaning with a Bright Boy or pencil eraser. I can live with a .017" gap, and if someone notices and criticizes it, I figure the punch method will help (I punch them in the nose, then they're too busy trying to stanch the bleeding to criticize my modeling!)

[Anonymous]

Jetrock:

I just got my copy of the March 2003 MR. The Roque Bluffs layout article, center column p. 63, has two paragraphs on making and maintaining 'concrete and blacktop paving'. You might want to scan it for technique hints?

Randy

[Jetrock]

I did...I remain pretty unimpressed with cardstock. A hot glue gun isn't a bad idea for sticking the darn stuff down, if I ever want to try cardstock again.

The problem is that I am ***NOT*** just making a grade crossing that will cover the tracks at one point--pretty much THE ENTIRE MAINLINE RUNS DOWN THE MIDDLE OF A STREET. This means that instead of just having a few inches of paving interfacing with the track, it must cover all track, including switches, from one end of the layout to the other. Because of this, any sort of plaster or other paste-that-dries mixture is NOT acceptable because my turnouts would suddenly stop working as soon as the stuff hardened. Plus, as mentioned above, I don't want to permanently bury every rail connector and power feed in plaster or what have you--a styrene concrete "slab" can be popped off and stuck back down.

A template for curves wouldn't really work because I'm using flextrack and each curve is slightly compounded in the middle (it is sharpest in the center and more gradual at each end) to better allow the track to curve sharply through city streets, and therefore each curve has its own unique radius. I am making templates for the switches, though, as they are a standard size.

[jrbarney]

Jetrock,
What's wrong, other than the extra effort, with making a custom template for the styrene for each curve ? You know, put paper on the track, then rub with the side of a pencil lead - the way some folks copy tombstones or brasses. If you don't cut to the line, you could then do a fit and trim until the piece fitted the way you want it.
Bob
NMRA Life 0543

[Jetrock]

Okay, I think the difference here is terminology--that is exactly the technique I'm using to make the plastic curve sections. I just call it a pattern--since it's a one-time-use thing. But I guess it's a template as well. The switches, which are standard, I'm making reusable templates for out of thicker styrene (as recommended in the Kalmbach book whence I got the idea of using styrene in the first place.)

[CBQ_Guy]

Hi,

Just discovered this site last night which may be helpful to you and others:

http://www.proto87.com/p87stores/strass1.htm

[Anonymous]

I, too, have found it necessary to create a good bit of street trackage on my HO layout to accomodate a long trolley line. After trial and error with different methods that didn't work for me, I found that strips of cork track roadbed, set with white glue and butted very tightly together prvides a very acceptable solution. By alternating the long sides of the beveled pieces of the roadbed, you can make a street of almost any width and length without discernible gaps. The thickness of the roadbed is just right to match the height of the rails. Also, any type of curve can be made because the stuff is very flexible. It is also easy to temporarily remove for track repairs, and takes just about any kind of paint. To finish off the center area between the rails, I use a simple piece of white cardstock fastened with white glue and then painted to match the roadway. The end result looks very much like a real city street with trackage. It's not real cheap if you're doing a lot of it, but it beats plaster, and other crubly materials. Have a look at mine and see what you think.

John Wolfskill
The Metro-Valley Lines
http://www.trainweb.org/metrovalleyline/index.html

[Jetrock]

CBQ_guy: Seen it--it's interesting but I'mnot sure if my RP-25 wheelsets would work in those flanges. Rails I've got--it's the stuff around 'em I'm working on. Besides, that stuff is expensive--I'd rather do a little more work for a little less money. It also seems more suited to trolley use--my line is a freight belt line that used electric and diesel freight motors.

But when it comes time to do the downtown trolley line, I'll probably use either that stuff or Orr girder rail...

jdwolfskill: Intriguing indeed...that is a technique I haven't seen before! I've got some of the WS foam roadbed, I may have to see how that does...since I only have to cover the bits within 1/2" or so around the track, that mgiht be enough to do the trick--if it doesn't work right I'll try the cork. Thanks!!

[Jetrock]

whoa!

Not bad. Not bad at all.

It's not perfect--you can kind of see the track in the gap between the edge of the foam and the rail, and it actually comes out a bit higher than the rail level up against Code 100 track--but it's fast, it's easy, it looks all right, and, best of all, even though it comes up to higher than rail level, it doesn't derail cars!

Time to head to the store and get some more of this stuff...this will save a LOT of time and seems to be a pretty decent solution for what I am doing. Once I get around to the "pretty" downtown trackage I'll probably spring for girder rail, but for the grotty industrial poorly-maintained street tracks I'm currently working on, this is a pretty darn good choice...you can even scoot the foam back a bit to clean the rails!

Thanks!!!

[robengland]

Just a note re styrene being an expensive solution: it is if you buy it from model and hobby shops. I buy it from a sheet plastics distributor in 3' x 4' sheets for less than US$10

[robengland]

Just a note re styrene being an expensive solution: it is if you buy it from model and hobby shops. I buy it from a sheet plastics distributor in 3' x 4' sheets for less than US$10

[Jetrock]

Is it available in .020" thickness?