Inspired by reading Space Mouse's Beginners guide, I know I am also going to make tons of beginners mistakes as I get into the hobby.
So what are my challenges / mistakes in my current 5x9 (ping-pong) table layout? This should only be about 10 pages or so...
I used every piece of track I owned when I took these shots but have straighted out some of the branches since then.
I am only messing around right now but it is fun to break down and rearrange track when I ever my newborn gives me a chance. Daddy needs a break every now and then.
Other then some rather obvious "S" turn issues (which you alluded to already) I don't see any reason that this couldn't serve as the basis for a fine beginners RR, provided you can reach everything on that big table without crushing foreground scenery.
I would suggest that the center branch could even be slightly elevated to introduce some visual interest. Even and inch or two would do wonders to add realism and draw the eye away from the fact that this is really a simple loop plan (not that there's anything wrong with that). It would also make the layout seem larger. One last thing.....I don't know if you'll have room to do it or not (you might have to remove a couple of straight sections from the end curves to do this), but I'd at least look at skewing the plan slightly on the table. Again, this makes the plan look larger as the eye has a tendency to automatically try to figure out sizes of objects with straight lines (like table edges) and not having tracks running parallel to the edges tends to cause the eye not to do that, and therefore your layout looks bigger.
Overall, good plan that has a lot of potential!
Looks like you have a good start
If it were mine i'd run a skyboard right down the middle of the layout
so the trains would disappear and not seem to be chasing their own tail
TerryinTexas
See my Web Site Here
http://conewriversubdivision.yolasite.com/
pcarrell wrote: Other then some rather obvious "S" turn issues (which you alluded to already) I don't see any reason that this couldn't serve as the basis for a fine beginners RR, provided you can reach everything on that big table without crushing foreground scenery. I would suggest that the center branch could even be slightly elevated to introduce some visual interest. Even and inch or two would do wonders to add realism and draw the eye away from the fact that this is really a simple loop plan (not that there's anything wrong with that). It would also make the layout seem larger. One last thing.....I don't know if you'll have room to do it or not (you might have to remove a couple of straight sections from the end curves to do this), but I'd at least look at skewing the plan slightly on the table. Again, this makes the plan look larger as the eye has a tendency to automatically try to figure out sizes of objects with straight lines (like table edges) and not having tracks running parallel to the edges tends to cause the eye not to do that, and therefore your layout looks bigger.Overall, good plan that has a lot of potential!
Thank you for the feedback. I have recently been visualizing this as an actual track plan more and more. Raising the middle has been one of those thoughts. It would serve three purposes for me. One seperate areas of interest. I was thinking of actually making it more of a yard area in that space. Two with the rased area I could create a tunnel hidding one of the loops onto the mainline. Three with it being raised I could create a bridge, over the mainline loop, from the yard that could go to future expansion / staging / ect to bring trains into the yard.
I don't know how that all just popped into my head. I wonder if I could grade that correctly coming out of the yard around that first turn?
Ed
Hi. I like the idea of using that Ping-pong table to get a good big space. There's a lot of stuff you can do on it.
The trains will get trapped in the big centre area and have to back out... That's a lot of curved track to push backward on. I suspect there will be a bunch of derailments deep inside the layout because of this. Is the any way to get a crossing or a reversing loop? Then you can have trains run in either direction. Glad you've rethunk some of the wiggles in the interior; anywhere you want to do (un)coupling moves should be pretty-well straight for a couple of carlengths.
I think by "skyboard", he means a sky coloured view block so some of the rails can disappear from view. A tunnel is also a good possibility.. popular with the kids to see a train pop into view! As I said, your possibilities are endless. Enjoy the planning and the doing. Keep us all posted on what you get up to. It's a great pastime.
Have fun... George
Yeah, the "skyboard" is basically a verticle viewblock painted sky color to visually seperate the layout into two (usually, though it could be more) sections or sides. It will break up the roundy-round look, and again, make the layout seem bigger. A good suggestion!
As for the yard, I'm not sure if you have the room to do it properly.....you might. You'd need a pretty good lead, and that eats up a lot of space. Proper yards are space hogs, even little ones. Check this out to see what I mean: http://ldsig.org/wiki/index.php/Yards--freight_and_passenger
I'm also not sure you could get one track up high enough to cross over the other in that space without making the grade too steep. You'd have to experiment with that. Maybe you could split the grade by having one track go down while the other goes up? And remember, grades on a curve (like yours would probably be) are even tougher to climb (they add even more resistance). This might help in figuring grades: http://urbaneagle.com/data/RRgrades.html
Lastly, remember, sidings and yards need to be flat (not on a grade) so the cars don't roll away. That means you'll have to add trasitions before any grades and transtions after them too. A grade can eat up a lot of space! Thats why I was thinking only a inch or two of total rise would be good for this space.
Well I wanted to visualize some more what raising the middle section would do for this configuration.
I like it but this grading thing is definetly tricky. I think with the right material and I can pull this effect off.
Currently my DC engine can get up and down no problem. Put three cars behind it and... like you guys have said, not pretty. I tried my DCC engines in a 2 engine set up and thought they were going to make it but they lost their juice bending that first curve. Seemed like they needed more power, they were not losing traction. Noticed that with the DC engine also.
I really like the idea of splitting the grade. I can then bring down the middle some and cut down that grade around the curve, while also raising the branch to build a bridge over the mainline to stage/future expansion.
I also noticed by raising up the middle I probably could get myself some more space to try to put in that (very) small yard, by building, on top of the proposed tunnel on the other end.
I'll have to check out a kit like Woodlawn. That would be a great way to play with elevation changes before commiting to anything.
Also is looks like the road crew was busy for a bit before work this morning. I regraded. Dropped the end of the line a good inch plus and success. The first succesful accent of mount Ed. Still needs more fine tuning of course.
Looks better than just flat and round and round
Here's a photo of a sky board Its just a simple pice of Hardboard painted blue
Smooth on both sides sometimes called Masonite
You could put a city scene on one side and a country
scene on the other
you can get scenes from companys like Instant Horizons
http://www.hobbylinc.com/htm/wra/wra701.htm
There are lots of other background scenes on the web if you do a search
Terry, I've seen your work before. That skyboard is the right idea, but was that one an experiment or something? You do better work then that!
Naxos, lowering that track would probably be a good thing. It'll be easier on the loco's, and you'd be suprised at how much even just a little verticle seperation will define a scene. Don't forget also that you need to have some transitions to and from the grades back to level. The minimum for that is usually a car length (longest car), but longer is better.
pcarrell wrote: Terry, I've seen your work before. That skyboard is the right idea, but was that one an experiment or something? You do better work then that!
LOL
Yes that was a paint test
i bet i went thru 6 different shades of blue before i found one i liked
Naxos --
From your pictures, it doesn't look like any track is actually crossing over any other part of your track, so you wouldn't have a vertical clearance issue which would force you into a certain elevation. It's all about asthetics.
I'm currently in the process of re-doing my entire layout because I had a couple of crossovers that forced me into a 3.5% grade. I eventually got tired of dealing with the random uncouplings and stalled locos that this caused (Murphy's law dictates that the loco you use to test the slope will turn out to be the only one that can actually climb it!). Now I have a gentle 1.5% gradient leading to an elevation of about 2", rather than the 5" I was trying to achieve before.
While you can buy expensive tools to define your grade, I've had success with cutting a 3' piece of 1x3 lumber to the desired gradient. Then all you have to do is lay this on your slope in the opposite direction of your slope and put a level on the top. When the top is level, you have achieved the desired grade.
Also, you might want to drop down to your local building supply store and get a piece of 1" foam insulating board (the pink or blue stuff they put in the walls of new houses). Because this stuff isn't made of those tiny beads, it shapes much more easily (with a knife, a rasp, or sand paper) than the styrofoam packing material you appear to be using. A 1" x 2' x 8' piece only costs about $10.
Connecticut Valley Railroad A Branch of the New York, New Haven, and Hartford
"If you think you can do a thing or think you can't do a thing, you're right." -- Henry Ford
CTValleyRR wrote: Naxos --From your pictures, it doesn't look like any track is actually crossing over any other part of your track, so you wouldn't have a vertical clearance issue which would force you into a certain elevation. It's all about asthetics.I'm currently in the process of re-doing my entire layout because I had a couple of crossovers that forced me into a 3.5% grade. I eventually got tired of dealing with the random uncouplings and stalled locos that this caused (Murphy's law dictates that the loco you use to test the slope will turn out to be the only one that can actually climb it!). Now I have a gentle 1.5% gradient leading to an elevation of about 2", rather than the 5" I was trying to achieve before.While you can buy expensive tools to define your grade, I've had success with cutting a 3' piece of 1x3 lumber to the desired gradient. Then all you have to do is lay this on your slope in the opposite direction of your slope and put a level on the top. When the top is level, you have achieved the desired grade.Also, you might want to drop down to your local building supply store and get a piece of 1" foam insulating board (the pink or blue stuff they put in the walls of new houses). Because this stuff isn't made of those tiny beads, it shapes much more easily (with a knife, a rasp, or sand paper) than the styrofoam packing material you appear to be using. A 1" x 2' x 8' piece only costs about $10.
Nope no tracks are crossing yet, but if this experiment works out then I did plan on adding at least one elevated crossing to support future expansion.
I definetly am going to try refine this grading and try to get it as low as possible. I might pick up some foam board this weekend (mabey sooner). At the very least I need to start working on the foam vice the table top.
As to the stryofoam, it was cheap (free). I cleaned out my basment last weekend and instead of tossing the stuff in the trash figured I would keep it around just for messing around like this. I definetly need a better method of cutting it than my razor blade.
Uh oh, I got my hands on some new tools.
Got a cross over now. I am deciding on bridging options right now. Some day mabey this could go to the rest of my layout. Right now it will be to a danger bridge out sign.