Gravel Glue

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Posted by dwbeckett on Thursday, March 11, 2010 8:21 AM

I will check out my LRS I think i remember seeing a stabilizer their last year Hopfully they sell smaller quanity since I only need  55 lbs of fine's  Yes I have 1/4inch screen to catch the 3/8 inch bolders. Tom,Thanks for the info. I was also wondering if any of the other suggestion were used and still work. 

 

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Posted by ttrigg on Thursday, March 11, 2010 12:47 PM

Dave: there are many other ways of doing the job. I’ve tried most of them, white glue, TB II, TB III, cement, mortar, silicone, etc. Some of them washed away, others just broke up in big chunks. "Stabilizer" is the only RE-USEABLE one I’ve found. If it breaks up, just tamp it back down and spray on some water – job done! Want to reroute that section of track? Spread a plastic sheet on the ground, pick up the rail, drop the rail on the plastic sheet, 85%-95% of the gravel will fall off. Re-lay the track to the new right-of-way. Collect the "old glued" gravel, put into 5-gallon bucket, put a plaster mixing bit (SUPER large paint mix blade) on your half inch drill and stir it up, totally brakes up in about 90 seconds. Spread the reclaimed gravel, tamp it down, wet it down, - job done – and BEST PART = NO NEW COST!!!!

Tom Trigg

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Posted by dwbeckett on Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:24 PM
ttrigg

"Stabilizer" is the only RE-USEABLE one I’ve found. If it breaks up, just tamp it back down and spray on some water – job done!  Collect the "old glued" gravel, put into 5-gallon bucket, put a plaster mixing bit (SUPER large paint mix blade) on your half inch drill and stir it up, totally brakes up in about 90 seconds. Spread the reclaimed gravel, tamp it down, wet it down, - job done – and BEST PART = NO NEW COST!!!!

OK the the NO NEW COST part sold Me. I have the tools and a 3/4 stick Just need to buy the stabilizer and 1 ton of 1/4 Bule minus 9 1/2 TON @ A time.......

Dave

 

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Posted by smcgill on Thursday, March 11, 2010 8:04 PM

Funny that this just resurfaced!  Wink

I was mixing up some.

I was using .34 grams to 1 lbs.

I just filled the bucket and put it on the scale,

.34 x lbs = ??grams   easy  !

The part I set up in the fall lasted O.K. it will need some touch up though.

Sean

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Posted by dwbeckett on Friday, March 12, 2010 11:48 AM

Ok it look's like it's 1 Gram to 3 Lbs of rock, Anyone know where to get a 1 gram scoop???

 

 

 

Ok any Idea's how much use without gram scale like 1 Tsp 1Tblsp 1/2 cup???

Dave

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Posted by DennisB on Friday, March 12, 2010 1:21 PM

 It is a bonding liguid made for concrete. Dupont makes an Acrylic Top Bond. You mix it with equal parts water and Top Bond. I use a cheap Turkey Baster to apply it. Later on if you want to break it up, pick up the stone that is still bonded and place in a large container full of water. The water will eventually break it up. Heavy rains will do the same. Good idea to reapply in areas where you see it weakening. Regards, Dennis.

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Posted by dwbeckett on Friday, March 12, 2010 2:58 PM

kc heritage

 It is a bonding liguid made for concrete. Dupont makes an Acrylic Top Bond. You mix it with equal parts water and Top Bond. I use a cheap Turkey Baster to apply it. Later on if you want to break it up, pick up the stone that is still bonded and place in a large container full of water. The water will eventually break it up. Heavy rains will do the same. Good idea to reapply in areas where you see it weakening. Regards, Dennis.

KC, My problem is Heavy Rains. And what Tom and Sean are using seems to be what I need since I will be laying 2 ton's of rock in my back and side yard's mostly for weed control.

Dave

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Posted by smcgill on Friday, March 12, 2010 4:46 PM

Found a nice little scale @ IKEA !!

Small / round and does grams.

Found in kitchen area!

Sean

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Posted by dwbeckett on Saturday, March 13, 2010 1:31 PM

I  just came back from my local rock shop, No luck on Stablizer all they had was Polymetic stone @ $24 a fifty lb bag. It's a premix soooo I passed on that one. time to go farther out of my local area. I am keeping it in mined just in case I only do my track only need 2 bags.

Dave

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Posted by smcgill on Saturday, March 13, 2010 3:30 PM

Dave I found Tina to be very helpfull.

You could just calll!!    Whistling

"Stabilizer" as manufactured by Stabilizer Solutions, Inc., Phoenix, Arizona (1-800-336-2468)."

They can tell you who in you're area sells it.

Good luck.

Sean

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Posted by dwbeckett on Saturday, March 13, 2010 6:14 PM

Thank's, Will call monday AM.Zzzzzzzzz

Dave

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Posted by dwbeckett on Tuesday, March 16, 2010 3:40 PM

I found a distrubitor willing too ship ( USPS ) me 5lbs @ $3.50 lb plus postage. More then I need but way less then 10lb.

More Info on product:: its power the consistancy of flower. will not liquifi when mixed with water - can not mix with water and pour or spay on.  must be mixed with rock before wetting. USE A DUST MASK WHEN MIXING/USING . Seams as though this stuff will glue your lungs toghter IF you sniff the dust.

DaveTongue

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Posted by smcgill on Tuesday, March 16, 2010 4:16 PM

Dave

I put it an old joint compoud bucket.

When I mix it, I only use 1/2 the bucket.

I also just fill the bucket 1/2 way when weighting it.

I snap the lid closed , roll it, shake it.with the lid closed.

On another note : New England just got 8' to 9' of rain it a couple of days , and I had just installed some mix  and it is still there!! It was at the crest of a hill .

Cool!!  Good luck Dave!!

Sean

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Posted by ttrigg on Tuesday, March 16, 2010 8:38 PM

Dave: On the few times I’ve needed to mix it myself, I fill the bucket about half way and put a plaster paddle on the old drill (think paint mixing tool on a drill but MUCH LARGER). After about 3 minutes everything is muxed up just fine.

Tom Trigg

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Posted by dwbeckett on Wednesday, March 17, 2010 1:14 PM

Thanks for extra info, I was concerened about product safty since I have bad lung's.

Dave

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Posted by smcgill on Thursday, March 25, 2010 6:12 PM

 

Dave 

So have you got the " stuff " yet?

We want to know how you like it!

Sean

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Posted by dwbeckett on Friday, March 26, 2010 11:51 AM

Not Yet seams to be a problem with money for my trains. that should clear up next mounth.

Dave

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Posted by smcgill on Wednesday, April 21, 2010 8:04 PM

O.K. Dave Whistling

 

As Marty would ask  (  Is it done yet? )

Sean

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Posted by dwbeckett on Thursday, April 22, 2010 7:21 AM

No Not yet, still raining, still leveling, still reinstalling switchs, still back filling, still need money for everthing, still .........

Dave

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Posted by jhsimpson62 on Tuesday, April 27, 2010 7:02 AM

I have finally started reballasting my track using the "Stablizer" received in September. Mixing it in 10 lb batches with 1 oz of stablizer. First thing I noticed was after completing a section, I hadn't allowed for the sticky residue which coated the rails. This didn't conduct electricty and coated the wheels of the engines. Cleaned off with a scotch brite and water. Next section I wiped the rail after watering in which eliminated the problem. Real suprise was when after a hard rain, The residue build up was back again and had to cleaned off. Contacted manufactorer and confirmed the mixture ratio of 15 lbs to 1 ton. Seems to think cause maybe either, Too much dust not enough aggregate, not enough water to completely set the stablizer, or not compactedd enough "after watering in". Outer loop is completed so will try compacting after watering when starting the inner loop. Trigg, thanks for reminder of continuing the discussion on this forum. Jack.

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Posted by ttrigg on Tuesday, April 27, 2010 10:24 PM

Jack: I’ve never had this problem you describe. Yes I had some "dusting" as I applied the crusher fines, but that disappeared as I "watered-in" the ballast. I’ve not experienced any "after installation" dusting. If I had to guess, I would say you used too much "Stabilizer". Then again that is just a guess. I’ve never seen or heard of the Stabilizer weeping up the rail to contaminate the wheel sets. As far as "tamping" goes, what I’ve done is take a small palm sander with cardboard and old towel in place of the sandpaper. This vibrates the rails – ties – ballast into place. Sometimes I don’t even do that, just sprinkle the fines into place and wet down.

jhsimpson62
thanks for reminder of continuing the discussion on this forum. Jack.

Sorry if I said it wrong, I don’t mind the e-mail, but using the "PM" system here allows for a "linked" back and forth discussion. Since the gray hair has moved from the top of the head to the inside the brain, I need a (not so) gentle reminder of what we are talking about.

 

Tom Trigg

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Posted by jhsimpson62 on Wednesday, April 28, 2010 5:52 AM

Thanks Trigg. I have decided to hold off on the second loop of track till returning from a trip north in June. I'll bring back some crusher fines from up there and try it. They have much less dust and more stone. Never have been crazy with what is available down here. Meanwhile I'll watch how the section finished works out with time. Jack

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Posted by smcgill on Friday, April 30, 2010 4:08 PM

 Mixing it in 10 lb batches with 1 oz of stablizer

I mix it @ .34oz to 1lb   exmp.  22lbs = 7.48oz of stablizer.

Sean

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Posted by mgilger on Friday, April 30, 2010 10:38 PM

 

Home Depot or Lowes sells several different brands. They come in a 1 gallon jug. I did up a 50/50 mix with water to hold the ballast on a new addition and it seems to be doing a good job. It's hard to the touch, but if you exert a little pressure, it will break apart. It's gone through several very heavy rain storms and not a stone out of place.

 At my Home Depot, it was about $12 a gallon.

Mark

 

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Posted by mgilger on Tuesday, May 04, 2010 11:00 PM
I have done some testing with Tightbond III glue.  This time around I mixed it with an equal part water and tinted it with black hobby type water based paint until it was a dark charcoal color. I then put it in a good quality spray bottle and sprayed a liberal amount on my roadbed. After about 2 hours it had completely hardened. I tested it against the Concrete Bonder brand I referenced above. The TitetBond III mixer was the hand down winner. Both product created a hard surface, but the concrete bonder was much easier to break through. The above test was done in an area of maybe 2 feet, just for testing. I plan on picking up a gallon jug at my local ACE hardware store and do a test on a much larger scale. I'm feeling good with the results I've seen so far.

Regards,

Mark

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Posted by dmikee on Wednesday, May 12, 2010 9:32 PM

Possibly a cheaper solution: buy polymer sand in 60 lb sack for about $20 at Home Depot. Mix it with your selected ballast material. When done ballasting, just wet it gently with a sprinkler mist. It will naturally harden and bind the ballast material but will still break up under tension and track movement. It is commonly used as the primary underlay for paving stones.

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Posted by mgilger on Friday, May 21, 2010 10:07 PM

Well I have good news, and bad news.

We have had a lot "Lot" of rain in the last several weeks since I posted the two previous post. The bad news is that the Concrete bonder is no longer effective. The roadbed (Chicken Grit) that it was used, shows no sign that the Concrete bonder was even applied.  The good news is the Titebond III roadbed is still as hard as it was when I applied it. It's very hard to the touch, almost like a light cememt coating was holding everything togeather. Not so much I could walk on it, but I'm sure if my dog or cat stepped on it, they would not dent it. A freind has indicated that UV might effect it, so I will have to monitor it's condition through the summer to see if this is going to be a long term fix, or not.

So far, so good and I'm about ready to apply some more to different area's.

I have searched all the local stores trying to find it in a gallon jug. The only place that seems to stock it is at Lowes. Home Depot and ACE only stock the TBII, not the III.

More later......

Mark

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Posted by fiatfan on Wednesday, September 21, 2011 9:16 PM

mgilger

Well I have good news, and bad news.

We have had a lot "Lot" of rain in the last several weeks since I posted the two previous post. The bad news is that the Concrete bonder is no longer effective. The roadbed (Chicken Grit) that it was used, shows no sign that the Concrete bonder was even applied.  The good news is the Titebond III roadbed is still as hard as it was when I applied it. It's very hard to the touch, almost like a light cememt coating was holding everything togeather. Not so much I could walk on it, but I'm sure if my dog or cat stepped on it, they would not dent it. A freind has indicated that UV might effect it, so I will have to monitor it's condition through the summer to see if this is going to be a long term fix, or not.

So far, so good and I'm about ready to apply some more to different area's.

I have searched all the local stores trying to find it in a gallon jug. The only place that seems to stock it is at Lowes. Home Depot and ACE only stock the TBII, not the III.

More later......

Mark

Hi, Mark.

I'm just getting to the ballasting phase and am wondering if you have a further update on the TBIII.

 

Tom

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Posted by smcgill on Thursday, September 22, 2011 7:16 PM

Not happy with the stablizer.Crying

Washed a way except under the tyes!

The TyteBond III worked ok, now I'm trying portland cement added to the stone dust.

Oh well it is some thing to do on the layout.

Sean

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Posted by JDow on Sunday, July 02, 2017 10:57 PM
Hi Tom, I live in North San Diego County. Tried ballast method (but no stabilizer) but track seems to always elevate out of ballast requiring more, and more, and more. What am I doing wrong? Do you attache the track in any way except the ballast?

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