Gravel Glue

[Optisailorusa]

I have heard from people that some people make stuff that hardens you gravel into place when wetted and is still breakable and reuseable. Does anyone else know about this stuff? Where would I be able to get it?

Thanks

[DennisB]

You are looking for Dupont Acrylic Top Bond for concrete.  Mix it one part water to one part bonding agent  Spread is with a turkey baster between the rails. Being water based it does not last all that long and that's a good thing. You don't want anything all that permanent. Hope this helps. Regards, Dennis.

[ttrigg]

 

Opti.:  Yes I've heard of it and I use it.  I do not know the correct name, it is a polymer that is added to my crusher fines at my local rock shop. By "Rock Shop" I am talking about KRC Rock, all they sell is rock, anything from crusher fines by the 5 pound bag, to those 12~15 foot landscaping rocks, or should I say ROCKS!  Not knowing your location I'm not able to give you any better idea of where to go.  The "binding polymer" is used for crushed rock walkways and patios. It works exactly as you described.  It is advertised as having the ability that if the walking path (driveway) chips or breaks, just crush it up, tamp it into position, wet it down and all is well.  I've got some that has been in the GRR now for 5 years and it is still doing fine.

Unlike cement based products which are single use, hard binding products. The polymer is a soft binding agent, hard enough to walk on, but soft enough to crush with your finger tips.  If a cement binder breaks you need to toss it out and start over, the binding polymer just needs to be crushed and rewetted to use again.

[ttrigg]

 

It is also weed proof.  I've seen weed seeds that sprout and the roots not be able to penetrate to the soil underneath (about one inch thickness) and the weed seed just die of starvation.  Seeds underneath the product will break through the surface, thus causing the need to do a patch job.

[Optisailorusa]

I am looking still and you are describing exactly what I want but I have found no source or real name. I am in the Pacific Northwest Area so if you know of any shops that would be great!

Thanks

 

[ttrigg]

I live down in San Diego, I do not know where you need to go. Look in your local yellow pages (paper or electronic) for "Garden Stones Supply".

[smcgill]

Tom You're a teeze-------can you call them and ask the brand name? I'm using Tytebond III now any I would try it if I knew what it was. I'm from New England and would like to see if they sell it here. Sean

[ttrigg]

smcgill

Tom You're a teeze-------can you call them and ask the brand name? I'm using Tytebond III now any I would try it if I knew what it was. I'm from New England and would like to see if they sell it here. Sean

I called, they call it "STABILIZER".

I went to their web site and found this paragraph. Hope it helps.

"Aggregate binder shall be a natural, non-toxic, non-staining, odorless, environmentally safe powder consisting of 95% Psyllium with 70% Mucilliod content. The powder shall be of a size not more than 10% retained on an U.S. Standard #40 Mesh Sieve. The powder binder shall be "Stabilizer" as manufactured by Stabilizer Solutions, Inc., Phoenix, Arizona (1-800-336-2468)."

[ttrigg]

OK Guys: I did some more research. Seems as though this stuff is continuously called "'Stabilizer' by Stabilizer Solutions, Inc." It is a prime additive for Decomposed Granite driveways. I would again suggest you contact your local rock shop, and your local specialty driveway installers.

If you want more info go here:

http://www.stabilizersolutions.com/technology/view/1-stabilizerr

They call it Stabilizer®

[ttrigg]

 

If you are willing to give them your email and snail mail address they will send a sample.

About the only thing left for me to do now would be to drive there and pick some up for you.  No, don't even ask, I'm not driving that far for anyone.  (lol)  I did ask them if they are willing to sell packages over teh internet.  Don't expect any answer until Tuesday, as this a holiday weekend.

[smcgill]

Thanks for the stable answer!! I'll have to look around. Thanks Sean

[smcgill]

Found it on the web, and am in contact e-mail with them ?

[smcgill]

They did send me an address in my area. I just have to get there. Sean

[pimanjc]

Optisailorusa

I have heard from people that some people make stuff that hardens you gravel into place when wetted and is still breakable and reuseable. Does anyone else know about this stuff? Where would I be able to get it?

Thanks

I have used Weldbond [original] Contact Cement.   It is basically a rubber cement which runs down into the spaces between the gravel and form a slightly flexable durable bond.  The Contact cement is UV protected.   It has been in place on my layout for about four years and is still doing its job.

jimC.

[jhsimpson62]

Have just received a small package (10 lbs) of Stablizer via UPS. Haven't gotten to try it yet due to the weather and some other projects going on. I called the company in AZ and was told the mixture rate was 15 lbs to 1 ton. Its going to take some math to get the mixture right, but hopefully the stuff will do the job. After completing a reballast of almost 500 ft of track, the heavy rains hit and washed about half of that away. I'm getting too old to be crawling around on my knees. Will keep you informed on how the Stablizer works. Jack

[Optisailorusa]

That would be awesome if you could keep me updated!

Thanks

[ttrigg]

jhsimpson62

mixture rate was 15 lbs to 1 ton.

That’s something in the neighborhood of 0.34 grams of stabilizer to a pound of fines.  One pound of crusher fines will ballast about 5 foot of rail.  Sounds like you have enough to last a lifetime.

[jhsimpson62]

Tom, That sounds about right for ratio. I haven't looked in the bag yet, but it must be some really fine power. We had some real heavy rains last week and I have a few places which will be attacked first. Jack

[ttrigg]

Remember to mix it dry, spread and tamp into position, then sprinkle with water to activate the stabilizer.  When I work a new section, I use a 1/2x1/2 stick as a tamping rod.  I fill the fines to about half the height of the rails, tamp it down, then sweep the extra into the next section to work. After everything is tamped into position, I fill a watering can and gently add the water.  Half gallon of water is enough for 5~8 foot of rails. 

[ttrigg]

MIXING:  You are going to need to ensure a good thorough mix.  At my “rock shop” they use a small cement mixer and let it run for ten minutes for each load.  You might consider getting a small rubber mixing barrel at Home Depot.  The ones I’ve seen look like a five-gallon water cooler without the spigot. Mount a set of 4 wheels to support the barrel and then just spin it in place. 

 

[jhsimpson62]

Tom, Thanks for the hints on mixing and laying the ballast and stablizer. Your method of ballasting sounds just like I've been doing (without the stablizer). My biggest concern is in getting the crusher fines dried out enough to get a good mix. Not a big deal, its just going to take time. Jack

[smcgill]

I was told to use about 8 ounces to 1- 5 Gal bucket of stone dust. I weight the 5 Gal bucket with the stone dust "dry" and came up with 61.5 lbs. I then thought 1/2 that would be 30.75 lbs to 4 ounces. I took that 30+/- lbs and put into an old empty drywall mud bucket ,I then mix the 4 ounces to the half full/empty bucket .I placed the cover of the bucket on tightly then I shake/ rattled and rolled it!!! I then placed the mix were I wanted it and I watered it then tamped/pressed it into place and then went to York! I'll look when I get home today. It rained all day Sunday, good test?

[ttrigg]

Sounds to me like you have the situation solved!  I have given up trying to figure out why the stabilizer does not wash away in rain or sprinkler systems.  I’ve been using it for 4~5 years now and just love it because it is renewable/reusable.  It is 99.9% idiot proof, so long as you keep it away from the points in a turnout.

[smcgill]

It set up nicely, and I'll cont. using it on the rest of the layout! Thanks a lot!! Sean

[Optisailorusa]

How are you ordering it?

[ttrigg]

Go back to the first page of this thread.  There is a 1-800 phone number.  Ask them for a vendor in your area. 

[EMPIRE II LINE]

Optisailorusa

How are you ordering it?

Hi all,

I must first say, Thanks Tom, for the information about these folks and their products.

I have been corresponding with TINA, a representative of this company.

I 've explained to her that it is my desire to try and use either their Stabilizer or maybe the StaLok All Weather product.

I"ve explained to her, that I want to try and use one of their products, to hold in place, a product in this area called "Hardshell", I want to try and use it, as a scale track ballast, it's made from Calcium Carbonate, it's commonly used as "Chicken Grit", to feed chickens, so's the egg shells are harder.

This stuff looks just like mini "G" Scale Ballast Rock, looks just like and is about the size, "G" scale wise, as the ballast used on the real railroad tracks in this area. White in color.

I've tested this stuff for hardiness' in water....have soaked it in a bowl for days...holds up well...also put some on my layout for a time, and it does not seem to really dissolve in the heavy rains either. Looks like it could be dyed to different colors too....have not tried that, as yet though. 

I Will let everyone know later how this venture turns out, and what is maybe suggested as best to use as a stabilizer, to hold it in place.....We're always experimenting.....Right folks !!!!   

 Byron 

[ttrigg]

EMPIRE II LINE

....We're always experimenting.....Right folks !!!!    Byron 

Byron, you are dead on, so long as after (or during) the experiment results, both fair and foul, be shared.  We can all learn for each others success’s and non-success.  I will not use the word fail, as it is a learning process, we learn what works and learn what does not work.

[EMPIRE II LINE]

ttrigg

Byron, you are dead on, so long as after (or during) the experiment results, both fair and foul, be shared.  We can all learn for each others success’s and non-success.  I will not use the word fail, as it is a learning process, we learn what works and learn what does not work.

Will Do, Tom

Now that the hot season is finally starting to break down here, It cooled down a bit just this past evening, It should be real nice to start getting back outside and do some further testing and cleaning of the mainline. I'll try and keep y'all posted as to how this works out.......

Byron 

[ttrigg]

Dave: read this