I saw in one of the old forums a question about cleaning factor brass rail joiners, suggestions ranged all over, most serious being removing the joiner and cleaning the rail and installing new joiners. I found a quick, but not permanent, is squirting the joint with vingar, letting sit and rinsing with water, it will corrode again. Fairly new product out is Flitz spray brass tarnish remover, works very well, follow instructions and rinse well after use, I then spray the joint with WD40 and it lasts quite a while. The advantage is it can be done in place without removing the track from the layout. I live near the ocean in Florida and it corrodes pretty fast here.
You, Sir, may have saved me an opportunity to try out my soldering skills on brass rails! I live in Hawaii, and my road, operating since Janaury, has the same challenges in terms of corrosion. Saving money on rail clamps or aggravation with soldering sounds like a good idea!
Mahalo nui loa!
Eric
Thanks for your suggestions! Just what I was looking for. I will give them a try, as soon as I can find some Flitz spray tarnish remover. Your suggestion may have saved me the work and expense of replacing some turnouts. Thank you again!
As Chocho Willy said, there are a great number of working methods to maitain factory rail joiners. What ever method you elect, solder, rail clamps, cleanser/lube, I still highly recommend rail clamps for all turnout connections. About every 3~5 years you will want to lift out a turnout or two for some repair work or deep cleaning. Rail clamps give you the ability to losen the clamping screws and lift the turnout from the ground without disturbing the adjoining rails. I have one that the chickens and dogs love to "scratch in the dirt" near by and cover the turnout in dirt. I am forced to lift that one out about 3 times every two years for a compressed air cleaning. Rail clamps allow me to lift it out and put it back without disturbing the other rails at all.
Tom Trigg
I agree with Tom an ounce of secure is worth a pound of cure, you'll save money in the long run, I personally recomend the type that bolt straight to the rail rater than the rail joiner as Tom has said being it is so easy to lift out a bad section, or more offen a switch than messing with one with a rail joiner, plus it is just 1 less thing to corrode, ccw
BluPeteTom, your knowledge and experience are great to this forum. Where can someone see your GRR? would love to see what you have put together.
Currently in between layouts. Two years ago my knees and back spoke loudly that my ground level layout was no longer acceptable. I started cinder block retaining walls for a new layout. Since then I broke my hip and had a hart attack. So progress is much slower than I had really wanted. You should be able to find a few pix of the old layout on Photobucket by looking for my name Tom Trigg.
My daughter chastized me into putting some of the better pix on Pinterest.
https://www.pinterest.com/tomtrigg/rosebud-falls-scenic-railway/
Aloha CCW!
As I was researching where to go with my own problems, it occurred to me that having fewer, longer pieces of track would be another alternative, as it would cut down on the number of joints. Some back of the napkin math showed it might be cheaper than rail clamps and, given my soldering skills, better for the plastic ties. In my own case, this would also return to the box-o-tracks all the 1 foot sections I can use later for sidings as we add "purpose" to the Triple O, so this seems like a double win for me.
Before I convert dough into brass rails and plastic ties, however, I wanted to run this theory through those who've been there, done that and, as aside, ask if buying used track off e-Bay at 1/3 the price (including shipping) would be a route to more reliable operations or merely path towards purchasing someone else's problems.
We have no local stores, and we get clobbered by non-CONUS shipping rates, so anyway to save a dime helps!
Thanks in advance for your thoughts!
A few of my "Lessons Learned" (been there, done that)
Buying someone's used rail is a good cost cutting manuver. The only problem with used rail was them getting secure rail connections, the same problem you will have with new or used rail.
Using longer rails cuts down on the number of rail joints needed. I went with 5 foot rails and they did just fine, both in over all cost and ease of placement. To reduce the cost of rail clamps I gave a massive try at soldering the joints. Every time I tried to solder the rails after placement I either melted a bunch of plastic ties or had a severe kink in the soldered joint. Attempts at soldering right out of the package resulted in numerous kinks in the joints. Then SWMBO said "Make a jig." Took a 6 ft long 2x4 to the table saw. Down one edge I cut a slot just wide enough to fit a rail, Then in the middle of the 2x4 I cut out a 3 inch chunk that exposed the rail joint area. Drop in two rails and a factory rail joiner, heat it up with the propane torch, drop in a bit of solder and behold a nice 10 ft rail. Now the use of rail clamps went from every foot to every ten feet, a 90% cost savings. The sectional track was then reused as stub end sidings and the rail yard where power requirements were not so critical.
Tom,
Thanks. That is what I suspected. I also like your trick with the jig. This month, RR money went to washing machine parts, however, so both used tracks and jigs are on hold. Luckily, I had bought concrete for our canyon in advance of the latest appliance to cash in part of its chips!
CCW:
I just wanted to let you know I had the opportunity to use the vinegar as a cleaning agent on my finicky inner loop. Although I forgot to use the WD-40, the vingegar made getting this loop up and running a veritable snap, taking about 10-15 minutes instead of 20 to get things running and constant fiddling to keep things running.
This is my interim solution until the funds allow for some longer lengths of track.
Enjoy your weekend!
All,
6 x 4' lengths of track on order! I'll report on its effects in my journal posted here as "Progress on the Triple ."
Thanks agains for all the help on this frustrating issue! As my daughter said, "Well Dad, that is garden railroading!"
You can still squirt something into the joiner without taking it apart again.
Try the spray white lithium grease... it has a solvent type of carrier so it comes out "watery", will penetrate the joint and then the solvent/carrier evaporates and you have grease to keep the corrosion and oxidation at bay.
The stuff is sold in all hardware stores.
Greg
Visit my site: http://www.elmassian.com - lots of tips on locos, rolling stock and more.
Click here for Greg's web site
Greg,
I picked up some of the white lithium grease today. I shot it into a few testy rail joints as we fired things up. It worked very well! Thanks for the tip!
Aloha,
Folks,
I hope all are enjoying the Holidays!
As mentioned, we've employed many of the tricks listed in this thread to great effect. The 4' track sections helped to isolate a few traditionally "gamey" track joints. These are naturally predominantly on curved sections and near where bridges are going in, so a few rail clamps seem to be in order.
Before I made the order (probably next month), I wanted to revisit a question I'd seen raised elsewhere. Is there really any connectivity improvement between "over the connector" and "direct on the rail" style clamps? As the "Triple O's" track plan is still a bit in flux, I was leaning towards "over the connector" style to preserve flexibility (replacing connectors or getting more clamps is expensive due to shipping). However, if "direct on the rail" will substantially shift the Triple O towards "ready to run at all times," loss of design flexibility is a cost I can bear.
Thanks as always!
The over the joiner clamps have pretty much been proven to be far inferior to removing the existing joiners and adding clamps directly to the rails.
All they do is put pressure on the existing joiner... they only help conductivity that way, and it's very limited.
Also consider if you have joiners with dirt or oxidation. Additional pressure on the joiner will not remove the dirt nor the oxidation. Your issue is still the joiner itself.
Do it right the first time, you will thank me 5 years later! (when everything is still fine, vs removing all the joiners, cleaning and adding clamps)
By all means, clamp the rails NOT the joiners. A clamped joiner still contains dirt and corrosion. Save you joiners if you like, you can always use them in less critical locations. My main loop around the pond was clampped at the get go in 1996. The only maintenance I have had to do is when lifting out the turnouts after they had been buried by the dogs. In 1997/98 SWMBO purchased a small box (24) of over the joiner type that were used for about three years in the main stub end yard until total failure. Here we are approaching 20 years in the ground and the rail clamps are still performing as if they were brand new.
Greg & Tom,
Message recieved loud and clear! Thanks for warning me off a bad purchase!
For what it's worth, I tried soldering some tracks today. I'll be ordering some rail joints the next time it's in the budget! At lest no harm was done in the attempt!
I had a bunch of 1 and 2 foot sections of used track when I needed to add a couple dozen feet of track to a SVGRS member's layout. Not wanting to break his bank with new joiners, I soldered the rails, BUT I didn't melt ties nor remove them. I used a resistance solderer. I cleaned the old joiners or replaced them, used lots of flux, and soldered the rails to the joiners by simply heating up the joint 'til the solder flowed into the joiner and the rails. Worked great, and a two-rail rail bender fan right over the joints to make any size curved we needed.
Using longer lengths is the way to go, here in Australia I go for 6' lengths most of the time. Relatively cheap and less mucking around.
A seller in Bargo (around 700km away) has 12' lengths. I have not purchased any as yet but certainly intend to. Long way to go to collect and shipping could be a female dog. Just need another reason to travel in that direction.
Enjoy your trains
Bernie
GMAU All, Using longer lengths is the way to go, here in Australia I go for 6' lengths most of the time. Relatively cheap and less mucking around. A seller in Bargo (around 700km away) has 12' lengths. I have not purchased any as yet but certainly intend to. Long way to go to collect and shipping could be a female dog. Just need another reason to travel in that direction. Enjoy your trains Bernie
I too have mostly used the 6 foot rails. I thought once about using the 10 foot rails, but the shipping charges on the extra length brought the totals way too high. For the cost plus shipping on 200 foot of 10 foot track I could get 300 foot of the 6 foot track. Made myself a jig (to keep the joints straight) and using the slip on joiners soldered up a bunch of 12 foot rails.
I just discovered the marvels of a torpedo level. Not only did it stop a few derailments, having level track did wonders for connectivity. Rail clamps are in the future, but other budget priorities (stupid mini van!) got in the way.
- Eric
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