Design Ideas Needed

[Anonymous]

I'm in need of some design imput. my property is one acre and extremley flat, with existing watershed problems already. The design Idea in my my mind would be a loop going from the front to the back connected by the side of the house.
The idea in my head is to loop somewhere in the back yard raised up for viewing from back porch and go down the south side across the front and loop around the tree in the front yard on the north end the approximate diameter of the trees canopy 20 ft. The back yard is prone to flooding from rain as stated previously. I thought of incorporating a walkway along planter with gravel 24 inches deep with flagstones for a French drain effect. Keep in mind the moron who built the place did not slope away from the house hardly at all. Grade is 6 to 8 inches below the vinyl siding so the mounding of planting beds is limited.
I also thought of a siding going into the back of the garage next to the porch for easier accessibility of running.

Your thoughts and Ideas are appreciated
My original post included a map drawn with characters which when posted rearaged into jibberish. Sorry Troy

[Anonymous]

You're going to have to do this on your own Matt.Just keep sketching until you find something you are happy with.If you are like me,you'll take it up and relay it anyway.
Troy

[vsmith]

Matt, any chance you can get somone out there to shoot the site for grades? If your having slope and drainage problem it might be athe best place to start. At least you will know what your elevations are.

As many here have stated a raised planter bed is a good idea. Could the raised planter be built just away from the house and sited so that run off will slope away? Otherwise I think your looking at somekind of drain system, french or drain pipe to the street curb?

The problem with french drains is that they are dependant on your soil conditions, are you on sandy, gravely, or dirt, or clay? sandy or gravely soil will drain far beteer than plain dirt and clay wont drain at all. A drywell, a hole dug or drilled several feet down then backfilled with gravel, might be a good way to get rid of water accumulation to but it too is dependant on the soil conditions and also on how high the water table is.

[Anonymous]

Vic, I live in a rural area, there is a drain tile in the ditch out front that I can tap into. I must confess that part of the problem is the lack of gutters on the house,the previous owners deemed them unecessary to have them due to the fact they got clog with leaves[D)]. I have not put them on due to the fact of porch construction and not wanting to redo them when the porches are done. I myself could shoot the grade but I have checked it with my 6'6" level from the house out and if I have 2" I'm lucky. The house to the south of me 45' maybe between us, he sits higher due to the fact that he has a basement and I don't. I due know from my pole barn project that the soil has a lot of clay.

[tangerine-jack]

I have the same problem with flat slope and a fishpond to boot. I filled the area of the railroad to about 2" above the level of the rest of the property (I used the dirt that was excavated during the construction of the fish pond) and that helps tremendously as it gives the normal rainfall somewhere to go. The fishpond will sometimes overflow during our frequent thunderstorms if more than 4" of rain falls, and hurricanes are off the scale, so sometimes the track is flooded anyway. If you look at my post under railroad construction you will get details on how I laid my track. It is because of the low-lying flat area that I overbuild everything 300%. My track will survive even under water for a short time. If I had more enthusiasm I would have built an inner city type of elevated trackage, but I got lazy and wanted trains running as soon as possible.

I had to construct my own walkways (I'm not sure what French drainage is, but I'm sure it will surrender immediately) by digging a 1ft trench and filling with 6" sand base, 4" gravel fill, and topped with flagstone and lava rock backfill for drainage, otherwise it's quite a slog through the yard and those walkways have survived partial immersion intact and stable. It's quite a lot of work, the question is how much are you willing to do with a shovel vs. how much you want to pay for.

As far as how you want to route your track, go nuts! Outdoor track is designed to go anywhere, so be creative
[oX)]

[Anonymous]

tangerine-jack, Thanks for your imput, a French drain is nothing more than a hole backfilled with gravel so the water has somewhere to go.

Thanks Again, I was starting to believe nobody besides Vic had any insight[:)]

[bman36]

Hey Matt,
That sure is a lot to work with! As already mentioned...be creative. Some of the coolest RR's were designed due to "restrictions" or other "challenges" with the yard. The beauty is we are just plain having fun with it! I would start with making sure the water was going where needed first. then build away. Man made lake??? Wooooo....big bridges to boot. Just buggin' ya'. Let us know when you get started. Later eh...Brian.

[kstrong]

Matt,
Your yard sounds very similar to my old yard back east. The one thing you will definitely want to do is raise the railroad a foot or so. You describe a planter, so you may be thinking this already. Depending on the size of the railroad you're planning, this could require an inordinate amount of dirt. I trucked in over 80 yards of dirt for my old pike. If your back yard has drainage issues, this is a must. You'll want to make sure the fill doesn't "trap" the water around it, though. You may need to install a culvert so that the groundwater can pass under the railroad.

The one thing you'll want to keep an eye on is the level of groundwater. If it's high, french drains won't make a darned bit of difference. The groundwater will saturate them, so any surface runoff will just sit on top, and not sink in at all. Also be aware that a high water table will play havoc with any water feature you want to may plan to install.

My current yard is much smaller than what I had back east, but at least it drains! I'll take that over a 1/2 acre of swampland any day. (And the $20,000 basement waterproofing that went with it.)

Later,

K

[Anonymous]

Thanks Brian and Kevin, I can get rid of the water I believe, but I want to be at ground level in the front yard and down the side of the house and then raised in the back yard about a foot and half off the ground As VIc stated I need to shoot my grade and find out where I stand. What's that formula for % of grade on the track,I'd like to not go over 3%?

[bman36]

Hey Matt,
The formula is simple. A 3% grade means a rise of 3" for each 100" in lineal measure. Hope I used that term right. You mentioned raising the RR about a foot to a foot and a half. My recommendation is to raise the whole RR and keep it all flat. Let the ground drop a bit where you want to install a bridge. That way the track is always flat but you have the illusion of rolling hills. This way the train does not have to climb or descend any grades. Unless of course you want it to for real. I built my RR to run as "Set it and forget it" while I work. I like to have trains going while I am outside. Getting VERY close to putting down track here. Just trying to get time in with all my projects. So we'll see how well I did on the grading part myself! Later eh...Brian.

[tangerine-jack]

What are your intentions? Do you have the budget for a few tons of imported dirt and earthmoving machinery, or will you be using an arm-breaker and sweat? If you can afford it, go the route described by kstrong and hire a contractor to do the hard work. If it's not in the budget, then build the railroad anyway to the best of your ability and start running some trains. Prefab outdoor commercial track is super tough and can handle nearly anything thrown at it, including just laying it on the grass with no roadbed or special consideration. A few bouts of severe weather will show you any weakness in design and can be easily repaired or improved on later as time and money permit. It's a little more complicated if you handlay track, but judging from your posts, you may have no choice but to prefab it.

We all have a tendency to overthink a problem to inaction for fear of not "getting it right". I went through the same thought process as you, but in the end I laid out some track in the yard to get the dimensions right, then broke ground and went with it. A garden railroad half evolves during construction anyway as we encounter problems and develop new ideas, so it's best to start with a basic plan and get something going.

Dude, it's a big-boy toy, so quit your goldbricking and get to it trooper![oX)]

[Anonymous]

Brian, Duh[D)] on the grade question, sometimes the brain just shuts down. If I kept it at a constant height for level it would cause mowing problems with the tractor.

Brian and TG, I won't lose sight of the ultimate goal of to be up and running, with my job I've learned to be very patient. I do tend to "over think" things but the ultimate product of this turns out well. Based on grade % I should be able to be 12" to 18" above grade in the back yard and on the ground level in the front yard.
So based on your guy's experience could I drive over ballasted track with the tractor or should I think about setting that portion of track with a footer in concrete?

[tangerine-jack]

I've driven over my track with a riding mower and my motorcycle, not intentionaly mind you, and it survived just fine. If by "tractor" you mean something built by John Deere or International Harvester, then I would say no, that is a bit too much for any track. If you have no choice but to drive over your track, then follow the example of real railroads and construct grade crossings from heavy timber or concrete, a good time to be creative!

I don't know what your soil is like, but here when it rains, the top 3" or so turns to soup, and under that is either clay or sand, sometimes both. In order to build a footer of any kind, I have to dig in at least 2ft to give it something solid to rest on. If I were to build a grade crossing for heavy vehicles, I would build it 2ft depth X 3ft out on both sides, width to be determined by type of vehicle to cross, and set the track in to rail height so it is level. Overbuilt, perhaps, but no harm in that.

So how long will it be before we can see your creation?[oX)]

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by tangerine-jack

I've driven over my track with a riding mower and my motorcycle, not intentionaly mind you, and it survived just fine. If by "tractor" you mean something built by John Deere or International Harvester, then I would say no, that is a bit too much for any track. If you have no choice but to drive over your track, then follow the example of real railroads and construct grade crossings from heavy timber or concrete, a good time to be creative!

I don't know what your soil is like, but here when it rains, the top 3" or so turns to soup, and under that is either clay or sand, sometimes both. In order to build a footer of any kind, I have to dig in at least 2ft to give it something solid to rest on. If I were to build a grade crossing for heavy vehicles, I would build it 2ft depth X 3ft out on both sides, width to be determined by type of vehicle to cross, and set the track in to rail height so it is level. Overbuilt, perhaps, but no harm in that.

So how long will it be before we can see your creation?[oX)]

TJ, I like it!I like it! [:D]The Idea of a grade crossing is great! We are talking garden tractor also, sorry for not being more specific.

[tangerine-jack]

Cool, you could put up crossing gates and warning lights as well. That would be awesome to wait at your own crossing for a train! Since you are talking about a garden tractor, maybe you could use some real RR ties for crossing material, they are usually free if you ask, and are quite indestructible. Cut to length, buried to grade level with the track in a shallow channel should be quite sufficient.

I've got a Chinese bridge that I've been wanting to run a track under for some time, I think now I have the incentive to do it![oX)]

[Anonymous]

TJ, That's a good idea, I would probably cut a dado(notch) down the length of the tie and insert track. Maybe even infill the middle. Due to what I already know about my soil content I'd definetlly put a gravel base around and under the tie for drainage.

[tangerine-jack]

Yeah, a dado. [bow] forgot you were a carpenter[D)] Make sure what you use to infill the track won't get caught in you rolling stock.... Have fun!!!!!!!!![oX)]

[Anonymous]

TJ, Probably, just cut a sliver out of the other side of the tie[;)]