"Serpent" YOU BET!!!

[watergardens]

Hello, Got my new Garden Railways Mag. on Saturday and did't get past page 6 without having a sick feeling!! Mark that is some eye opener!! There can be nothing to gain except to line someones pocket!! If someone had that kind of time they should be helping to find a way to educate and promote the "Family" hobby. Because without us , the "Railroad" ,"Its Logos" and it's past would be long gone and a distance memory. Come to think of it maybe if that is the way they see it , maybe they should pay us everytime we run their "Logo" and take hours to explain their part in history to the young Boy or Girl that is our future and just maybe their not forgotten past!!! Great article Mark
Ron[:(!]

[Anonymous]

For all the hub-bub about UP and it's trade-mark and copywrite scheme it will be interesting to see how much it will actually cost the hobbist. I am much more concerned with the MSRP of our model (toy) trains.

[cacole]

Some manufacturers of HO scale models are already charging $5 more for UP decorated items.

[vsmith]

Go over to the Model Railroader forum and read some of the threads regarding this topic. Boy, there are some modelers that are really angry over this.

[bman36]

Hey all,
Haven't received my copy yet but can't wait to see it. Sounds really interesting. Let you know how I feel when I see it. Later eh...Brian.

[Anonymous]

I haven't followed this completely. Is the UP patent on their logo only, or does paint scheme count? Meaning - could manufacturers get around having to pay royalties if they paint , for example, a Dash 9 is gray and yellow, but apply no logo or name on the side of the engine?

[Anonymous]

Well, I personally would like to know exactly why the UP is doing this suddenly. I thought I had heard that they had great revenuse and profits this last quarter and that they were doing quite well. I don't see how they think that forcing the model railroad companies to pay extra for their stuff if going to benefit them. Personally, I think it would be great to just boycot the UP models temporarily until they realize how stupid they are being, but that would not be good for the manufacturers or retailers of the products and could cause them financial harm. What upsets me most is that they also want to control the railroads they have aquired. The UP absorbed so many railraods over time that a good deal of the models being produced would fall into that category. If the UP wants to force their fans to pay more, that their porogative, but they should not hurt the rest of the industry and make our models cost more.

[Anonymous]

Lets face facts, when corporate America smells money they don't care who gets hurt as long as it puts cash in their pockets. We all need to remember that railroads are run by buisness types now days and not railroad people.
The railroads past probably means little or nothing to these people unless they see a way to make a buck, hence licensing fees, the higher the better as far as they are concerend.

Stock holders are also driven by money and want as much cash as they can grab.
You and I and model railroad manufacturers are just another easy target for their insatiable greed.

If a thing like this takes off other railroads could do the same thing as U.P. and so could locomotive manufacturers, auto companys, trucking companys etc. Anything used by hobbyists be they model railroaders, model ship builders, car modelers etc. etc. could be affected by such insensitive money harvesting.

We as model railroaders have only three choices: we can pay U.P.s ransom, or we can model a railroad not under U.P.s control or we can freelance our railroads. And don't forget, U.P. also owns the rights to some narrow gauge railroads of the distant past.

It seems to me that most garden railroaders do NOT model any certain railroad and could quite easily stop buying anything having to do with U.P. The real problems will be in the small scales where a lot of people DO model a given prototype.

This whole thing could backfire in U.P.s face the way it did when Chevrolet walked into a N.M.R.A. national convention and demanded that all sales of unlicensed Chevrolet models stop at once. The way I understand things people all over the country stopped buying Chevrolets in protest, costing General Motors far more money than they would have gotten from any royalties.

If you own any stock in the U.P. write a letter telling them how you feel about this.
Even if you don't have stock, write a letter anyway.

OLD DAD

[cacole]

United Parcel Service (UPS) has had a similar policy for many years, and refuses to allow any model maker to use their logo. Why? Who knows?

The most ridiculous thing about the UP is that they want to charge a licensing fee for the use of any and all logos of roads that have been bought or merged into their predecessors over the years, such as Central Pacific (the original name of the SP), Western Pacific, Southern Pacific, Rio Grande, Saint Louis, South Western (Cotton Belt), etc. etc.

One novel way around the UPS logo prohibition I encountered is in HO scale. A Chinese manufacturer is making trucks that look just like UPS delivery vans, but the lettering is "USP" instead of UPS, and does not use the background shield. Another attempt to circumvent the law in this regard is to sell the models undecorated, and provide decals separately for the modeler to apply. Whether this is really legal is questionable, and will probably be done only until UPS finds out what is going on and files suit against them. But since they are Chinese companies, can UPS really do anything about it?

[vsmith]

Hmmmm...Onion Pacific has a nice ring to it!

[grandpopswalt]

Gentlemen,

I like the suggestion of supplying decals seperately for the individual modeler to apply after purchase. The only problem is, as the writer suggested, that the supplier can still be held liable for copyright infringement. However, I think an individual can make use of copywrited material for HIS OWN USE (not for profit). So how about something like this then ........ include a list of internet sites, magazine articles, promotional material, etc where the UP logo appears as well as blank decal stock suitable for printing on an inkjet printer. Most people have the resources to then get the necessary artwork onto their computer (or have a friend do it for them) . Then it's a simple matter to print all the decals you need and Viola, you have all the UP locos and cars you want (if you STILL want to model the UP).

Sure sounds like a lot of work to get around paying a token fee to the bad guys, but it's the princple of the thing. Remember that these folks are outsourcing jobs, downsizing, globalizing, and squeezing anywhere they can to add to the bottom line, so I think it's O.K. for us to squeeze back a little.

Walt

[Anonymous]

T saw changes in the next GR issue after the Union Pacific was put in to the lime light.

Aristo was charging more for UP items.


Nicholas

[Anonymous]

Gentlemen; Why don't you be like my old boss, he was an American, originally from LA but lived near Redwood City where the headquarters was. He would not wear any logo's on his "T" shirts etc unless they paid him to advertise their products. I thought this was bit odd at the time but the older i get the more i am sure he was correct.

Why do these people a favour by providing free advertising, this is just another way of feeding the corporate world (not just corporate America); be a man stand up and tell them to get stuffed and don't advertise any known brand or trade name unless they pay you to so do; like me.

Regards ian.

PS about censorship and what i have been saying about different words having different meanings in different countries here in Australia "getting stuffed" is quite a rude saying.