I am fairly new to MTH G gauge so if any O gauge guys know whats going on help me out. A MTH rep helped me solve some problems. I learned that the mth dcs signal fades over too long of wire or incorrect wiring practice and too long of a mainline. I divided the main into about 70' sections and have just a single pair lead of wire to the middle of the section. I bridge the two channels of the track TIU together to run from a single transformer. I also connect an 18 volt bulb across the tiu terminals to clean up the signal. This cleared up constant "check track" messages and helps to obtain the strongest track signal quality. You can jump nearby sections so not to have to drive extra feed wires.
I also found a way to locate engines that won't activate on dcs search. tip the engine and return to track with the power on. this will cause startup sequence and then helps dcs to locate train when an engine search is performed. Tip it twice and the engine goes to full throttle so be carefull. The engine must be pointed in the correct direction so the positive wire goes to the left wheels of the engine.
the dcs system might lock up if it gets a bad command that can't be performed (like driving "all engines" after you removed one from the track). so be patient and think it through. It's really a great system with a lot going on
original letter to GR:
I was intrigued the of the features of MTH G gauge equipment so I purchased their engines, cars, and control system. I run them on Aristocraft stainless track. I started with a room size oval to test these features and right away ran into some issues. When I tried to load the engines into their dcs system I got messages that "no mth engines were on the track". I found that by tilting the engine and returning it quickly to the track the engine would automatically start up. This sometimes seemed to help the dcs control to locate the engine and load it. Sometimes I would repeatedly tip the engine and after two or more times the engines not only start but go to full throttle ( fun but scary) and this would also help the dcs locate the engine. So all this just to start.
Jumping ahead to the biggest issue next was when the mainline was done and connected, the whole system locked up or gave a lot of messages like "check track". I rewired everything so many times I am almost now bald from frustration. An MTH factory rep finally help me solve this dilemma before I scrapped everything. He said to start by connecting an 18 volt bulb across the tiu channels to clean up any track noise confusing the system, no luck. I found that I could not connect more than about 70' of track before the whole system would stop communicating. When backing up a $1000.00 engine plus cars 3' off the ground and losing control I got a lot of exercise catching or unplugging ( very, very scary!!!!)
MTH told me to divide the layout in half and bridge the two channels together on the tiu with a pair of jumpers on the input and that would double the amount of track I could connect. I was told to connected the track in only two spots, not like dcc buss wiring with several jumpers. Finally the mainline outer loop jumped into action with only a few dead spots by switches. Now I connected the divided inner loop and sidings to the closest section with short jumpers.
The factory rep said MTH was going to investigate this on their own but still no answer. They did call me back to see what else I have found to help.
MTH DCS is easy to use and yet very complex issues make it unforgiving. I have learned what makes the system lock up and it's usually my mistake that the system gets confused over ( like running the "all engines" command but not having them all on the track). I really like the features and I am glad I did not give up. I also run regular dcc engines and run into issues with them so I am becoming a problem solver and leave my hair out of it..
enginear - Thank you for the suggestions. I have about $2,500 invested in MTH "G" gauge products and your note inspires me to wait until Spring and give it one more shot before dumping the whole kit into the trash.
There are many good features with MTH but reliability certainly isn't one of them. As I think I mentioned previously, I was (and still am) concerned about LGB in the future and was looking for alternatives. Having previously tried Aristocraft and Bachmann I have found no substitute for the reliability of LGB.
My layout is basically "complete" and I am not an operations freak. I just like to run my trains when I turn on the throttle.
I found the original rail joiners are fine as long as the track is secured so they don't come loose. I am indoors though and still use lgb conductive grease on most joints. I use clamp style joiners where ever I have a cut piece of track. I tried them on whole sections but did not get a big improvement.The wire and connection was a bigger problem for the signal and must be the best you can get. I use 12 gauge low voltage or speaker cable and am learning that crimp connectors may have to be soldered. some of the connections must have been weak.
I connect the lightbulbs right at each output of the TIU. hope this helps
Hi,
this is my first post on this forum just wanted to say hi to all.
i run many locos from aristo and usa that were converted to dcs by ray manley he does a great job with dcs and if you go to his web page all your questions can be answered from his site. all he plays with is dcs and he has a lot of info there, hope this helps you guys i love dcs never had an issue so far, give rays site a try, he also posts on mls here is his site http://www.rayman4449.dynip.com/
Nick..
You are welcome, anything i can do to help others, god knows there have been plenty that have helped me including Ray...
Nick
Check this out, this is my pacific right after ray did the DCS install running on full DCS, i like DCS sound because with an after market speaker installed in loco, in my opion there is no better sound system on the market that even comes close and i have them all including the new QSI witch is 2nd in the sounds good to me market. take a look at this video... oops it would not let me post a link so you will need to go to M.L.S. under public reviews, to date nov 26th 2007 its in the archives but its still there i think you steam fans will like this video, please let me know what you think...
I just came across some more info in an "o" gauge forum that might explain why I did not get results from connecting just any bulb:
As we all know, wiring a bulb across the output of the TIU (or alternatively, across the input to a barrier strip) can significantly enhance a DCS signal. I became curious as to what would be the best bulb to use. So I ran a series of tests looking at the DCS signal for a variety of bulbs. The test set up is as follows:Layout, 2 rail DCS, with the TMCC signal activeLocos are two Atlas RSD-7s, running in a lashup. Both have been converted to DCS15 scale mph speed3 minute lap timeTrain goes through eight blocks, which are distributed to two TIU channelsEach channel powered by a Lionel ZW running at 18 V nominalThe bulbs are located at the input to the barrier stripThe same type of bulb is used in each channelI confined the tests to bulbs that have a standard bayonet base to make them compatible with my systemI recorded the track signal every time a new one appeared on the hand held. I recorded all the error messages as a zero. Typically I took 130 -150 readings in one circuit. I averaged the readings and calculated the standard deviation to get some idea of how much the signal varied. Results are: Bulb Type: NoneTrack Signal Average 1.5Standard Deviation +/- .86Bulb Type: 1445 (14.4 V, .13 Amps, 2000 hours)Track Signal Average 5.70Standard Deviation +/- 1.73Bulb Type: 363 (14 V, 0.20 Amps, 250 hours)Track Signal Average 7.49Standard Deviation +/- 1.70Bulb Type: 1893 (14 V, 0.33 Amps, 7500 hours)Track Signal 7.94Standard Deviation +/- 1.35Bulb Type: 1826 (18 V, .15 Amps, 250 hours)Track Signal Average 4.69Standard Deviation +/- 1.96Bulb Type: 1818 (24 V, .17 Amps, 250 hours)Track Signal Average 4.59Standard Deviation +/- 1.19
Obviously any bulbs helps. I would have really liked the 1818 Bulb to be good, because that is a 24 V bulb and hence would last longer running on my 18 V. But as you can see I got not only the highest track signal, but also the lowest relative standard deviation with the1893 bulb.Incidentally, you can get all these bulbs from www.interlight.biz Just plug in the bulb number in the search box in the upper left hand corner
I'm getting some email now from the letter in GR for DCS problems and need to tell people to use the search feature and type in MTH control issues.
I now use only one channel of the TIU for 150' double mainline ( 300 ') plus sidings on one ac 180 watt transformer. I have simplified the wiring to just a couple of connections and divided the ovals into 75' sections. I had to modify the antennas to get rid of "out of rf range" error messages caused by interference in the basement. I also downloaded DCS version 4 into both tiu and remote. You get way faster response between units and new features for free!
I use Aristocraft stainless track.
The bulbs #1818 are connected at the tiu output. I also connected bulb #1873 at the track. I now have perfect control signal strength and the system doesn't lock up or delay waiting for engine response to commands. I can run the four engines I own (in any lashup or single) at once with no problems!
I have to credit most of these fixes were from raymond's website posted above!!!!!
I am learning more each day about the DCS system. Now that the system communicates easily there are no more system freeze-ups. I think the system originally wasn't sure which engines were on the track. Now with the correct bulbs the system operates perfectly. There may have been two different software versions in the remote and TIU because they were purchased seperately. I down loaded upgraded versions first 3._ and now 4.0 for free. With a antenna modifications I can now go anywhere and the remote does not lose communication with the base. The dash 8s are now aproaching four years old with no problems at all! I think they sound the best that I've heard on the market. The sound and smoke in the challenger is amazing! I got some emails from users and have to say to them and all that I still believe this is the way to go. I still plan to add to the engine roster and will stay with DCS!!!
In case others are looking for this video of nick's engine above I found it on raymond's website ( also posted above) under MTH DCS install services about 2/3 of the way down. Ray also shows several other engines converted to DCS.
also DMUinCT posted an install in a Aristo RS3 and pictures under General discussion, Need your thoughts.....LGB?MTH!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHkYNYfxtqA
youtube video of my sd-70s at the show last month under DCS control...
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this web site is very strange, i wonder why it won't let a direct link to youtube video... cut and paste the link into your browser and it will take you there....
The MTH website is www.mth-railking.com from there you can access the protosound2 site at the bottom right of the page ( the protosound2 emblem) www.protosound2.com . On this page are several instructions and the downloads including DCS version 4.01. These are all free, you just add them to a shopping cart and furnish some info. I believe you might have to download each separately.
After you download a newer DCS version and install you must do a factory reset of the remote and tiu to complete the changes! Joe P.
Okay theres another problem I discovered. If you are going to add engines to DCS version 4.01 be careful. Some people are having no trouble. It appears you need a strong battery charge first. The remote program seems to have some of the same bugs in the Legacy?
I got my challenger back online with a factory control board repair and tried to add it. The board was sent back because I fried the speaker amp. The remote found engine but had no response to commands. I took the remote out of speed mode which you should do first and readded engine still nothing (menu/ system/ operating mode/ normal). Because of the new board install I tore apart the engine inbetween all these resets. Then I read about someone else going through the same and he reset the remote to get it to accept the new engine. Then you have to add all your engines all over. The engine will be found and then will respond to commands.
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